What's in a frame? - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep CJ Forum > What's in a frame?

BLACK FRIDAY SPECIALS!! You asked, we deliver!FS: Wrangler RGB Multicolor Fog Light LEDs: Awesome EffectRockridge 4WD IS Taking Zone Offroad Suspension Lift Kits

Reply
Unread 04-02-2013, 11:27 PM   #1
the shootist
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 69
What's in a frame?

So this question is for those folks who have an irrational attachment to a specific Jeep. Long story short, 13 years ago my grandpa bought me my CJ when I was 16. After years of abuse and a lot of fun, it is time to rebuild the whole thing, to do it right, and to do it the way I always wanted it.

I recently purchased a YJ tub for it that is in excellent shape. For a bit extra, I was able to get a YJ frame that is also excellent shape, no rust, all mounts good, and it has already been painted. It is also sitting on Dana 44's. Beyond that, I am well aware of all of the ways that the YJ frame is simply better and stronger than the CJ frame. It would be a great upgrade.

But here is the rub: every time I think about switching everything over to the YJ frame, and scrapping the old CJ frame, I get this really terrible feeling, like if I do that, it wont be my CJ any more. This to me seems highly irrational, as I will still have quite a few of my CJ parts (especially grill, hood, fender, and dash). But I just don't know. I plan on keeping this thing the rest of my life, but I am worried that using the YJ frame will always bug me. I have been through a lot with this Jeep, it was a gift from my grandfather; it is certainly my most prized and sentimental possession. I know the frame is not the heart or essence of my CJ, but it is certainly a fundamental part of it, I guess you might say it's skeleton. Not using that frame just feels, well, wrong.

So on the one hand, I want to build the best Jeep possible, on the other, the idea of not using the original frame is driving me nuts.

So what should I do? Go with sentiment or function and strength? Any thoughts you all might have would be appreciated.

And just so you know, my CJ frame is in OK shape. The rear crossmember is rusted, as are some of the tops of the body mounts, so I would have to fix those things, as well as clean and paint it, all if which is not that big of a deal

the shootist is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-02-2013, 11:36 PM   #2
kappa505
Registered User
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Las Cruces, New Mexico
Posts: 459
Build them both
__________________
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race." Supposedly President Coolidge
kappa505 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-02-2013, 11:57 PM   #3
82JeepCJ7
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 4,977
Plus, the YJ front diff is on the wrong side.
__________________
Beat it to fit, paint it to match!

Wheel, Wrench, Repeat.
82JeepCJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 12:00 AM   #4
AKjeff
Registered User
1974 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Carson Valley
Posts: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by kappa505 View Post
Build them both
You read my mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 82JeepCJ7 View Post
Plus, the YJ front diff is on the wrong side.
Can't argue with this one.
AKjeff is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 12:34 AM   #5
only in a jeep cj
Registered User
1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Mobile, Alabama
Posts: 4,208
Ive built several CJs and used YJ tubs on a few of them. Ill be straight up with you, a YJ tub converted to CJ specs (defrost/tailgate/etc) and placed on a CJ frame using CJ running gear and a CJ dash, etc....IS still a CJ. When you use a YJ frame with all its differences, you end up using OTHER NON CJ items such as axles, gas tank, springs, etc, etc, and some people (maybe not you) find it easy to just leave the YJ dash, tailgate, etc and what you end up with is a YJ with a CJ front clip.......not a CJ......in the end it REALLY is up to you and you need to be happy with it. Yes the YJ frame is slightly stronger, but unless your jumping your Jeep, it IS NOT a good enough "pro" by itself to justify it. Your questioning it now, so let that be your guide.
__________________
Ed

1975 CJ-6 304 T15 Dana20 30/44 3.73
1983 CJ-8 258 T5 300 30/44 3.31 Looking for full or half hardtop buy or trade
1986 CJ-7 Laredo 4.6 stroker T5 300 30/44 3.31
1986 TJ-7 Trail Jeep project in the works
2003 Inca Gold TJ Rubicon
only in a jeep cj is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 08:03 AM   #6
hutch1200
Web Wheeler
 
hutch1200's Avatar
1979 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: , Pa
Posts: 2,758
IMHO.....I think G-Pa would want to see the wind in your hair, and a smile on yer face. PERIOD!
He'd be proud to see you keeping his gift to you alive.
But good luck whichever way you go.
__________________
The only "FINISHED CJ" is the stripped one in a junkyard w/a bent frame.
hutch1200 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 08:25 AM   #7
thompsoj22
Registered User
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: ridgecrest, ca
Posts: 320
restore the cj first

everything youll go through to build from the frame up using the yj parts is a duplicate of what your grandpa's gift is asking of you now. take the cj down to the frame and "make yourself proud" using your skill/ability to bring the jeep back to the condition you would be happy with and your grandpa would want to have the first ride in. none of us know much about the after life and maybe he will be sitting in the passenger's seat and youll get that feeling he is there!. then slowly build the yj project as time/money allows.
thompsoj22 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 10:20 AM   #8
brownbagg
Registered User
1930 MK Compass 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: pearl, la
Posts: 2,458
I have three jeep and more like three projects, that a lot of money to build three vehicle, so put all the parts in one bin and pick the best part no matter what it is. I would use a yj frame in a heart beat if it was better shape. just remember about the vin numbers. if you use all yj parts you going have to use a yj title too. at least with a cj frame you can keep your cj vin
brownbagg is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 11:21 AM   #9
CSP
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Colorado
Posts: 12,611
The only difficulty might be in mounting the CJ front axle under the wider YJ frame rails. I don't see where the OP has anything other than a YJ frame and tub, so everything else sounds like it will be coming from the CJ.
CSP is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 12:06 PM   #10
Renegade82
Web Wheeler
 
Renegade82's Avatar
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Lewistown, PA
Posts: 3,801
Quote:
Originally Posted by only in a jeep cj View Post
Ive built several CJs and used YJ tubs on a few of them. Ill be straight up with you, a YJ tub converted to CJ specs (defrost/tailgate/etc) and placed on a CJ frame using CJ running gear and a CJ dash, etc....IS still a CJ. When you use a YJ frame with all its differences, you end up using OTHER NON CJ items such as axles, gas tank, springs, etc, etc, and some people (maybe not you) find it easy to just leave the YJ dash, tailgate, etc and what you end up with is a YJ with a CJ front clip.......not a CJ......in the end it REALLY is up to you and you need to be happy with it. Yes the YJ frame is slightly stronger, but unless your jumping your Jeep, it IS NOT a good enough "pro" by itself to justify it. Your questioning it now, so let that be your guide.
^^^
You'll end up with a wrangler with some Jeep parts added. Mod the wrangler tub to match a Jeep tub, repair and protect the Jeep frame, and put the Jeep parts back on it. Once a Jeep...... still a Jeep. forever!
__________________
The end of a defining era.... JEEP R.I.P. 1941-1986
My frame off Re-Build: (still in progress....)
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/30...e-off-1280850/
Renegade82 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 12:32 PM   #11
Crazyredneck87
Registered User
1984 CJ8 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 42
My honest opinion is this. Build that CJ up make it shine make it look like it did the day it rolled off the Assembly line. That will give the most pride and your Grandpa will be smiling down on you as you do the work yourself and even be more proud of you as you finish it and bring it back to the days of glory that those Jeeps showed. Its a true classic and should remain as such a classic not a make shift Wrangler Wannabe (yes may be a bit offesensive to some that own YJs and newer but to me CJs were the real jeeps)
Crazyredneck87 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 01:40 PM   #12
Jim1611
Web Wheeler
 
Jim1611's Avatar
1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,705
Converting the YJ tub to the CJ frams is easy enough so that should not deter you from using the CJ frame if you like. The debate over the YJ frame being better than the CJ has been going on since the YJ was built. I've talked to guys that have wheeled the CJ frame harder than most of us ever will and they held up. To me you don't need a YJ frame to have a great rig. One thing about the YJ that is far less than the CJ is the aluminum case 231 transfer case they run. Compared to the Dana 300 the CJ has the YJ case falls short. It can be upgraded but so can the 300 and the 300 is still superior. YJ axles verses CJ there is little difference except that the older CJ axles had selectable hubs where the YJ is activated inside the axle housing by vacuum and like many things operated this way it can be a problem. To me the lockout hubs of the CJ win out big time.

So there's that. What do you like? If that CJ frame is still good I'd use it. If not I'd buy an aftermarket frame that is better than any stock frame.
Jim1611 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 01:51 PM   #13
CSP
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Colorado
Posts: 12,611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim1611 View Post
One thing about the YJ that is far less than the CJ is the aluminum case 231 transfer case they run. Compared to the Dana 300 the CJ has the YJ case falls short. It can be upgraded but so can the 300 and the 300 is still superior. YJ axles verses CJ there is little difference except that the older CJ axles had selectable hubs where the YJ is activated inside the axle housing by vacuum and like many things operated this way it can be a problem. To me the lockout hubs of the CJ win out big time.
Why compare these things? The OP isn't using an entire YJ and attempting to make it a CJ. He has a YJ tub and frame.
CSP is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 02:28 PM   #14
Jim1611
Web Wheeler
 
Jim1611's Avatar
1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,705
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSP View Post
Why compare these things? The OP isn't using an entire YJ and attempting to make it a CJ. He has a YJ tub and frame.
He did pose that question in a way. He also has the dana 44 axles that came with the YJ frame, good axles but he'd need to the 231 to use them unless he converts the dana 300 to a driver side drop. With that in mind I felt it relevant to compare them.
Jim1611 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 04-03-2013, 03:37 PM   #15
CSP
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Colorado
Posts: 12,611
Whoops, I missed the part about the D44s.
CSP is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the JeepForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.
Note: All free e-mails have been banned due to mis-use. (Yahoo, Gmail, Hotmail, etc.)
Don't have a non-free e-mail address? Click here for a solution: Manual Account Creation
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Thread Tools






Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.