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Unread 02-27-2015, 03:21 PM   #1
JeepdaddyRC
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T-176 guts w/pics

First time dropping tranny, thank you Jeep Forum! Symptoms: difficult shift between 1st and 2nd. Can't shift down from 3rd to 2nd (without double clutching). Read the FSM and threads. But, I need more experienced eyes. Here are the splines.

img_0392-640x480-.jpg

img_0393-640x480-.jpg

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Unread 02-27-2015, 03:24 PM   #2
JeepdaddyRC
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Here are the forks:
img_0389-640x480-.jpg

img_0388-640x480-.jpg

img_0387-640x480-640x480-.jpg

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Unread 02-27-2015, 03:29 PM   #3
JeepdaddyRC
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Here are the guts (gears):
img_0384-640x480-640x480-.jpg

img_0390-640x480-.jpg

img_0396-640x480-.jpg

img_0397-640x480-.jpg

img_0398-640x480-.jpg

img_0394-640x480-.jpg

img_0391-640x480-.jpg

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Unread 02-27-2015, 03:36 PM   #4
JeepdaddyRC
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To my untrained eye, no gears are broken and the brass synchro rings looked pretty good (similar to the ones in the Novak kit). Expected broken or worn teeth and worn rings. Surprised to see some rust and paint in there. Pics are not ideal, but all I could do with a phone. Let me know if you want other photos. I would really appreciate your feedback.
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Unread 02-27-2015, 03:59 PM   #5
keith460
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The brass syncros or clocking rings, may look good on the outside but you need to inspect there condition on the inside of those rings. There are small rings or threads on the inside diameter that lets the clocking rings grab the gear tapered hub so the next gear you shift to, whether it be and up shift or a down shift, can engage.

Further inspection is needed, which entails disassembling the transmission gears themselves.

The video in this thread explains how they work : http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/fi...l#post27880153
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Restoration Thread:http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=434226
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Unread 02-27-2015, 06:50 PM   #6
JeepdaddyRC
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Thank you Keith. Great educational video about synchros. This is the first time I've looked inside a transmission, let alone attempted a rebuild. Fixing this Jeep up for my son to drive. Would never attempt a rebuild without this great forum. Additional concerns from the photos? Is it normal to see rust in there?
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Unread 02-28-2015, 08:32 AM   #7
keith460
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If a vehicle sits long enough without being driven, you will get surface rust on the internal parts. Moisture from condensation collects and starts the rust process.

You really can't give an assessment of a transmission internal components without breaking it down to have a look. From what I see, it looks like normal wear-and-tear.

Since the transmission is already out, take it apart and see if it needs replacement parts like seals and bearings. Get yourself a manual on that particular transmission and have at it. They are not that difficult to repair/refurbish. I did my first manual trans repair on a Cub Cadet lawn tractor at the age of 12 with help from my Dad and moved on up to Chevy Muncie, Toyota and Jeep manual transmissions. Easy if you know how they are suppose to work and repair to factory specs and tolerances.

Disassemble and keep it organized:







The transmission above was taken apart and cleaned. New bearings, seals and syncros installed from a rebuild kit acquired from Quadratec.com
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Restoration Thread:http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=434226
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Unread 02-28-2015, 04:10 PM   #8
JeepdaddyRC
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Just purchased the rebuild kit from Novak. I now have the FSM, Novak instructions and the numerous great threads on this forum. Looked daunting at first, but I'm looking forward to it. I realize this is routine for the many veterans out there - but new to me. Thanks in advance for you patience... I'll certainly have further questions.
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Unread 02-28-2015, 07:08 PM   #9
shadoow
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when you get your Novak kit make sure you have all the parts. Mine had duplicates of some parts & none of others. Just a couple/few in either case. Novak promptly sent me a new complete parts bag that included the missing parts as well as others.
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Unread 03-02-2015, 12:23 PM   #10
wm69
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Tag to watch your detailed and picture laden rebuild thread....
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85 CJ7 258, borla header, Team Rush, MC2100 ,optima batt, Warn 8274, agr super box 2 & pump, T5 w/ B&M shifter, centerforce 2, superior 1 piece axles, warn hubs 2.5 in lift, 31" BFG MT

85 CJ7 258, A/C, T176, MC2100, Team Rush, Warn XD8000i, superwinch hubs, 3in lift 31" BFG AT/KO
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Unread 03-02-2015, 07:14 PM   #11
JeepdaddyRC
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Will keep you updated on my first rebuild. For those that have not seen these great photos (better than mine!) check out the pic heavy rebuild thread below. I will use this to carefully disassemble my first transmission. I find photos really help me because I don't know the terminology. Using the thread below, the text from the FSM, and the help of this forum, I am actually looking forward to this new challenge.
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=136257
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Unread 03-03-2015, 05:08 AM   #12
walkerhoundvm
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I can't remember where in the rebuild it was - but I don't think it was in that ifsja thread... Anyways, there's a washer somewhere in the middle of the assembly that the T176 repair PDF says needs to be placed on in the right direction, smooth side back or something? I don't know how important that is, but I didn't pay attention to it and I have a little trouble down shifting sometimes. I went with Penzoil Synchromesh for lube and it seems to help, but every once in a while I can't get from 3rd into 2nd or 2nd into first until I come to a complete stop.
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Unread 03-03-2015, 06:33 AM   #13
Ken4444
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Keith - Thanks for pointing out the video. It's pretty well done and the guy provides a great explanation of the synchronizer part of the transmission. Here's the link in case anyone missed in:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXsRfbOiBhE
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Unread 03-03-2015, 08:31 AM   #14
JeepdaddyRC
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Walkerhoundvm, that was exactly my problem. Have to stop to downshift. Was told the blocking rings (syncho rings) are worn. I also tried Penzoil Synchromesh. May have helped the 1st to 2nd upshift slightly, but not the downshifts. Based on forum input and a transmission "expert", best option is to disassemble and rebuild. The video was very helpful. As an untrained newbie I was looking at the "external teeth" on the brass rings. The real problem may be wear on the cone which is hidden. Any photos, sugestions, good threads, helpful advice are all welcome!
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