Swapping trac-lock for open differential AMC 20 ?? - JeepForum.com
 5Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 11:20 AM Thread Starter
Hoover7
Junior Member
 
Hoover7's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Livingston
Posts: 67
Swapping trac-lock for open differential AMC 20 ??

Hi everyone, I have a 1982 AMC 20 with the dreaded DD stamp on the axle boss (2.73 w/ Trac-Lock), and looking to install a more favorable gear set. I have access to a used 3.54 ring and pinion set, along with the appropriate carrier. However, the replacement carrier is for an OPEN differential. Are there any issues that would prevent replacing the trac-lock diff with an open differential?

Although this has probably been addressed in another thread, I haven't had any luck finding an answer. Thanks for your help!

Hoover


-----------------------------------------------------------------------
82 CJ7 Laredo Ltd, 258, T5, frame off resto/rebuild in progress
83 CJ8 Scrambler, 258, T176, Cliffordized, cam and headers
84 CJ7 Renegade, 258, T5, Weber 38, Borla headers
Hoover7 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 11:27 AM
80cj
Web Wheeler
 
80cj's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,853
It would swap in. Get a installation kit from some place like Randy's Ring and Pinion. What about the front?
STJP likes this.
80cj is online now  
post #3 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 11:50 AM
LumpyGrits
Registered User
1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: The Mojave Desert - Palmdale, Ca. U.S.A.
Posts: 6,702
Cj

Trac-loc is almost an open diff.
Do the swap and put a lock right in.
Hope you're going with 1 piece axles.
LG
80cj likes this.

Have'n you along, is like loose'n 2 good men
LumpyGrits is offline  
 
post #4 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 12:16 PM
80cj
Web Wheeler
 
80cj's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by LumpyGrits View Post
Trac-loc is almost an open diff.
Do the swap and put a lock right in.
Hope you're going with 1 piece axles.
LG
Trac Lok is an open diff with clutches.
80cj is online now  
post #5 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 01:45 PM
JoonHoss
Registered User
2011 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Washington State
Posts: 7,603
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80cj View Post
Trac Lok is an open diff with clutches.
...That are usually worn out, and have non-correct/absent friction modifier in the fluid, which basically leaves you with and open diff.

Hoss
John Strenk likes this.

"Gimme three gallons of low lead; two hot dogs and a strawberry soda..."JGW
JoonHoss is online now  
post #6 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 02:32 PM
John Strenk
Moderator
 
John Strenk's Avatar
1976 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Shalersville Ohio
Posts: 16,739
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoonHoss View Post
...That are usually worn out, and have non-correct/absent friction modifier in the fluid, which basically leaves you with and open diff.

Hoss
That is what happened to mine.

Put in the friction modifier which caused the track lock to start working so well that it spun the hub on the passenger side.....

Go figure.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
John Strenk is offline  
post #7 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 06:02 PM Thread Starter
Hoover7
Junior Member
 
Hoover7's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Livingston
Posts: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80cj View Post
It would swap in. Get a installation kit from some place like Randy's Ring and Pinion. What about the front?
Appreciate the quick reply, 80cj. My primary concern was potential differences between the trac-lock and open differential housing. I'm really glad to know I can install the open diff for the TL without added difficulty. Thanks also for turning me on to 'Randy's ring and Pinion'. I'll be in the market for new front and rear bearing sets/shims when this project comes together. And to answer your question, I'll be replacing the D30's gear set with a matching 3.54 ring and pinion with an appropriate carrier as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LumpyGrits View Post
Trac-loc is almost an open diff.
Do the swap and put a lock right in.
Hope you're going with 1 piece axles.
LG
I agree with you LG! I just replaced a spun 2-piece axle on my 84 with a pair of Mosers, and so far so good. However, will likely run the original axles on this 82 until they quit on me. That is of course, unless I win the powerball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Strenk View Post

Put in the friction modifier which caused the track lock to start working so well that it spun the hub on the passenger side.....

Go figure.
Unfortunately, John, this 82 hasn't rolled on it's own since Sept 2000. I was T-boned by a tipsy coed in Baton Rouge and subsequently flipped and ejected. I was very fortunate, and walked away. Odometer read 63K, and those were easy miles. As such, I'm betting the TL differential and clutch discs are in pretty good shape. If anyone's looking for a matched set (D30 & AMC20) of 2.73's with a TL rear, I'll be happy to oblige once I've finished the swap!

Thanks for the input and quick answers, guys!

Hoover

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
82 CJ7 Laredo Ltd, 258, T5, frame off resto/rebuild in progress
83 CJ8 Scrambler, 258, T176, Cliffordized, cam and headers
84 CJ7 Renegade, 258, T5, Weber 38, Borla headers
Hoover7 is online now  
post #8 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 06:19 PM
80cj
Web Wheeler
 
80cj's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,853
I believe the carrier break for a Dana 30 axle is 3,73 and up and 3.54 and down. So I think you're set as far as the front carrier is concerned.
80cj is online now  
post #9 of 16 Old 08-22-2017, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
Hoover7
Junior Member
 
Hoover7's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Livingston
Posts: 67
Thanks, 80cj, that's the same information I've come across as well. I appreciate the verification!! The front and rear 3.54's I'm looking to pick up are still attached to the carriers, and are on the table for $100. Although I'd be more interested in going to a 3.73, I just can't argue the price! And I won't be running anything bigger than a 31 inch tire for the foreseeable future...

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
82 CJ7 Laredo Ltd, 258, T5, frame off resto/rebuild in progress
83 CJ8 Scrambler, 258, T176, Cliffordized, cam and headers
84 CJ7 Renegade, 258, T5, Weber 38, Borla headers
Hoover7 is online now  
post #10 of 16 Old 08-23-2017, 01:59 AM
80cj
Web Wheeler
 
80cj's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,853
I ran 31's with 3.54 gears and that's a good combination. Hope the gears are in good shape with no pits in the teeth.
Hoover7 likes this.
80cj is online now  
post #11 of 16 Old 08-23-2017, 05:57 AM
jeepdaddy2000
Registered User
 
jeepdaddy2000's Avatar
1971 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Eagle Point
Posts: 7,347
Quote:
Appreciate the quick reply, 80cj. My primary concern was potential differences between the trac-lock and open differential housing.
The only difference (as it applies to the R+P swap) is the carrier face may be a different distance from the center line in comparison to the old carrier.If you were doing just a carrier swap chances are you would have to adjust the backlash on the new unit.

Installing the open carrier is an improvement in my eyes. TL's have an abysmal failure rate.

Your speedometer will be a bit (lot) off. You will want to score the appropriate t case speedo gear to offset the gear swap. perhaps the seller has his old one.

Remember to insure you get a good picture during your set up.
Hoover7 likes this.

bazinga
jeepdaddy2000 is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 08-23-2017, 08:41 AM Thread Starter
Hoover7
Junior Member
 
Hoover7's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Livingston
Posts: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepdaddy2000 View Post
The only difference (as it applies to the R+P swap) is the carrier face may be a different distance from the center line in comparison to the old carrier.If you were doing just a carrier swap chances are you would have to adjust the backlash on the new unit.

Installing the open carrier is an improvement in my eyes. TL's have an abysmal failure rate.

Your speedometer will be a bit (lot) off. You will want to score the appropriate t case speedo gear to offset the gear swap. perhaps the seller has his old one.

Remember to insure you get a good picture during your set up.
Thanks for the insight, JeepDaddy. I've re-built engines and comfortable with working of most of the mechanical systems on my jeeps, but differential work has always remained an enigma. In preparation, I've been reviewing several threads and reading books on the subject, and looking forward to learning how to set a differential up on my own. And I hadn't even thought about the speedo differences- I'll inquire about the speedo drive gear when I speak with him! Thanks!

Hoover

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
82 CJ7 Laredo Ltd, 258, T5, frame off resto/rebuild in progress
83 CJ8 Scrambler, 258, T176, Cliffordized, cam and headers
84 CJ7 Renegade, 258, T5, Weber 38, Borla headers
Hoover7 is online now  
post #13 of 16 Old 08-24-2017, 08:23 AM
jeepdaddy2000
Registered User
 
jeepdaddy2000's Avatar
1971 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Eagle Point
Posts: 7,347
The actual installation of the R+P isn't hard. The issue is the ability to read the picture and figure out the proper adjustment of the pinion (depth) and/or the carrier(backlash).

If both gear sets are Dana, then you can use the pinion markings, do the math, add or subtract from the old shim pack, and get a starting point.

A clam shell style bearing remover is really helpful, but they are expensive and have limited uses beyond transmission/ t case and R+P work.

The one thing to remember when setting up used gears is to get a good picture, and not to worry about the backlash.
Attached Images
 

bazinga
jeepdaddy2000 is offline  
post #14 of 16 Old 08-24-2017, 10:48 AM
80cj
Web Wheeler
 
80cj's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepdaddy2000 View Post

The one thing to remember when setting up used gears is to get a good picture, and not to worry about the backlash.
True. Unless you have the luxury of being able to measure the BL of the old gearset before removal from the old housing. In such a case, Measure the BL at 3 points around the circumfirence of the ring gear and make a note of it.
80cj is online now  
post #15 of 16 Old 08-24-2017, 03:09 PM
CJ5_Fan
Registered User
 
CJ5_Fan's Avatar
1980 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Sedona
Posts: 854
I took my trac-lok that was worn out and took it to the axle shop and it was an easy job to switch out clutches and add n the modifier and have it functional in ust a few hours. Not saying it's a great limited slip scenario but it sure beats having nothing at all. Limited slip takes a little bit of finesse to get to work well on a trail as opposed to the brute force of a full Locker but they are useful 4 light off duty usage.

1980 CJ5 Renegade with 304 v8


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
CJ5_Fan is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the JeepForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome