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Unread 10-11-2013, 11:46 PM   #1
sailracr
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New starting and idling issue

Hi All,
After many years of wanting a CJ I finally have one! Careful what you wish for I guess ;-) I picked up a great 85 Cj that was barely running 4 days ago and after replacing the plugs, wires, distributor cap, & serpentine belt it purrs like a kitten. I've had no trouble starting or idling until yesterday. I drove 350 miles from north Florida to Sarasota and my first hint of a problem happened in St Pete after ~3 hours of straight driving in the afternoon heat. When I exited off the highway and ran into some traffic the jeep kept trying to stall. With some fancy footwork and left foot braking I was able to keep the rpm's above 12-15 hundred and managed to make my dinner stop with friends. After a two hour cool down the jeep started right up and all was well for the next hour to Sarasota.

The next morning no issues so I figured it was a one-off or maybe some bad fuel, but as I headed for Miami in the later afternoon heat I noticed it was hard to start after a fuel stop. It finally started so I headed off again and after another 1.5 hours I stopped to take the top down and enjoy and evening ride into Miami only the jeep wouldn't restart. With the help of a road marshals battery I was able to restart the jeep but it took about an hour! It really didn't want to stay running anywhere below 1500 rpm (lots of coughing and sputtering) and it seemed to be lacking power. I ended up driving the rest of the way to Miami in 4th gear because in 5th gear I slowly lost speed because of the distinct lack of power. Once I hit 1500 rpm in 5th gear the jeep really started to sputter.

I'm guessing fuel or carburation issue but I'm not sure where to start. Any/all suggestions would be appreciated. I'm really puzzled what could be causing the lack of power, poor idling, and hard starting all off the sudden. Also after sitting in the driveway in Miami tonight for ~2 hours I wasn't able to start the jeep. I'll leave it until the morning and try again. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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Unread 10-11-2013, 11:55 PM   #2
sailracr
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Apologies I forgot to include the jeep details.
85 CJ7, 258, no idea what the carb is (I intend to swap to EFI so I didn't care).
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Unread 10-12-2013, 12:46 AM   #3
Matt1981CJ7
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It sounds like you may get real familiar with that carb in the next few days.

Matt
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Unread 10-12-2013, 03:15 AM   #4
86cj74.2L
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Or the fuel pump. How long was it sitting before you rescued it?

Stock your carb would be a Carter BBD. But you can take a picture of it and post it. Someone may have swapped it out for a ford carb or a Weber.
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Unread 10-12-2013, 07:26 AM   #5
sailracr
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Here is a photo of the carb. I haven't owned or worked on a 4 wheel carbureted vehicle since the 90's and I know very little about this carburetor. I wonder is maybe I developed some kind of vacuum leak? How do I verify the choke is working properly? What is the best way to verify the fuel pump is working properly?

If I open the choke manually and press the gas I see two squirts of fuel enter the carb so I'm guessing the fuel pump is working ok? Maybe that means I need to focus on the carburetor???

Thanks for the help!!
image-417792408.jpg

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Unread 10-12-2013, 07:42 AM   #6
Matt1981CJ7
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That's the factory Carter BBD carb. The fuel mixture is computer controlled. Here's how it works.

A vacuum leak will definitely mess with the O2 sensor causing the mixture to go rich. Checking for leaks is always a good place to start.

Matt
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Unread 10-12-2013, 08:12 AM   #7
sailracr
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Thanks Matt, I'll have a read about the carb and go from there.
~Jason
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Unread 10-12-2013, 11:24 AM   #8
shadoow
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am not familiar with the carter BBD but it looks like you're missing some hose clamps on the 2 rubber hoses attached to the carb at the top. One of the hoses looks like it's cracked so your problem may be related to some of the hoses if they are older, especially vacuum hoses.
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Unread 10-12-2013, 12:26 PM   #9
86cj74.2L
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Those hoses on top of carb are for the evap canister.

Check all your manifold bolts for tightness. They like loosening up.

If its sat awhile you may have a fuel bowl full of sediment.

Is your distributor loose.
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Unread 10-12-2013, 03:23 PM   #10
sailracr
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I'll check the hoses for leaks, but the jeep has not really been sitting and I drove it 350+ miles with no issues. I'm struggling to figure out what would "fail" as the jeep was running really well before I left on this trip. I replaced the distributor cap, plugs, and wires before leaving. I'll check to make sure the distributor hasn't worked loose. I'm thinking to replace the coil as it's the only piece not replaced in the electrical chain. Thoughts??? Thanks, Jason
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Unread 10-12-2013, 04:02 PM   #11
86cj74.2L
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailracr
I'll check the hoses for leaks, but the jeep has not really been sitting and I drove it 350+ miles with no issues. I'm struggling to figure out what would "fail" as the jeep was running really well before I left on this trip. I replaced the distributor cap, plugs, and wires before leaving. I'll check to make sure the distributor hasn't worked loose. I'm thinking to replace the coil as it's the only piece not replaced in the electrical chain. Thoughts??? Thanks, Jason
If your replacing the coil may as well replace the duraspark ignition module. That may do it. Usually when the coil starts failing though the more of a load the more misfire it generates.

Do not leave your ignition in the run position without running the engine. Its a sure way to fry the coil and ignition module.
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Unread 10-14-2013, 07:34 AM   #12
sailracr
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Hi All, I noticed yesterday that the jeep seemed to try to fire when I released the key from the start position (kind of dieseling). I had read a post on ignition/starting problems that suggested a jumper wire straight from the battery to the positive side of the coil so I gave it a try this morning and the jeep roared to life easily. I guess I have a loose, broken, or shorted wire somewhere that I'll have to chase down. Thanks for all the help and ideas.

I think I still have an issue with the carburetor or something. In the beginning of this thread, I mentioned that after the jeep wouldn't start on my road trip I was struggling keeping it running when it was hot. I just took the jeep for a test ride and it seems the remaining problem is that the jeep sputters / misses when at or near full throttle. Does something change in the carb when the throttle is wide open?
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Unread 10-14-2013, 07:48 AM   #13
Matt1981CJ7
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I think it's time to rebuild your carb. Rebuild kits are cheap and readily available.

Just take your time, follow the directions, and be precise.

Good luck,

Matt
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Unread 10-16-2013, 07:08 PM   #14
sailracr
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Thanks to all for the help. The issue turned out to be electrical. The previous owner performed the nutter bypass and didn't solder a single connection. In spite of that I managed to get the jeep home from Miami so now it's time for EFI, new wiring through out, possible rebuild, and new ignition system. Time to really get to know this jeep, I'll post progress as I go.

Thanks again for all the help!
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Unread 10-16-2013, 09:42 PM   #15
seabass1858
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I contiplated EFI but with since the jeep came with several parts when i picked min up, 1 included was a carb rebuild kit which looked like it was packaged in the 90s. I took my chances with the rebuild and after some adjustments and matts reminder of flipping the fuel filter to the correct position, it idles flawlessly and is very responsive. I did the nutter and moved my stepper pin 1/8th on an in out on the shoulder.
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