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Unread 08-25-2014, 08:06 PM   #16
WindKnot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post
Ok so right now the battery cable and the fuse panel cable are on A. I should take them off?

How do I recognize the short?
With an Ohm meter. (Or a Multimeter set to Ohms or Resistance) Yes, take the wires off terminal "A" and one wire at a time, look for a short between the wire and the negative cable that is disconnected from the battery.

Unless this has been done before, each and every circuit needs to be checked for a short to ground. (The chassis) Mike says you have proven terminal "A" to be good with no short to ground. If that is so and these a,re the last two circuits still attached to battery and you have a ground, I'd strongly suspect that one or possibly both circuits have the ground you're looking for.

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Unread 08-25-2014, 08:44 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindKnot View Post
With an Ohm meter. (Or a Multimeter set to Ohms or Resistance) Yes, take the wires off terminal "A" and one wire at a time, look for a short between the wire and the negative cable that is disconnected from the battery.

Unless this has been done before, each and every circuit needs to be checked for a short to ground. (The chassis) Mike says you have proven terminal "A" to be good with no short to ground. If that is so and these a,re the last two circuits still attached to battery and you have a ground, I'd strongly suspect that one or possibly both circuits have the ground you're looking for.
Ok, do I assume I should leave the battery positive cable on the solenoid terminal A, otherwise there's no power anywhere but the battery, unless we want the resistance of each wire in a dormant state. Is that what we want?

If so, the resistance reading between the disconnected battery cable and the cable that goes from the fuse panel to terminal A, when it's disconnected from A, jumps around from 0.1 ohms to 40.## kilo ohms to 0.L. that's with my cheap auto ranging Southwire multimeter. My Actron multimeter set to 200 ohms show a lot of jumping around, too.


The resistance for the alternator wire under the same conditions is 13.69 kilo ohms, with the Southwire. It doesn't register with the Actron set at 200 (lowest setting).
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Unread 08-25-2014, 10:20 PM   #18
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I can't see why your fuse box has jumper between the solenoid power wire (constant power) and the ignition switch acc wire (switched power) but if it does, then the acc wire has constant power and the ignition switch may ground the acc post when it is in the off position.
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Unread 08-25-2014, 10:45 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post
Ok, do I assume I should leave the battery positive cable on the solenoid terminal A, otherwise there's no power anywhere but the battery, unless we want the resistance of each wire in a dormant state. Is that what we want?
Yes. We want to establish whether or not there are clean circuits here. The multimeter will provide it's own voltage to establish this. We don't need the battery at the moment. We're measuring resistance, not voltage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post
If so, the resistance reading between the disconnected battery cable and the cable that goes from the fuse panel to terminal A, when it's disconnected from A, jumps around from 0.1 ohms to 40.## kilo ohms to 0.L.
THIS leg (circuit) looks suspicious. From what you've stated, somewhere "downstream" from here is a problem. THIS is the leg you want to follow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post
The resistance for the alternator wire under the same conditions is 13.69 kilo ohms, with the Southwire. It doesn't register with the Actron set at 200 (lowest setting).
This leg appears to be okay.

What I would suggest is leaving the wire lifted at terminal "A" and start testing at the fuse box. We want to prove EVERYTHING good or bad, so I would lift the power wire to the fuse block and test it with the multimeter. Most likely it will test okay but we want to prove that. Then if it tests okay I would pull ALL of the fuses and signal relays out of the block and test each and EVERY connection where a fuse or relay plugs into. My guess is that one of these connections will have a short to ground on it. (Remember, one wire of the multimeter is attached to the negative battery cable and the other is against what circuit you are testing. Now, IF there is no short to ground, I would attach the power wire back to the fuse block, still leaving it lifted at terminal "A" and testing that point for a short again.

This is going to take time, but I believe you will find the leg with the short.

THERE HAVE BEEN other methods offered by some other knowledgeable posters here and they ARE valid ways to test the circuits. I believe that this is a simpler, but perhaps more time consuming way to locate the trouble. Basically the Idea is to cut the trouble in two and then look each way. Keep eliminating.
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Unread 08-25-2014, 10:49 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Requiem4aCJ View Post
I can't see why your fuse box has jumper between the solenoid power wire (constant power) and the ignition switch acc wire (switched power) but if it does, then the acc wire has constant power and the ignition switch may ground the acc post when it is in the off position.
This jumper is the feed from the battery to the FB. Switched power comes FROM the FB through the switch.
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Unread 08-25-2014, 11:05 PM   #21
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This jumper is the feed from the battery to the FB. Switched power comes FROM the FB through the switch.
in the other thread where sabbyATL was rewiring her jeep it was said that there is a jumper between these two wires
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Unread 08-25-2014, 11:43 PM   #22
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The ignition switch power wire should have a jumper from the solenoid power wire. Is it possible the ignition switch power and the ignition switch acc wires got switched or labeled wrong by the manufacturer?
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Unread 08-26-2014, 04:26 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Requiem4aCJ View Post
The ignition switch power wire should have a jumper from the solenoid power wire. Is it possible the ignition switch power and the ignition switch acc wires got switched or labeled wrong by the manufacturer?

I'll double check at first light.
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Unread 08-26-2014, 04:32 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindKnot View Post
Yes. We want to establish whether or not there are clean circuits here. The multimeter will provide it's own voltage to establish this. We don't need the battery at the moment. We're measuring resistance, not voltage.



THIS leg (circuit) looks suspicious. From what you've stated, somewhere "downstream" from here is a problem. THIS is the leg you want to follow.



This leg appears to be okay.

What I would suggest is leaving the wire lifted at terminal "A" and start testing at the fuse box. We want to prove EVERYTHING good or bad, so I would lift the power wire to the fuse block and test it with the multimeter. Most likely it will test okay but we want to prove that. Then if it tests okay I would pull ALL of the fuses and signal relays out of the block and test each and EVERY connection where a fuse or relay plugs into. My guess is that one of these connections will have a short to ground on it. (Remember, one wire of the multimeter is attached to the negative battery cable and the other is against what circuit you are testing. Now, IF there is no short to ground, I would attach the power wire back to the fuse block, still leaving it lifted at terminal "A" and testing that point for a short again.

This is going to take time, but I believe you will find the leg with the short.

THERE HAVE BEEN other methods offered by some other knowledgeable posters here and they ARE valid ways to test the circuits. I believe that this is a simpler, but perhaps more time consuming way to locate the trouble. Basically the Idea is to cut the trouble in two and then look each way. Keep eliminating.

I'll give this a shot. The methodicalness of it speaks to my statistician training.

To reiterate, I'll test the end of each wire at the fuse panel, with a lead on the disconnected battery negative cable. Meter set to ohms. Battery positive cable also disconnected. Start with the other end of the solenoid power cable.
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Unread 08-26-2014, 06:12 AM   #25
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I'll double check at first light.
Ok, I was a little wrong. I went out and followed the wires carefully. The solenoid power cable only really connects to 2 wires - the ignition switch power wire and the alternator power wire. The alternator power wire is not used because I have a one-wire alternator.

(Please excuse my crude drawing and shaky handwriting)
fuse-20box_01_zpssxpbfhl0.jpg  
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Unread 08-26-2014, 07:10 AM   #26
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Hooks to at least three terminals in your drawing.
Main power comes in, jumps to the blade on the far right,
The jumper from far right jumps to second from the right.
That's 3 terminals.

------------------------

How about this,
Take the main feed wire off the starter relay,
Install a 3 or 5 amp fuse between battery cable and main feed wire,
See if that fuse blows when it's hooked up...

This is a poor mans Amp Gauge.
If it doesn't pop a 3 amp fuse, then you can start looking for the drain with full power hooked up...
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Unread 08-26-2014, 07:13 AM   #27
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If you can, how about some good, clear pictures of the back side of that fuse block so we can start tracing circuits.
Back side, from a couple of different angles,
And the front side with the same orientation, same side as TOP in both sets of pictures.
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Unread 08-26-2014, 07:51 AM   #28
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Here's a thought.

Since the current problem is the same as the original problem (described 3 threads ago), I would concentrate my efforts in areas that haven't changed since going down the new harness rabbit hole.

I'm guessing the ignition switch is bad.

Matt
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Unread 08-26-2014, 08:00 AM   #29
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Quote:
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Here's a thought.

Since the current problem is the same as the original problem (described 3 threads ago), I would concentrate my efforts in areas that haven't changed since going down the new harness rabbit hole.

I'm guessing the ignition switch is bad.

Matt
New switch... She also unhooked the power to the new switch with no change. Though maybe she should unhook all the wires from the switch.
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Unread 08-26-2014, 08:09 AM   #30
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Personally, I would have swapped out the bastardized ignition that Jen has before I would have attempted a new harness install.

But that's just me.

Matt
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