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Unread 03-24-2010, 02:12 PM   #1
JeepHammer
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Need Opinions On Dash Wiring Image...

Does this make sense to you guys?,

Is it too complicated?,

Did I leave anything out?,

Is there some way to make it better or easier to read?

Does seeing the back of the actual part help with understanding what's going on or would a diagram make as much sense?

Does showing the connectors/routing of the wires help?
(Like with turns signal connector, brake light switch connector, dimmer switch connector, ect.)



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Unread 03-24-2010, 02:27 PM   #2
mvigo
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JeepHammer,

I have been trying to read through as many of your threads as I can find and it is slowly sinking in. The above diagram helps a bunch because A) I can see the ACTUAL part and B) you indicate the correct wire gauge...for someone like myself who is starting from scratch in electical connections, this helps a ton...
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Unread 03-24-2010, 02:59 PM   #3
CajunCJ
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SWEET!! Another Great Job JH!!
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Unread 03-24-2010, 03:17 PM   #4
Trapshooter
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Jeephammer....looks good to me. Wish I had this when I pulled mine out about two years ago to change the temp. and fuel quantity gauges.

Off the top of my head I don't have any suggestions to make it better. It looks like you have everything covered.

Keep up the good work............
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Unread 03-24-2010, 03:30 PM   #5
DUX4LIFE
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You couldn't have done this at a better time. I am getting ready to put the wiring in. Since my wiring harness came in a box along with a lot of other jeep parts I was scratching my head and trying to look over schematics. Thanks
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Unread 03-24-2010, 05:01 PM   #6
jdmartie
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It looks like everything is there but is there any way to label what size the fuse is, and can you label the jumper between the temp and fuel gauges? Could you also show that the case of the indicator is grounded i'm not sure if that is what you did with the ground symbol at the top of the illustration. Other than adding those things everything looks great like always thanks
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Unread 03-24-2010, 05:13 PM   #7
SlikRic
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I think using a pic of the actual part is brilliant, makes it so muxh easier for electric idiots like me
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Unread 03-24-2010, 05:22 PM   #8
keith460
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JeepHammer,

What program do you use for making these type of diagrams with the bulb and fuse icons and fonts?

Looks good to me and it is easy to understand for those that struggle with electrical diagrams and schematics.
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Unread 03-24-2010, 07:49 PM   #9
specwarCJ
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Thanks a bunch. I was wondering what guage wire to use to rewire this pig and now I see what the dominant sizes required are and can go buy a couple of spools. I like the schematic. It is thorough without being too busy.

Another thing that would be nice is if somebody could show how to wire all of the guages in the most efficient manner for those of us who are not electronics experts. I know how to replace wire by wire but I see in many pictures there is a way to ground many of the guages together. Or at least that is what it looks like to a layman. One of the biggest fears for me is I am afraid to take the whole dash cluster off because it is a spagetti maze behind it and I am afraid I won't be able to figure out how to wire it back up.
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Unread 03-24-2010, 10:25 PM   #10
giundy
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Which fuse on the block is that? (Should be obvious, but would help).
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Unread 03-24-2010, 11:32 PM   #11
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Great job. Only question is like the "Green with trace" or "purple with trace", what color are the traces? Do they use the same color for all traces on these vehicles? I know the newer vehicles have something like "Ppl/Wht" for a purple wire with a white tracer.
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Unread 03-25-2010, 05:00 AM   #12
John Strenk
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Yuck, I got a rusted up old speedo just like that.

Nah it's great! Maybe a similar one for replacement speedos without the third illumination bulb and only two posts on each gauge?

Only one connection missing, there should be a black wire running from the ignition switch to the brake warning light. It "T's" in at the Combination Valve. That is why there are two black wires going through the firewall to that connection. Don't know if you wan't to go into that detail or not but it does activate the brake light.

Trace wires were always a pain. Some are spiral, some are a straight line and they can be any color. I had tried making thicker wire lines with the trace color as dashes and sometimes with lines. But that adds hours to the drawing. MSPaint is easy to make thick or thin lines but not very flexible. Thick lines makes it easy to add traces. I've seen programs like Photoshop that use a tool to "roll" out any design in whatever shape you want but point to point line drawing and text was always a pain compared to MSPaint. I actually use both, PSP for moding picture and MSP for annotation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by giundy View Post
Which fuse on the block is that? (Should be obvious, but would help).
Fuses for Speedo:
Brake Warning Light: BU/Seat Belt 10 Amps
Gauges: IGN LPS 3 Amp (15 Amp with computer controlled cars)
Turn Signal: Turn 15 Amp Clk/Hazard/Stop fuse also effects turn signal bulbs but we want to keep this simple
Illumination Bulbs: ACC LPS 3 amps


Last edited by John Strenk; 03-25-2010 at 05:38 AM..
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Unread 03-25-2010, 05:47 AM   #13
84MSRB
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I like that even better than the schematic provided earlier- by you I think- that I used to wire my dash. From what the ford motor man tells me, it helped me get everything right.
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Unread 03-25-2010, 08:35 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Strenk View Post
Yuck, I got a rusted up old speedo just like that.
Where do you think I got this old rusted up piece of crap?
I took it off your work bench when you weren't looking!

John, I was hoping you would see this!
Can I use some of your pictures of other components in the picture/image/diagram drawings?
Don't want to swipe pictures without permission, and I'd like to collaborate with you on this.
I've got a guy, publisher, that is interested in producing a CJ book (I'm lobbying for CD so we can go interactive and it's easier to update) and I'd like you in on it.

You are actually I stole the component picture/combined with diagram idea from...
(I know a good idea when I steal it! )
Your 'Flashing Light' diagrams are one of those little brilliant ideas, and I'd like to use that same idea on some stuff...

This was actually a REAL PAIN to do!
You are CONSTANTLY in a fight to keep the size down without packing stuff in so tightly the 'Average Joe' can't follow the diagrams/wire paths..

You don't know what direction to run the wires/components in the beginning, so you wind up doing this 4 or 5 times to work everything in there!
I've got 5 hours in that diagram alone!
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Unread 03-25-2010, 08:38 AM   #15
JeepHammer
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OK...
Questions/Quotes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mvigo View Post
The above diagram helps a bunch because
A) I can see the ACTUAL part and
B) you indicate the correct wire gauge...for someone like myself who is starting from scratch in electical connections, this helps a ton...
Glad it helps a little with your project.
Those are the FACTORY gauges, you can 'Up-size' the wire a little without problems, but don't go smaller than the wires shown.
Stocking 12, 14 & 16 Ga. wire is easier than adding 18 Ga. to the mix and a lot less expensive!
Copper is HIGH right now!
---------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by DUX4LIFE View Post
...I was scratching my head and trying to look over schematics. Thanks
Again, hope it takes some of the 'Mystery' out of your project.
If you pay attention to the factory numbers, color codes, wire gauges, ect.,
It will help you understand those confusing factory schematics better.
They REALLY pack the wires in those factory schematics and that makes them hard to understand!
---------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmartie View Post
It looks like everything is there but is there any way to label what size the fuse is,

...and can you label the jumper between the temp and fuel gauges?

Could you also show that the case of the indicator is grounded i'm not sure if that is what you did with the ground symbol at the top of the illustration.

Other than adding those things everything looks great like always thanks
The Fuse is in the factory fuse block,
Since fuse positions changed from year to year, I can't tell everyone EXACTLY where their fuse/connection will be...

As near as I can tell, it's the "ACC.LPS." (Accessory Lamps) fuse in the LOWER LEFT corner of the fuse block.
My book is showing a 3 Amp fuse in that position.
John Strenk can correct me if I'm wrong, but I BELIEVE thats where it probably is...

Jumper strap between Fuel Gauge/Amperage limiter and Temp gauge is factory Installed.
A 14 Ga. wire will suffice with no issues what so ever.

It's a 'Given' that the gauge cluster is grounded.
And I've gone over adding dedicated grounds Over & Over at length, but I will add a ground symbol to the case.
-------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by keith460 View Post
JeepHammer,

What program do you use for making these type of diagrams with the bulb and fuse icons and fonts?

Looks good to me and it is easy to understand for those that struggle with electrical diagrams and schematics.
I use MS Paint to do most of these graphics for the web site and forums.
That makes it easy for you guys to modify the orignal images to your particular application should you need to change anything.
Most of the orignal graphics are available from my web site in .bmp format so you can open them and change things to your hearts content...
Just don't forget to print and throw a copy in your 'Jeep File' so you can remember where things go later!

Like I said before, I try and use easy to identify 'Component' images, and I use the factory identifiers so it will help you learn how to read those confusing factory schematics easier...
------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by specwarCJ View Post
Thanks a bunch. I was wondering what guage wire to use to rewire this pig and now I see what the dominant sizes required are and can go buy a couple of spools. I like the schematic. It is thorough without being too busy.
You can always go one wire gauge size UP in size without problems, and that will actually make your vehicle more reliable at the same time,
While reducing the amount of wire sizes you have to buy in several different colors.

Just for the record,
What I do are 'Images' or 'Diagrams',
Schematics are a very precise type of electrical mapping drawing that require you to use the correct symbols.

I do diagrams so the components aren't disjointed and abstract like proper Schematics are.
I try to keep mine making a little more sense to the layman than schematics usually do...

Quote:
Another thing that would be nice is if somebody could show how to wire all of the guages in the most efficient manner for those of us who are not electronics experts.
I know how to replace wire by wire but I see in many pictures there is a way to ground many of the guages together.
Or at least that is what it looks like to a layman. One of the biggest fears for me is I am afraid to take the whole dash cluster off because it is a spagetti maze behind it and I am afraid I won't be able to figure out how to wire it back up.
I'm working on a Jeep dash right now, and *IF* I can remember to take pictures as I go, I'll post some of that up for you later on.
This current project is why I did the diagrams in the first place,
To make the project easier to work on while it's laying on the work bench...
---------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by giundy View Post
Which fuse on the block is that? (Should be obvious, but would help).
Seems to be a common question...
As near as I can tell from the facotry diagrams,
It's the Lower Left most fuse, 3 amps, Marked "ACC.LPS" or 'Accessory Lamps'.
These are usually SWITCHED ACCESSORY, Meaning the power to them is cut off when you turn the key off.

There will also be a feed from the head light switch for the panel lamps,
And some other sources for the other stuff.
-----------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cutlass327 View Post
Great job. Only question is like the "Green with trace" or "purple with trace", what color are the traces? Do they use the same color for all traces on these vehicles? I know the newer vehicles have something like "Ppl/Wht" for a purple wire with a white tracer.
OK...
This is going to anger the 'AMC FOREVER' guys,
But AMC was a failing company...

That meant they purchased stuff from anyone that would give them credit,
And it also meant some quality control standards weren't quite what they should have been...

This diagram also covers several different years without being specific to any one year model or drive train/option package, which often changes color coding slightly.

I can't give you the specific TRACE colors or types because they changed from application to application, vehicle year/model to vehicle year/model.

Plus, there are different kinds of 'Traces' on wires,
Broken lines, Dots, Stripes, Spirals, ect.

Straight line traces are the easiest to produce, so you see that the most on AMC vehicles. (Less Expensive to produce)

And you have to remember, you are working on a 25+ year old vehicle,
The vehicle I'm working on is 30 years old, and the wires/traces are faded so they aren't much use anyway...
And the MICE didn't help things any!

Sorry, but that is the best I can do right now.
John Strenk might be able to help you, he has dissected and photographed more of the components than anyone I know, He might be able to help out some more with specifics on the wiring harness years/applications he's dissected.
-----------------------------------------------------

Last edited by JeepHammer; 03-25-2010 at 09:18 AM..
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