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Unread 07-06-2013, 08:51 AM   #1
beerbulance
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1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 26
Loss of oil pressure.....return of oil pressure.....loss of pressure.......return of

Hello all!
Well we have made it through the engine rebuild, and the numerous starter destructions. The 86 CJ7 with the 258 seemed solid.
I will give a synapsis of what happened yesterday, and then what we did to the motor.
(By the way, the motor has about 300 miles since rebuild, and has performed flawlessly)! Even starts with a small tap on gas, and fires on first bump.
So......start her up to do some errands, check my gauges....no oil pressure.
Unusual, has consistently been running 60psi cold, around 40 psi hot.
Shut it down, checked oil pressure sending unit, hose to and from motor to gauge....ok.
Start it up again, 60psi. Purrs like a kitten.
Off to get gas. Starts up perfect, with a lifter tick. Hmm....unusual. Less than a minute...tick is gone, pressure 60. Down the road we go.
Hit the big bridge in town, losing power......bad. (Not anywhere to pull over)
Downshift, and get over bridge. Temp, ok. Oil pressure falling rapidly.
Jump off at next exit, engine temp ok, NO oil pressure, engine ticking BAD.
Coast into nearest parking lot, shut down. Call tow truck.
Jeep back at house. Oil level full. Visual inspection underneath....no leaks.
Hook up spare oil gauge (new for other truck), start motor. No ticks, pressure 60. Let engine warm up a bit, increase rpms to 2500. Pressure drops to 20. Severe ticking returns, yet goes away at idle. Increase rpm to 2000, oil pressure up to 60, the drops to 0. Shut down. Cuss throw things, wife brings cold beer to keep me from finding my pill head mechanics who did the rebuild, and keeps me from going to jail.
SO here is what the pills and I did with motor. Complete teardown, block to machine shop, honed, head job done on head, new cam bearings, lifters, oil pump, crank kit (reman crank, bearings, etc), new cam, timing chain and gear, gaskets, rings, basically a complete rebuild. New water pump, etc.
All went together well, (I know a bit about engine rebuilds, but not a lot, so I supervised, book in hand, and double checked torque specs on mains, rods, etc.). I did this thru-out the project.....as the oxys/roxys sometimes were pretty heavy duty. (I don't take them myself, these were good ole boys who work for me...well they did work for me until the pills got the best of them). The only trouble we had was with one lifter that didn't want to pump up when we preloaded them. It ticked on initial start-up....but quickly settled into a nice quiet motor.
Now like I say 300miles of gentle break-in, lower speeds, little fishing trips, etc. The damn thing has been perfect. I was regaining confidence in the pill boys.
Until yesterday. SOOOO....I am guessing I have a collapsed lifter on #2 cylinder. Ok. (By the way no pills are working on this, just me).
But the drastic rise and fall of the oil pressure bothers me. No heavy knocking from down below either.....yet.
I was thinking drop a new set of lifters? or just the one we had trouble with?
Pull the pan and put in a new oil pump?
Or did these guys really screw the pooch somewhere in there?
(No disrespect for anybody out there who takes these pills for legitimate reasons, but here in Florida......it is really bad. They shoot these things....worse than crack, and meth).
Any ideas before I get greasy?
Anybody wanna buy a really nice CJ with a rebuilt motor with a tick?????

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Unread 07-06-2013, 08:58 AM   #2
Siva283
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1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Falling Waters, WV
Posts: 3,698
Sounds like a bad oil pump to me. Especu ally since its consistent and repeatable

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1995 YJ. 2 inch BDS Spring lift. 1 inch shackle lift. 1.25 inch JKS Body Lift 33x12.5x15's. Engo 10,000 pound winch.

[QUOTE=Magnum;14117863] I gave the Jeep the required offering of $$, sweat, and blood, and everything works fine now. -- Jim[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ldso;16498409]. It started with a $200 axle, and a few thousand dollars later I was done :)[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Luuca;16122017]diagnose the real issue before you start going all Obama on it - spending mad cash you'll need for other important things.

Ask me how I know...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Overhead;17658665]this is also my second set of RC springs this year. I'd rather spend the money again and get something that will last.[/QUOTE]
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Unread 07-06-2013, 10:12 AM   #3
wellmax
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1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hazel, KY
Posts: 1,090
remember: no matter the problem, the fastest way to ruin a good motor is lack of oil pressure.

throw another oil pump on there, and re-check every thing oil related.

you do have enough oil in the crankcase??????????
hey its been done before.
_______________
all of us make mistakes sometimes:
I was changing oil in my car, in the drive way, many years ago,

when things like that affected me more,

my good looking neighbor lady came over to talk with my wife and they both sat down in chairs in the drive way right where I could see both of their long fine looking tan legs.

I got so upset I started pouring the new oil back into the car and ran one qt onto the driveway as I had not put the drain plug back in.

just threw a bunch of rags an paper towels down on the oil and when back into the house until they left.

then came back out and cleaned up my mess, did not tell them anything about my mistake.


again you must have oil pressure!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Unread 07-06-2013, 11:23 AM   #4
gmakra
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1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Chicago area
Posts: 2,874
Is there a high volume oil pump in the engine now?
If so go to a standard oil pump.
There is no need for a high volume pump in a fresh rebuild.
It has happened before were the pump will put all the oil up in the engine and the pump cavitates and losses prime.
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Unread 07-06-2013, 02:26 PM   #5
beerbulance
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1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 26
Thanks.....yes there is the correct amount of oil in crankcase. That I have checked.....too many times.
The engine has been rebuilt once before, so my 258 IS .030 over. My old timer engine parts guy went with the high volume pump. (Maybe that is why the 60psi on the motor)? However, the darned thing has been flawless for the last 300-350 miles. And for this to spring up outta nowhere.........grrrrrrr.
I am already looking at 70's Broncos. Oh, that's right.....trade one nightmare for another.
I do like the story about the ladies an legs.......I did do something like that myself many years ago.....ya know 17yrs old or so.....and took a swig of what I thought was my beer. Motor oil. Remember that taste to this day.
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Unread 07-06-2013, 03:51 PM   #6
thompsoj22
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1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: ridgecrest, ca
Posts: 320
i also lean toward the new pump

possibly somthing with the spring/valve pressure regulator. throw another filter at it and see if there are any changes. dont let it outa the driveway til it stops acting up. i also believe that you could have excessive pressure/volume. the fact that it only does it at elevated rpm and returns to normal at idle is a sure sign of starvation. the lifters and the gauge are screaming at you, "NO OIL". believe them. could be a bad filter but not likely.
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Unread 07-06-2013, 04:05 PM   #7
Siva283
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Posts: 3,698
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompsoj22 View Post
possibly somthing with the spring/valve pressure regulator. throw another filter at it and see if there are any changes. dont let it outa the driveway til it stops acting up. i also believe that you could have excessive pressure/volume. the fact that it only does it at elevated rpm and returns to normal at idle is a sure sign of starvation. the lifters and the gauge are screaming at you, "NO OIL". believe them. could be a bad filter but not likely.
Its the high flow oil pump that's in there. They need a deep or rwmore sump

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__________________
1995 YJ. 2 inch BDS Spring lift. 1 inch shackle lift. 1.25 inch JKS Body Lift 33x12.5x15's. Engo 10,000 pound winch.

[QUOTE=Magnum;14117863] I gave the Jeep the required offering of $$, sweat, and blood, and everything works fine now. -- Jim[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ldso;16498409]. It started with a $200 axle, and a few thousand dollars later I was done :)[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Luuca;16122017]diagnose the real issue before you start going all Obama on it - spending mad cash you'll need for other important things.

Ask me how I know...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Overhead;17658665]this is also my second set of RC springs this year. I'd rather spend the money again and get something that will last.[/QUOTE]
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Unread 07-06-2013, 05:03 PM   #8
LumpyGrits
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1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: The Mojave Desert Palmdale Ca. U.S.A.
Posts: 5,181
Std. vol. oil pump is fine.
Put another oil pump in ASAP and look to see how much room you have from the bottom of the pan to the PU screen.
BTW, what oil and oil filter are you using??
LG
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Unread 07-06-2013, 06:29 PM   #9
beerbulance
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1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 26
Hi everybody,
Running Havoline 10/40 oil, and a AC delco filter. Decided with that, not the cheapest, nor most expensive. I try and stay away from Fram, but read a lot of negative feedback about em. I liked Fram when they came out with the grip coating, but I guess that came at a price. I do have a Purolator filter on the shelf, and can pick up some new oil. Jeep isn't moving from garage by the way. So.....the whole oil pump idea ......seems sound to me. Too much pressure, lots of volume, going over steep bridge.....I can fathom that. I know I still have that problem (new) lifter, but I personally would rather drop the pan, change the oil pump to regular flow, change oil and see what happens. Start with the cheaper/less headache fixes first. I really don't relish pulling the head off to change the lifters..... Would be interesting to see what comes out of the oil pan. On the dipstick, it is almost new engine clean. (Warm down here, no need for choke), and I guess my carb is dialed in right. Off tomorrow, so I know where I will be!
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Unread 07-06-2013, 06:42 PM   #10
LumpyGrits
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Location: The Mojave Desert Palmdale Ca. U.S.A.
Posts: 5,181
IF, you still have the lifter noise after the oil psi issue is fixed.
Put a 1/2 qt of Marvel Mystery Oil in the crankcase with your eng oil.
LG
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Unread 09-09-2013, 02:21 PM   #11
beerbulance
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1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 26
Hey y'all! Sorry it took so damn long to do this......work and all.
New oil pump in, pressure around 60psi. higher rpms, 45 idle.
Now my new motor has a rattle in it. Not the lifters, but somewhere towards the bottom end. Keeping in mind good oil pressure. As I increase the rpms, a rattle develops in the motor. Wrist pins?????? We never touched those in the rebuild.
Now I wound up talking to a guy here in Florida, who at one time had the fastest CJ mud-bogger in the Southeast. Something like 6-7 seconds to cross a football field, with a near 100mph finish speed. Wow!
Anyways, his idea was loose bearing caps. (I used a torque wrench, following the manuals specs). However his concept was, that if I didn't insert a flathead screwdriver next to the bearing cap, as I was tightening the nuts.....to prevent the "slop" or "twist" in the bearing caps, I would get an inaccurate reading from the torque wrench. Therefore loose bearing caps. Again, makes sense to me..........has anyone heard of this little "trick"? Going to drop the oil pan, and do this, just for snits and jiggles.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 02:28 PM   #12
LumpyGrits
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: The Mojave Desert Palmdale Ca. U.S.A.
Posts: 5,181
Did you check clearance of the mains with Plastigauge?
Did you prime the oil passages before startup?
http://www.plastigaugeusa.com/how.html
What weight oil you use'n?
That screwdriver 'trick' does nut'n.......
LG
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Unread 09-09-2013, 03:25 PM   #13
Blakescj7
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1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Tulsa, Ok
Posts: 314
Perhaps there's something preventing enough oil running back to the pan like maybe a rag left in the motor I've heard of high volume pumps in smallblocks running the pan dry. Just throwin that out there
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