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Unread 07-13-2010, 07:54 AM   #166
Ken4444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abernut View Post
Is your choke system working correctly (Electric choke, choke pull-off, etc)

After rebuilding mine I couldn't figure out how to set the choke.

I ended up just adjusting it so the plate is wide open. It starts right up and runs great though.
The first thing to know is that when the carb is cold, things should be in certain places: 1) the choke plate should be closed. 2) The fast idle cam should be on the 2nd notch which is the second "highest" notch. If the choke plate isn't closed when it's cold, then the automatic (electric) choke isn't adjusted right. Adjusting the automatic choke is a matter of rotating it a bit in one direction or the other. (if it's adjustable, which some aren't) Once you get the choke plate closed while the carb is cold, then you need to check the fast idle cam. if the fast idle cam isn't on the 2nd step, then you bend the linkage to shorten or lengthen it.

During operation of the engine, the engine starts cold. Choke plate is closed. Fast idle cam is on the 2nd step. As the engine runs, the automatic choke heats up and gradually opens the choke plate. This also will move the fast idle cam to a "lower" step, reducing the idle speed. Eventually the automatic choke will open the choke plate all the way which also moves the fast idle cam to the "lowest" part which essentially removes it from operation. At that point the regular idle screw ("curb idle screw") is the one that determines idle speed.

The next day, when the engine has been sitting all night and is cold again, you can press the gas pedal onc before starting the engine. This causes the fast idle cam to pop back to the 2nd position on the cam (if its correctly adjusted). The happens because the spring in the electric choke is now cold again, so it's trying to pull the choke closed. Your press on the gas pedal allows the choke to do its thing and pop things back to the cold position. When the choke closes, this also moves the fast idle cam back to its cold position.

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Unread 07-13-2010, 08:28 AM   #167
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I tried the above steps but I think my Electric choke isn't working. It was not hooked up when I purchased the jeep. So after I rebuilt it, I connected to a 12V source and the plate never moved.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 10:02 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by abernut View Post
I tried the above steps but I think my Electric choke isn't working. It was not hooked up when I purchased the jeep. So after I rebuilt it, I connected to a 12V source and the plate never moved.
Are you getting any voltage on the wire that connects to the choke while the engine is running? That would be the first thing to check. If you are getting voltage, then i would disassemble the choke, clean everything, get it shiny, and then use some diaelectric grease on the internal screw and contacts. The unit gets ground through those connections so they must be clean and sound.

If you're not getting voltage, then you'll have to crack open the schematic and see where that wire goes. I suspect it goes to the ignition switch or something that's tied to it. I do not know if this circuit is directly fused or not.

Notes about disassembling the electric choke:

1) some models have the choke riveted together to prevent tampering (fixing) them. You have to drill/grind off the rivet heads and then install new scews to hold the thing together when you're done.

2) The choke is held to the throttle plate with 2 screws. One is internal to the choke and is typically easy to get out. THe other screw is external to the choke and can be a real pain to get out. The last one I worked on I had to drill the head off and then use big Channel Locks to turn the screw. This can be one of the many areas where it can be helpful to have a big assortment of spare screws to stand in for stuff that you've lost/cut/drilled/stripped.

3) There is a switch (wide open throttle (WOT) switch) that is secured between the choke and the body of the carburetor. If you did the Nutter Bypass then you can take this switch out and remove it while you have the choke off.

4) The auto choke is very simple: the heart is a coiled bimetal spring. The center/end of the spring pulls against a cam that twists a shaft that pulls the external lobe/cam that pulls the choke linkage. It sound complicated but mechanically its simple.

5) Once you get the auto choke cleaned and reassembled, slightly loosen the 3 screws so you can turn the choke. By turning the choke one way or the other, you should be able to see the point where the auto choke opens or closes the choke plate on the carb. The FSM rebuild/tuning directions make reference to going lean or rich with the choke and that basically mounts to turning the choke to the righht place and then tightening the 3 screws to hold it in place.

6) The FSM makes reference to a 'notch' on the electric choke that is supposed to point to the scale of (raised notches) on the choke body. THe idea is that to adjust the choke, you turn it so the notch points to a different point on the scale. But on the BBD I got working, these never lined up. So take all that with a grain of salt. In general, the auto chokes I"ve seen from BBDs end up being turned to the point where the electrical contact for the wire is sticking almost straight up, or possibly pointing slightly to the rear of the Jeep.

Ultimtely if you can't get the automatic choke working, you might opt for a manual choke like Mike Romain uses. I don't know anything about those though.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 10:09 AM   #169
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Growing up my Dad had a manual choke on his 65 and i loved it. Would be nice to have some information on installing a manual choke. I'll do a search.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 12:32 PM   #170
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Ken,
I was rereading your comments about your carb rebuild.

Could incorrect settings on my mixture screws be the reason my jeeps exhaust smells like a kerosene factory.

My girl friend just followed me to the transmission shop and she literally stayed at least three cars behind me at stop lights...Granted she is a bit of a wimp.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 12:46 PM   #171
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Quote:
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Could incorrect settings on my mixture screws be the reason my jeeps exhaust smells like a kerosene factory.
That could be at least part of the reason. If the engine is running too rich due to misadjusted carburetor, then you're moving a lot of unburned and partially burned gas out the exhaust pipe. Other factors could include malfunctioning EGR (exhaust gas return) system or bad catalytic converter.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 01:01 PM   #172
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.... bad catalytic converter.
Hmmm
And hypothetically speaking...if the PO removed the catalytic converter?
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Unread 07-13-2010, 01:36 PM   #173
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I see that Cat's run around $100.
Since I nuttered mine, will putting one back in require any additional work in terms of vacuum lines, etc.

Thanks
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Unread 07-13-2010, 03:17 PM   #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abernut View Post
I see that Cat's run around $100.
Since I nuttered mine, will putting one back in require any additional work in terms of vacuum lines, etc.
Thanks
A cat facilitates chemical reactions and typically does these things:

- Converts unburnt hydrocarbons to CO2 and water
- Converts nitrogen oxides to nitrogen and water
- Converts carbon monoxide to CO2

In general it's converting engine exhaust into more palatable chemicals (carbon dioxide, water, nitrogen)

Why do people remove cats? A catylitic converter makes a great deal of surface area for the chemical reactions to take place. This great surface area is made by a series of fine passages through which the exhaust passes. These fine passages increase so-called exhaust "back pressure" that is considered to be undesireable in a vehicle because it hampers performance. So, people remove cats because they think the engine will perform better. I can't cite you any specifics one way or the other, but I believe it's a small trade off in performance to get much more clean exhaust. People to a lot of things to their Jeeps in the name of performance and we all know that often people make changes that do not give any positive result.

Remember, the heart of the Nutter Bypass is to remove the computer from controlling the engine, and the other steps are to configure peripheral things (timing, stepper motor pins) to allow the engine/carb to run in an optimal manner now that the computer isn't doing it.

The Nutter doesn't have anytihng to do directly with the cat, so you should be OK. The cat will work on its own. The cat requires a source of oxygen and heat for the chemical reactions to take place. The heat comes from the exhaust itself which is why cats are not effective when the engine is first started. The oxygen also is delivered through the exhaust beacuse exhaust contains some oxygen. As long as your engine and carb are tuned correctly, then you'll have enough oxygen in the exhaust for the cat to work correctly. Like just about anything else, think of this all as a system where the various components are interconnected in some manner or another. Okay, I'm done now.
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Unread 07-13-2010, 03:34 PM   #175
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I drove the Jeep about 20 miles today and she ran great. The idle was a tad low on the way home, and I started to wonder if the curb idle screw had backed out.

I also started to wonder if I can construct a heat shield between the exhaust pipe and the tub near the driver's side floor in order to prevent so much heat from entering the tub. It gets really hot there, and in Houston I don't need that 11 1/2 months out of the year.

In other news, I opened the hood the other day and hung my drop light in one of the holes and this piece fell out:



I had never seen it before, and it looks like it was riveted in. The center hood latch has never worked right in this Jeep because the sheetmetal is mangled. So I wasn't surprised to see this piece fall out. Here's the area where the latch is supposed to connect:



Anyone have any ideas on the best way to fix this? Is the small metal piece even supposed to be there?
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Unread 07-14-2010, 12:23 AM   #176
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my hood looks the same. i just pulled all the stuff off of it. if you figure it out i'd like to see how it goes
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Unread 07-21-2010, 12:48 PM   #177
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The stud on my clutch fork rod (the adjustable linkage piece) is almost worn through. The stud looks to be maybe 1/4" and is probably 60% of the way gone. So I ordered a new one and will post comparison pics when I swap it. I also suspect that one of the 2 springs installed here should instead be on the clutch pedal instead.

I also bit the bullet and ordered 4 new shock absorbers. I have a vague hope that this will give me a smoother ride, but I doubt it. In either case my existing shocks are of unknown age but are rusty. I've run shocks for about 7 years before I started seeing rust on them, so I suspect these are pretty old.


I went with the Skyjacker Hydro 7000 series (H7023 is the part number for the Front shocks and H7058 is for the rear). These are fairly basic shocks and should fit the 4.5" lift.


I was going to start the valve cover gasket replacement last night until I realized I was out of carb cleaner and any other chemical to clean the metal surfaces. So I picked up some products at Napa today. I walked up to the counter to pay and the first thing the salesman wanted to know was how the CJ was doing.
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Last edited by Ken4444; 07-21-2010 at 12:49 PM.. Reason: Corrected spelling errors
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Unread 07-21-2010, 01:55 PM   #178
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You are doing your part to keep the economy in west Houston afloat!
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Unread 07-21-2010, 02:12 PM   #179
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Originally Posted by Ken4444 View Post
... I walked up to the counter to pay and the first thing the salesman wanted to know was how the CJ was doing.
there's no need to worry until the counter-guy's kids start calling you Uncle Ken...


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Unread 07-22-2010, 07:46 PM   #180
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Valve cover gasket install

Before I bought this CJ, the PO was up front about the fact that the valve cover leaked. He even had been using this industrial cotton gauze to soak up the leaked oil near the cover (he works at a petroleum plant). I kept an eye on the situation and it didn't look like a fast leak, but it was something I wanted to fix. I bought the replacement gasket and RTV a while back and finally got around to doing the job.

Here we see 3 pics some of the oil pooling on the right side of the engine (near the manifolds):

(I took these shots after pulling the screws out)







Here's the gasket which have been carefully trying to keep flat and straight while it's been gathering dust in the garage:



Wednesday night I pulled the valve cover. There were THREE different kinds of screws holding it on. Also, as a bonus, the PO had used hand-cut washers.

Not only were there 3 different kinds of screws, each of the three kinds used a different head. One was hex, one was allen metric, and one was allen standard. Greaaaaat. Two were 5/16" and one was 1/4".

I made a diagram of the screw layout so I'd know what was supposed to go where:



Hand-cut washers:



Before I could actually get the cover off, I had to pull a few connections. By the time I went to reinstall the cover, I had pulled: bypass hose, fuel line, vaccum lines, heater hose, choke wire, and probably more. Luckily I have enough time in the engine bay that I should be able to reconnect it all without any problems.

Here's a shot of the 258 without the valve cover:



I noticed something odd on the rocker arms. At first I thought it was grease, but when I went to wipe it off, I learned it was cured RTV. It must have gotten on there when the PO reinstalled the valve cover. You can see the RTV in red in this photo:



After I pulled the cover, I also learned that the PO didn't use a gasket. He just used RTV. No wonder it was leaking.

BUT, I also learned somthing else: The screws holding on the cover were not tight. Half of them were finger tight. The rest of them were faintly wrench tight. doh! I should have just tried tightening them first before going to the trouble to re-do the whole thing.

I spent the rest of Wednesday evening cleaning the valve cover, using a razor blade to scrape off the RTV. Here's the cleaned final product:



Tonight, I spent an hour cleaning the mating surface of the head. That was a pain, but that was the easy part.

Before breaking out the RTV, I decided to test-fit the screws. Upon doing this, I learned that they would not seat very far. Bingo! That's why the PO used the cut up washers.

Determined not to make shortcuts and mistakes, I drove to ORiley's to get shorter screws. No luck. Then I drove to Lowe's.. Bingo! They had all of the screws in a length that was 1/4" shorter than what the PO used. I bought what I needed and headed back home.

Here's the cover with one layer of RTV and the gasket:



I then applied another layer of RTV and seated the gasket on the head. That was a pain, but I finally got it on straight.

The first thing I realized was that the gasket tended to creep a bit, and i had to work to get the bolt holes lined up correctly. I then realized somthing else: I didn't need the shorter screws because the RTV and the gasket rendered my new screws too short! Da*n!

So I cleaned up the old screws and installed those. It took some work to get the gasket holes lined up. For the front and back screws, I ended up using a 6 x 1/4" bolt with the same sized threads. This made it far easier to get the bolt in, past the gasket. Once I got that in, I pulled it out and installed the correct screws. By the time this was all over I was cursing and had RTV in small spots all over my hands and shirt. If you have the option, please install your valve cover BEFORE you put the engine in the Jeep

By this time I needed some liquid refreshment, so I pulled a cherry-wheat homebrew out of the fridge:



After getting the screws in place, I backed out all the screws a bit and then finger tightened them. An hour later, after cleaning the garage, I turned them 1/4 turn as the RTV directions reccomended.

Tomorrow night I will torque them to 28 inch pounds per the FSM.

What did I learn? Don't fall into the trap that this is a quick repair. By the time you clean the surfaces you're at least an hour into it. Getting the cover on with the gasket lined up correctly is a pain. The rear screw (near the firewall) is a complete pain to get to. You can't really see it, and if you have an 80's CJ with all of the da*n wiring, it makes it difficult to get a wrench over the screw.
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