Ken's 1985 CJ7 refurbishment thread - Page 11 - JeepForum.com

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post #151 of 2557 Old 07-08-2010, 09:32 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skerr View Post
DAD-GONE, Son! You are going to have to think about expanding your line of work!
Thanks, but wait until I get it running right first!

Speaking of carbs, I disassembled one of the other BBDs on the workbench and dunked it into the carb cleaner bucket tonight. I'm not really sure why though. Maybe I can rebuild it using the extra parts from my rebuild kit, test it on the 258, and sell it on Ebay.


"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #152 of 2557 Old 07-08-2010, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken4444 View Post
Thanks, but wait until I get it running right first!

Speaking of carbs, I disassembled one of the other BBDs on the workbench and dunked it into the carb cleaner bucket tonight. I'm not really sure why though. Maybe I can rebuild it using the extra parts from my rebuild kit, test it on the 258, and sell it on Ebay.
I would bet a zillion dollars that you could do it!

Kerrdog
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But the right word at the right time... "Hey, give me a little hug!" That's the difference between lightning and a harmless lightning bug!
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post #153 of 2557 Old 07-09-2010, 06:14 AM
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What is the purpose of those pins in the intake manifold?
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post #154 of 2557 Old 07-09-2010, 06:29 AM Thread Starter
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What is the purpose of those pins in the intake manifold?
Just learned this today: That's the intake manifold heater, used to heat the incoming mixture to aide in combustion. After the engine is warmed up by coolant flowing through the intake manifold, the manifold heater is not needed.

Manifold Heater

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #155 of 2557 Old 07-09-2010, 08:36 PM Thread Starter
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Replacement bypass hose installed

It was a busy day at work so I didn't get to call Napa until 2 PM. When I did call, they didn't have Gates # 18763 (molded hose for Ford Escort) in stock, but said the warehouse had it. The salesman I spoke to said he would have the part at the store by 4PM that day, or by early the next morning. Either way they'd call me.

About 3:30 PM today he called and said he had the part at the store. I stopped by after 4:00 and picked it up. The part was marked with Napa number 10763 which might be house/Napa variant of the Gates part # 18763.

Anyhow, it was wider at one end and the salesman confirmed it was 5/8" at one end and a wider measurement at the other. I don't remember the decimal measurement, but it was larger than 5/8". I dropped my $16.29 and walked out.

Here's a shot of the new and old hoses on the bench:



The old hose was a 5/8" heater hose (both ends) and I suspect it became molded after being exposed to heat.

I test fit the new hose and it slipped on perfectly at each end. The wider (7/8") end fits on the thermostat housing, and the smaller 5/8" end fit onto the elbow sticking out of the intake manifold.

I ended up cutting about 5 inches off the thinner end (the end with the U shape) and I was good to go. Here are 2 shots showing the new hose installed:





A test run of the engine for several minutes didn't show any leaks.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #156 of 2557 Old 07-09-2010, 08:47 PM Thread Starter
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Carb woes

After installing the new bypass hose, I resumed work on the BBD. Long story short, no luck. I started from scratch by seating the idle mixture screws and backing out 5 turns. I had to fidget with the curb idle screw to keep the engine running. It was still hesitating and stalling around 650 RPM or so. After turning the idle mix screws in in 1/4" turn increments, still no luck. At one point the exhaust was blowing black smoke when I revved the engine. It was also really hot under the hood, and i went to check the temp gauge which was reading the usual 190 or so. I suspect the mix was way to rich and causing the black smoke and maybe the heat.

At this point I pulled the rebuilt carb and stuck on the old carb. I'm getting good at carb removal and reinstalls. It ran like a champ from the moment the engine started. I revved it a few times just to demonstrate to myself how the engine should perform. I could pull the throttle and the engine sped up or slowed down perfectly command.

I began reassembly of one of the other BBDs on the workbench with the intent of sticking it on tonight. Going against my better judgement, I drilled the jets to .032 which took all of about 1 minute. Thank goodness I had a small enough chuck for my Dremel to hold the tiny drill bit. I got the carb reassembled and adjusted in about 60 minutes but lacked the motivation to swap the carb yet again. So it's sitting on the bench. Maybe I'll do it tomorrow.



If I get the same poor performance and hesitation around 650 RPM with a different rebuilt unit, then I'm probably doing something wrong. (ie: user error rather than hardware problem) If the other rebuilt runs right then that might suggest either an improved rebuild procedure, or better hardware.

When rebuilding the second BBD I did notice it's newer than the other one. It's marked "Carter-Weber" whereas the other one is just "Carter". There are other small differences as well, plus this one has more number and letter markings all over the large parts.

The saga continues.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #157 of 2557 Old 07-10-2010, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
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Success! (at least so far)

I dropped on the second rebuild BBD and it runs like a champ. It only needed about 5 minues of tweaking and it purs right along. I will road test it shortly on a 10 mile round trip out to a family gathering.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #158 of 2557 Old 07-10-2010, 08:23 PM Thread Starter
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The test drive worked half well: I made the 5 mile trip there but didn't make it home.

The Jeep started up fine but then immediately sputtered and died. It never restarted. A quick check under the hood revealed that the carb wasn't squirting any fuel into the barrels when the throttle was moved. I didn't take the time to do any more diagnostics. I suspect that based on the way it died, it's not a spark problem because otherise it would have quit running more quickly instead of sputtering.

It seems like a fuel issue, especially based not getting fuel when the throttle moves. I will work on it in the morning and check 1) spark, and 2) fuel delivery at the carburetor fuel inlet pipe. If those are good perhaps the carb has problems. I'll stick on the old one and see if I can drive it home.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #159 of 2557 Old 07-10-2010, 08:44 PM
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I admire your determination!! Did you get her home yet?


Oops! Looking at the time of your post I would guess not.

Kerrdog
Go Fish! <*////><

But the right word at the right time... "Hey, give me a little hug!" That's the difference between lightning and a harmless lightning bug!

Last edited by Skerr; 07-10-2010 at 08:44 PM. Reason: add comment
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post #160 of 2557 Old 07-10-2010, 08:47 PM
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The Escort hose fits nice, I will need the hose too...good luck with the BBD.

1978 Cherokee, TBI 360/T400/QT...6.0/6L80/NP241C in the works...
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post #161 of 2557 Old 07-11-2010, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
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I admire your determination!! Did you get her home yet?


Oops! Looking at the time of your post I would guess not.
Not yet. Will be shortly.

1) Spark was good.
2) Fuel delivery to the filter was good.
3) Put on old carb and she fired up.
4) I did a disassembly of the rebuilt carb and it the bowl was mostly empty. I suspect the fuel inlet valve was stuck. Float level looked OK (1/2 inch).

When I get home I will install a different inlet valve.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #162 of 2557 Old 07-13-2010, 06:42 AM Thread Starter
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I installed a new inlet valve and the CJ got me to and from work on Monday without any problems. The high idle is about 200 RPM too high so I need to bump that down. Luckily, due to my crash course on BBDs, I know exactly why it's like that and how to fix it.

I don't know if I mentioned this or not: I finally got the rear view mirror attached to the windshield a while back. I had to buy a second round of adhesive and scrape the old adhesive off everything but it worked. The mirror has been holding secure for a couple of weeks.

After I put the new fuel inlet valve on the BBD and was listening to the 258 hum along and warm up the other night, I decided to strip off the steering wheel cover/grip that the PO had installed. (Original AMC steering wheel) The black gunk that started coming off the wheel was so bad I couldn't get any photos because I didn't want to get it on the camera.

I suspect the cover had been installed 13 or more years earlier by the previous previous owner. It was just a big buildup of grunge. Ideally I would have pulled the steering wheel but that would have made it a larger project. So I used a big supply or paper towels, 409 cleaner, and a small brush. After 45 minutes of work I removed all the black tar and grunge.

Removal of the cover makes the grip of the wheel different because I'm gripping onto a smaller diameter.

While I was working on the wheel I figured that I could remove the small rust spots on the steering wheel spokes. After working on those BBDs, I learned that XXXX steel wool does wonders for small rust spots on bare metal surfaces. It worked like a champ on the spokes. They looked good before but they're a step up now.

I used Armor All on the steering wheel (hoping it wouldn't be too slick) and some spray silicone on the spokes.

The "AMC" logo in the middle of the steering wheel is still yellowed though. That just adds character, right?

Every time I browse through the Quadratec or JC Whitney catalogs, I'm reminded that if one were to buy a lot of replacement parts for a CJ, it would be really expensive. it's one thing to have to replace a shifter knob for $8 but stuff like visors, coolant bottle, hinges, gauges, and everything else really adds up. So this always reinvigorates my enjoyment of trying to refurbish the parts in my CJ. These endeavors are usually just cosmetic but it's a pride of ownership thing for me. If I can use $3 of paper towels, silicone, and cleaner and 45 minutes of my time to make something look shiny, then I'm happy.

Even though there are more 1985 CJs on the road than most other years, I consider mine a survivor. It made it through at least 2 other POs and found its way here.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #163 of 2557 Old 07-13-2010, 07:01 AM
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Ken,

I have been debating rebuilding my Carter BBD on my '84. I think between what you have written in your thread and the process in the Jeep CJ Rebuilder's Manual, I may just tackle it.

Thanks,
Chris
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post #164 of 2557 Old 07-13-2010, 07:11 AM Thread Starter
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Ken,

I have been debating rebuilding my Carter BBD on my '84. I think between what you have written in your thread and the process in the Jeep CJ Rebuilder's Manual, I may just tackle it.

Thanks,
Chris
It's not easy, that's for sure. There are a lot of places where things can go wrong, but if you post photos and questions here, then we should be able to assist. I can advise you on some of the major pitfalls of the rebuild and the tuning.

What the FSM and carb kit directions don't give is a good general understanding of how parts of the carb are supposed to work. The relationship between the automatic choke, the linkages, and the fast idle cam is a good example of this. I never understood how all that was supposed to work until I had tinkered with them all for 2 weeks. Now I could describe it to a person in 5 minutes (or maybe a long paragraph) and feel pretty sure I had conveyed the knowledge.

There are still parts of the BBD that are a mystery to me though, so I'm no expert

The big problem is that after you take the BBD apart, you have nothing to go by except for diagrams and photos. For me, it was helpful to have another BBD sitting on the workbench as a guide, although at times I wasn't sure if that one was correct in all places.

"I give you a republic, if you can keep it." - Benjamin Franklin
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post #165 of 2557 Old 07-13-2010, 07:15 AM
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Is your choke system working correctly (Electric choke, choke pull-off, etc)

After rebuilding mine I couldn't figure out how to set the choke.


I ended up just adjusting it so the plate is wide open. It starts right up and runs great though.
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