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Unread 03-02-2009, 12:43 PM   #136
scottymac62
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1977 CJ5 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Locust Grove, GA
Posts: 1,465
Summit has their CDI on sale for $117 this week. What a deal!

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

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Unread 03-07-2009, 03:10 PM   #137
twoleos617
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1986 CJ7 
 
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Location: Louisville, Ky.
Posts: 2,026
OK. got the TR Upgrade done. HOLY COW!! what a freakin difference! The only thing I'll probably redo are my plug wires. I got Accell Pro series 8mm. they seem to work ok b/c the CJ SCREAMS down the road now but the boot fitment isnt that great. I'll get some MSD's instead. Hopefully my link below will work so you can see some before and after pics. Any constructive critasism is greatly appreciated!
http://s692.photobucket.com/albums/v...ush%20Upgrade/
P.S. anyone else wanting to do this, here's a tip...put the coil in first! I had to take the dist. apart again to get to the philips head and torx screws on the coil bracket.
Man I love this mod! cant wait to get to the Nutter!
Oh, one more thing. anyone know what the red wire dongle hanging off the + term. on my coil is?

Thx,
Mike
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Unread 03-10-2009, 11:15 PM   #138
vadmkat
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1978 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NY
Posts: 4
JP, I wanted to thank you for this great write up. I haven't had a chance to put in the upgrade yet (30 degree weather and no garage in upstate NY really limits my engine work time), but I'm finishing the parts purchase right now. I just wanted to clarify something - for the distributor adapter, is the AutoZone p/n F906 or F960? That's the only part that I haven't tracked down yet. I went to Advance Auto parts, and the c193AP adapter turned out to be a 4 cylinder distributor cap. I just did a quick search, and was able to find F960, which looks like the adapter, but f906 only gives me a hose fitting attachement.

- Nick K.
'78 CJ5, 258 I-6, bone stock


Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepHammer View Post
Advance Auto,
Cap Adapter, $6.49, p/n C193AP

Premium Distributor Cap, $31.98, p/n C193

Premium Rotor, $4.49, p/n D219


------------------------------------------------------

I would say the cap adapter, cap and rotor you have put together would work, if you can stand an ORANGE distributor cap!

------------------------------------------------------

Auto Zone
Cap Adapter, $4.99, p/n F906

Distributor Cap, $20.99, p/n F2104G

Rotor, $3.99, p/n F953
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Unread 03-11-2009, 01:25 AM   #139
JeepHammer
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Misprint...
Adapter, F-960, $4.99

From Advance Auto,
Take a look at the part number on the box on the right (Adapter)

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Unread 03-11-2009, 09:12 AM   #140
jblm59
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will this work on a 1974 258 cj5?
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Unread 03-11-2009, 10:43 AM   #141
JeepHammer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jblm59 View Post
will this work on a 1974 258 cj5?
READ THE THREAD, or at least the first two or three pages!

'74 is breaker points or Prestolite distributor...
You will need to UPGRADE the distributor to a '78 or '79 version...
$50 and drops right in so there aren't any issues there, and then everything else will work...
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Unread 03-11-2009, 11:51 AM   #142
L78THUMPER
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I am doing the upgrade to my 78 CJ with a 360 v8. I am using all MSD parts. Ford blaster2 ign. coil #8205. MSD #8414 cap-a-dapt kit (ALL BRASS TERM.) and MSD 8.5 ign wires #31189 also a set of wire seperators!!! Can't wait to feel how much better it will be.
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Unread 03-11-2009, 08:54 PM   #143
namredla
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JeepHammer,
Great thread, I have read it 5 or 6 times not to make sure it all soaks in. I have an 83 CJ7 torn all the way down right now and am coming to a close on body work and moving to the mechanical phase. The jeep ran (barely) before I took everything apart, but now I just have a bare engine sitting on a chassis. I am going to attempt to go back with a weber 32/36, nutter bypass, team rush upgrade, MSD ignition module and e-coil, and install a painless wiring harness all at the same time. In some respects I hope that makin all of these changes at once may make it simpler in that I can just integrate the systems and start from scratch. But, what worries me is that I am making a LOAD of changes without the ability to troubleshoot each change as I go. Any advice on how you would approach this without compounding problems?

As I said, I have read this whole thread several times over and believe that I have a resonably firm grasp on the why's and how's of each individual upgrade / addition, but wondered if the approach would differ with all of these at once.

Also, just as a backcheck, I purchased everything that Keith460 had on this post http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/what-should-i-use-642360/

I think that this is exactly what you list in this thread. Any help is greatly appreciated as I am a bit nervous about getting this thing kicked off right.

Thanks,

Alex
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Unread 03-11-2009, 08:55 PM   #144
scottymac62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L78THUMPER View Post
I am doing the upgrade to my 78 CJ with a 360 v8. I am using all MSD parts. Ford blaster2 ign. coil #8205. MSD #8414 cap-a-dapt kit (ALL BRASS TERM.) and MSD 8.5 ign wires #31189 also a set of wire seperators!!! Can't wait to feel how much better it will be.
I did my upgrade yesterday on my 304 and boy what a difference! It's like I have a brand new engine installed (as far as idle and power goes). Good bye to cold starts! It runs so smooth and has so much more pep when I step on the peddle that it's unbelievable!

I used the following parts to get my 304's ignition upgraded

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

Last edited by scottymac62; 05-10-2009 at 06:12 AM..
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Unread 03-11-2009, 11:35 PM   #145
JeepHammer
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Glad to hear it worked for you!
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Unread 03-12-2009, 04:12 AM   #146
jeepdude1987
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Ugh that is a little excesive to wade allllllllll the way through this late at night. I love it, but I will have to read the parts that are usefull to me again. I just want to thank you JeepHammer for doing this. I have been stalking "Teamrush upgrade" post and therefore just about stalking you inadvertantly.LOL

I have some more Q even though you have answered more question than I had when I started.
My coil is bad (or as I found out 2night just the ground to the coil could be bad, but I'll check that latter). So I bought all new parts to do the basic cap, rotor, and wire upgrade as well as the E-coil upgrade, but I haven't had the time to put them on. So I was wondering since I am strapped for cash (Slow economy) would I really be losing anything if I took the Ecoil back and got a factory style coil?

Also, if I later add a CDI would I then want to add the E-coil?

And, finally, since I had bought all the parts to upgrade to the Ecoil I was looking at the ecoil harness adapter and the factory coil harness conection, and I noticed that there are 3 wires on the factory harness and 2 on the ecoil harness.(if I remember correctly) How would that be dealt with in the basic upgrade, and would it change any if I added a CDI?

I know that last Q is something that had sort of been covered before, but the answer didn't quite make sense. The other 2 are opinions which you seem fairly willing to give so long as people understand when you are giving them as aposed to facts.

Thanks so much, and don't hate me cause I have square eyes(YJ). I just wasn't cool enough for a CJ this time, but I'm improving.

One more Q just for fun if you had my '87 YJ what would you figure the best ignition setup for it would be considering the engine won't be getting built any and it will be a daily driver?
__________________
[COLOR="Red"]1987 Wrangler YJ RED[/COLOR] 4.2 5-speed, NP231, BFG 31x10.5R15 AT/KO on 15x8 gambler wheels.
[COLOR="Yellow"]Caution!!! Under construction!!!!!! Caution!!![/COLOR]
Finishing a 4.0 Cyl.head swap, Just got an AX-15 NP231J combo to replace the busted t-case and craptacular BA10/5. Adding Nutter bypass. Probably more to come before it is back as a DD!
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Unread 03-12-2009, 10:07 AM   #147
JeepHammer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by namredla View Post
I have an 83 CJ7....
The jeep ran (barely) before I took everything apart, but now I just have a bare engine sitting on a chassis.

I am going to attempt to go back with a weber 32/36, nutter bypass, team rush upgrade, MSD ignition module and e-coil, and install a painless wiring harness all at the same time.

In some respects I hope that makin all of these changes at once may make it simpler in that I can just integrate the systems and start from scratch.

But, what worries me is that I am making a LOAD of changes without the ability to troubleshoot each change as I go. Any advice on how you would approach this without compounding problems?
Painless is pretty well 'Idiot Proof' if you have done ANY wiring before.
Diagnosing a wiring harness is pretty easy, you get a test light and it either provides 12 volts to the wire you are working on,
Or it doesn't... In which case you look to see why...

The ignition system will be a 'Stand Alone', so diagnosing any potential problems in it will be a SNAP...

Webers on the other hand, are always a challenge, and I don't do ANY diagnostics or tuning over the internet on a Weber...

As for the ignition hookup, keep the engine harness,
Alternator, distributor to module, ect.
that doesn't come with Painless, and unless you want to rebuild all that from scratch (which isn't hard, just time consuming) you should keep the old engine harness and the harness plugs from it.

Quote:
As I said, I have read this whole thread several times over and believe that I have a resonably firm grasp on the why's and how's of each individual upgrade / addition, but wondered if the approach would differ with all of these at once.
No. This thread is about a 'Tune Up'.
Cap, rotor, plug wires, and maybe a coil change.
All VERY simple stuff.

Quote:
Also, just as a backcheck, I purchased everything that Keith460 had on this post http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=642360
Usually when I comment only once, or don't comment at all on a thread, I don't agree with what's going on.

I'm not so arrogant as to tell people what they CAN, and CAN NOT use on their own personal vehicles...
If you guys want to use Ingleese Clone carbs, that's entirely up to you.
I'm just not going to participate in that fiasco so I'm not blamed for the eventual outcome later!

Quote:
I think that this is exactly what you list in this thread. Any help is greatly appreciated as I am a bit nervous about getting this thing kicked off right.
No, it's a cluster f**k of mismatched parts from NAPA and discount stores, Weber, ect.
Like I said, people are allowed to use ANYTHING they want to! It's not up to me to dictate what they MUST use...

All I can do is give advice...
Use BRASS terminal distributor caps..., Not brass washed aluminum or just plain Aluminum,

Don't use cheap or 'Discount' plug wires.
If you do the Upgrade correctly, you have moved the 'Weak Link' to the plug wires...
So don't use 'Store Brand' or 'Discount' plug wires.
Use MSD wires on V-8 engines,
Use MSD or Autolite wires on I-6 engine.

If you use an CDI module, then you should know you just increased the load on the plug wires by 500% or 600%!
USE THE MSD WIRES!

When you buy an ignition coil, don't buy store brands!
MSD, Borg Warner, Ford, ect.
Don't jump off for those fancy 'Import' coils with the aluminum housing...
Aluminum housing or not, it's still an IMPORT coil!

It's all pretty simple, and I've outlined and dissected every piece one at a time here so everyone knows the difference if they do some reading...
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Unread 03-12-2009, 11:32 AM   #148
JeepHammer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepdude1987 View Post
My coil is bad (or as I found out 2night just the ground to the coil could be bad, but I'll check that latter).
Coils don't have grounds.
Coils have Positive power into them,
And the 'Negative' wire connection is switched 'On' & 'Off' by the module.
There is no 'Ground' to the coil.

(The high voltage will seek 'Ground' through the spark plug gap, but that is no where near 'Grounding' the ignition coil)
------------------------------------------

Quote:
So I was wondering since I am strapped for cash (Slow economy) would I really be losing anything if I took the Ecoil back and got a factory style coil?
Read the first two or three posts and you will find out that for an I-6 engine, using the FACTORY CANISTER COIL will give you slightly more spark energy than the E-core coil.

V-8 engine run in RPM ranges above the abilities of the Canister coil,
But I-6 engines have less cylinders firing, and operate at lower RPM, so the canister coil works fine for them.
--------------------------------

Quote:
Also, if I later add a CDI would I then want to add the E-coil?
Later, if you add CDI, all the Canister Coil's problems disappear!
400 volts will make the slow saturation issue disappear in a heart beat!
----------------------------------

Quote:
And, finally, since I had bought all the parts to upgrade to the Ecoil I was looking at the ecoil harness adapter and the factory coil harness conection, and I noticed that there are 3 wires on the factory harness and 2 on the ecoil harness.(if I remember correctly) How would that be dealt with in the basic upgrade, and would it change any if I added a CDI?
Simple, you clip one of the 'Green' wire off the connector, or tape it over.
------------------------------------

Quote:
I know that last Q is something that had sort of been covered before, but the answer didn't quite make sense.
The other 2 are opinions which you seem fairly willing to give so long as people understand when you are giving them as aposed to facts.
Sorry, I only deal in 'Facts'.
Opinions can be anything from UFO's caused my ignition problems to "God hates me" for an excuse.

I deal in electrical and mechanical FACTS.

If I feel something is important enough to mention, there is a mechanical or electrical REASON I though it should be brought up...
-------------------------------

Quote:
One more Q just for fun if you had my '87 YJ what would you figure the best ignition setup for it would be considering the engine won't be getting built any and it will be a daily driver?
Daily Driver?
Now, let's talk terminology...

'Jeep' and 'Daily Driver' create an 'Oxymoron'

Oxymoron.
noun. oxymora
1. A rhetorical figure in which incongruous or contradictory terms are combined, as in a deafening silence and a mournful optimist.

2. A 'Jeep' as a 'Daily Driver.


Jeeps are an aerodynamic brick. It's like driving a drag car with the parachute out!

OK around town at slow speeds, but Jeep SWB (Short Wheel Base, CJs YJs) were NEVER intended to run 60 & 75 MPH down the highway!
They are TOO Narrow to be stable, so they are top heavy,
Too shot to be controllable in a slide situation,
And underpowered for fast highway travel.

CJs were designed to go a very low speeds over terrain that a mountain goat would get cold feet!
-------------------------------

Daily Driver,
Stock distributor, upgraded cap, rotor, plug wires,
Some fresh plugs that are properly prepared,
And a CDI module so I could extract every bit of power from that expensive fuel I had to buy.

I'd pick a gear ratio that worked on the highway for me,
I'd stay away from aggressive lug tires that are too tall or wide,
And I'd look into 5 or 6 speed Manual transmission...

And NOTHING BEATS FUEL INJECTION!
Learn to tune a fuel injections system and you will be VERY happy with your Jeep...
--------------------------------

YJ, an old Indian term meaning,
"CJ that Doesn't Leak behind the dash panel!
"
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Unread 03-12-2009, 02:25 PM   #149
namredla
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JH,

Understood, and I now see where I went wrong. I am going to go with the MSD e-coil and the distributor cap, adapter, and rotor that you recommended in your write-up. I would also be willing to go with MSD plug wires, but I do not see anything listed on their site that fits the AMC 258. Am I looking for another set?

Alex
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Unread 03-12-2009, 03:58 PM   #150
JeepHammer
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NOTHING FITS AN AMC V-8 CORRECTLY... With the 'Correct' terminals for the job...

SO, get the 'Cut To Fit' and make your plug wires do EXACTLY what they need to do.
The kit (MSD p/n 3119) comes with a stripping guide/crimping tool so you get things put together correctly,
And they come with BOTH sets of ends, so getting the correct ends on your plug wires and coil wire is no problem at all.

-----------------------

For a 258 I-6 engine that is never going to see the high side of 4,000 RPM,
I'd use a set of plug wires intended for a Ford or Jeep...
For the CANISTER COIL, a set of plug wires for Ford Pick Up with 300 CID I-6 engine. That will come with the correct length wires and the correct coil wire. (as I've explained several places in this thread)

If yoiu are using a E-core coil, then get a set of plug wires for a '94 Jeep anything with 4.0L I-6 engine and they will fit right on the upgraded cap and the coil wire will fit correctly. (as I've explained several places in this thread)
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