I 258 overheating - JeepForum.com

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post #1 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 12:30 AM Thread Starter
munsterrman
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I 258 overheating

Hi,
I'm stumped on this overheating issue I have been dealing for a while now. I searched all previous posts and nothing seemed to work yet. Here is my situation.
-4.2L 258 open cooling system with no overflow tank.
-new thermostat 195 DEG.,new radiator, water pump checks good and new hoses. System has been flushed out and is refilled with 50/50 mix.
-new temp gauge and sending unit.

At idle engines starts to warm up and climb to "HOT" after 5 minutes or so. seems like thermostat is not opening but I tested the thermostat before installing in boiling water and it opens at proper temp.
Tried bleeding the system by loosening the sending unit and no luck, fluid did come out but no luck yet. Still overheats.
After a while in "HOT" radiator upper hose is hot and two hoses going int the heater core. Tried pinching the upper rad. hose and I see no rush of coolant in the radiator. while engine is running at idle coolant tends to go up and start spilling out the radiator top and keeps coming out after shutting down. I refilled and same thing keeps happening. This is the second new thermostat and same thing tested in boiling water and its good. Ran without a thermostat and I see the rush of coolant when accelarated,so the water pump is working. Any help is appreciated.

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post #2 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 02:06 AM
macscal
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Check your fan clutch?
Is your fan shroud in place?
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post #3 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 03:01 AM
VooDoo2
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are you sure the thermostat is the right one? Ive seen them get locked closed when fitted as something fouls on it within the housing
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post #4 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 03:22 AM
bamasteeler
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sorry if this sounds stupid but is thermostat installed facing the right way??

1980 Jeep CJ7
AMC 258, T176, D300,
AMC 20 REAR, D30 FRONT

1999 XJ CLASSIC
RC 3" front AAL rear
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post #5 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 03:23 AM
Mike Romain
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Wrong water pump maybe? You don't say when this started, only the parts in it.

They make 2 flavours of pumps, one is a reverse rotation pump for a serpentine belt. I have seen and read of those going on the wrong engine. Your lack of circulation implies the wrong one maybe.

Mike
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post #6 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 03:46 AM
86cj74.2L
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Water will push out the filler neck from expansion.

It overheats with the rad cap on?

Do you have a temp gun? More than one person on here had a faulty reading temp gauge and pulled their hair out for no good reason.

As water gets hot its volume increase. That by itself will push out water.

Fill system leaving 1 inch of air below the top of rad. Start engine and let run. Just before water comes out the filler neck put cap on tight. Then use a temp gun and watch the temp at the thermostat housing. Hoses will be too hot to touch at 130 degrees. So you can't go by hot hoses.

A temp gum is one tool / gadget everyone should have in their toolbox. And now they are cheep. I bought mine used for 100 back in the mid 90's.

Also it would be good to have your antifreeze tested for combustion gasses........for a blown head gasket.
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post #7 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 09:14 AM
LumpyGrits
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Make sure the t'stat is facing the 'rite' way.
Make sure the water pump rotation is correct. There is a std and reverse rotation(serpentine belt)models.
Did it overheat w/o the t'stat?
Can you post pictures of your setup, so we all can see?
What fan are you using?
LG

Have'n you along, is like loose'n 2 good men
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post #8 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 09:48 AM
SLO_Ken
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Quote:
Do you have a temp gun? More than one person on here had a faulty reading temp gauge and pulled their hair out for no good reason.
This. DO NOT rely on the factory temp gauge.

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post #9 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 09:55 AM
Spieg8
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Is the Jeep actually over heating (steam blows out of the cap/overflow), or are you just going by the needle reading on the gauge (gauge could be reading inaccurately)?

I would also suspect the wrong water pump. Do you have V-belt or serpentine (an 80 CJ would normally be v-belt, but people sometimes convert to serpentine)? A reverse rotation pump will still move coolant, but not as much as it should.

Also a word of caution about t-stat testing. Testing in hot water is a good way to see if the valve opens, but don't use boiling water. You said you t-stat is rated at 195 degrees so to test it you don't need water any warmer than that (it should actually start to open at about 180 and be fully open at 195). For water to boil, it has to be at least 225 degrees, and that much heat can actually break the t-stat thermo coupling.

Do yourself (and the environment) a favor and spend a few bucks to get a catch bottle for the overflow. Probably won't affect your operating temperature but it's the responsible thing to do.
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post #10 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 10:01 AM
LumpyGrits
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLO_Ken View Post
This. DO NOT rely on the factory temp gauge.
NEVER-ever trust any Jeep OEM gauge!
LG

Have'n you along, is like loose'n 2 good men
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post #11 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 10:06 AM
LumpyGrits
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spieg8 View Post
Is the Jeep actually over heating (steam blows out of the cap/overflow), or are you just going by the needle reading on the gauge (gauge could be reading inaccurately)?

I would also suspect the wrong water pump. Do you have V-belt or serpentine (an 80 CJ would normally be v-belt, but people sometimes convert to serpentine)? A reverse rotation pump will still move coolant, but not as much as it should.

Also a word of caution about t-stat testing. Testing in hot water is a good way to see if the valve opens, but don't use boiling water. You said you t-stat is rated at 195 degrees so to test it you don't need water any warmer than that (it should actually start to open at about 180 and be fully open at 195). For water to boil, it has to be at least 225 degrees, and that much heat can actually break the t-stat thermo coupling.

Do yourself (and the environment) a favor and spend a few bucks to get a catch bottle for the overflow. Probably won't affect your operating temperature but it's the responsible thing to do.
Not correct....
Water boils at 212* at sea level.
The temp to boil is even less in Denver(203*).
A 195* t'stat starts to open at 195*, and is fully open at 205*
LG

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post #12 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 10:27 AM
Matt1981CJ7
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Umm...not to start a physics debate, but the boiling point of water at any elevation is largely dependent on barometric pressure, which changes with weather.

LG is correct, the t-stat rating is the point at which it starts to open, and it fully opens 10-20* higher.

And to give the OP something else to consider, engine tuning can also have a major impact on temps.

Matt
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post #13 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 10:34 AM
LumpyGrits
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Higher the ASL is. Lower the boil'n temp. That's why we run 'pressure' caps on our radiators to raise the boil temp and coolant helps here also.
A lean fuel mix when cause a engine to run hot as will incorrect ign timing.
LG

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post #14 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 10:54 AM
1949er
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Same symptoms as I had when I got a pump that was miss boxed , serp. pump in a v-belt box , my fault for not doing a visual compare but in getting the correct pump I got back enough $$$ to cover lost coolant .
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post #15 of 31 Old 03-18-2014, 11:55 AM
Spieg8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LumpyGrits View Post
Not correct....
Water boils at 212* at sea level.
The temp to boil is even less in Denver(203*).
You are correct.. My bad. I was thinking of a pressurized system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LumpyGrits View Post
A 195* t'stat starts to open at 195*, and is fully open at 205*
LG
Not sure I agree with this. The dozen or so t-stats I've observed began to open a little below the rated temp and opened fully at rated temp. But I'm not going to argue based on my limited experience.

Regardless, my point is still valid. A pot of boiling water can be hot enough to damage a t-stat (and never test while pot is on the stove as heat can be passed from the metal bot/burner to the t-stat). Best practice would use a thermometer to verify the water temp before dunking the t-stat.
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