How to get a 258 running smooth with a weber - Page 3 - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep CJ Forum > How to get a 258 running smooth with a weber

FS: 2007-2013 Jeep Wrangler "HALO" Angel Eye KitBrand New! Quadratec LED Headlights!FS: Wranger BRIGHT License Plate LED! Just $3! Great value

Reply
Unread 05-09-2012, 11:10 AM   #31
mcmud
Web Wheeler
1983 CJ8 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: N.E. Alabama
Posts: 2,650
Maybe this one will help.
A possible downside; Many canister purge signal valves leak, verify that your's will hold vacuum prior to using this layout.

weber-ported-advance-w-2port-cto-02.jpg  
mcmud is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 02:15 PM   #32
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Ok thank you mcmud, now just to be sure.....the canister purge, is that the same as the vapor canister that is tucked down on the drivers side fire wall? Also my PCV valve has only one nozzle, do I just split the line and have it go both places.

And thanks!

I got rid of the FPR, the extra filter, and the electric pump. I got it idling pretty good around 500-600 rpms, it has a little bit of a shake but no pops in the exhaust, is there a way to make it perfectly smooth? Also, this is when it is warm, when cold its a pain to keep running, Keith how do you keep you rpms higher until it warms. I messed with the screw behind the choke and it keeps the idle high, but if I even tap the throttle it clicks down and go back to low idle, how do you get yours to stay?

Thanks guys
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 03:05 PM   #33
Matt1981CJ7
Web Wheeler
 
Matt1981CJ7's Avatar
1981 CJ7 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Elbert, CO
Posts: 10,029
kovic,

You really need to get your head around how a carb, with an electric choke operates.

Upon a cold start, you should "set the choke" by flooring the throttle once. This will close the butterflies and engage the high idle setting. The high idle will remain until you blip the throttle again, which disengages the high idle. You should allow the high idle to remain until the engine reaches normal operating temp before touching the throttle.

I think you are fighting with a normal operating choke.

Matt
Matt1981CJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 03:22 PM   #34
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Matt, thanks, and sorry..... i dont understand all this stuff yet, but im learning! thanks to you guys. So basically, let the jeep sit in high idle till it warms, and then begin driving it.

thanks
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 04:25 PM   #35
keith460
Jeep. There's Only One
 
keith460's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Doylestown, PA
Posts: 4,781
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcmud View Post
There certainly is. A manifold vacuum signal is present at all times other than the short lived blip to 0" at the very onset of hammering the pedal. In fact overall its signal is very near, at times identical to the Weber DGxV "S" port vacuum. Then they differ to the extreme at idle.... if the throttle plate is set as it should be... below the "S" port.
Yes there is, my mistake. That's what I get for answering after having one to many beers watching the Philadelphia Flyers lose to the NJ Devils. Happy hour can be hard to shake off sometimes.
__________________
.
1984 CJ-7 Renegade
__________________

Restoration Thread:http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=434226
keith460 is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 04:28 PM   #36
keith460
Jeep. There's Only One
 
keith460's Avatar
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Doylestown, PA
Posts: 4,781
Quote:
Originally Posted by kovic View Post
Mine doesn't have the stock aircleaner, and my CTO only has two ports.
I have the OEM air cleaner but only the two port version CTO valve as well. I thought most of the multi port version CTO was on Calif model Jeeps or prior to 1983?

What mcmudd and I posted as far as vacuum routing will work either way for your engine.
__________________
.
1984 CJ-7 Renegade
__________________

Restoration Thread:http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=434226
keith460 is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 08:44 PM   #37
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Thank you, I did re route my vacuum, and it seems to be doing pretty good. The idle, when warm, seems pretty good. I took it for a spin, and it has more power for sure, even chirped the tires in second

However after hard acceleration and a fast stop it did stall on me, but I'm not sure how much gas is in it as the gauge does not work, I also noticed my rubber hose going to the carb has a hard angle and is slightly kinked, so ill straighten that out and test to see if it will stall on me still. When its still cold, the idle is not very smooth, but when it warms it gets smoother, thats normal right?

Also, the hesitation was not as bad ,in first and second its almost non existent, in third and fourth it does hesitate, but in higher gears at lower speeds thats normal right?

Thanks again, I think its getting closer to its potential!
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 09:16 PM   #38
mcmud
Web Wheeler
1983 CJ8 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: N.E. Alabama
Posts: 2,650
Quote:
Originally Posted by kovic View Post
Thank you, I did re route my vacuum, and it seems to be doing pretty good. The idle, when warm, seems pretty good. I took it for a spin, and it has more power for sure, even chirped the tires in second

However after hard acceleration and a fast stop it did stall on me, but I'm not sure how much gas is in it as the gauge does not work, I also noticed my rubber hose going to the carb has a hard angle and is slightly kinked, so ill straighten that out and test to see if it will stall on me still. When its still cold, the idle is not very smooth, but when it warms it gets smoother, thats normal right?

Also, the hesitation was not as bad ,in first and second its almost non existent, in third and fourth it does hesitate, but in higher gears at lower speeds thats normal right?

Thanks again, I think its getting closer to its potential!
Stalling at the stop is a clear indication of needing more fuel flow below the throttle plate. I suggest that you once more run through the lean best setting this time starting with the hot engine and the mixture screw preset at least 3 turns out, air filter in place and vacuum advance tube disconnected and plugged.

Rough idle while the choke system is in play; Need more info.
What is the startup rpm?
Is the choke plate completely closing when you set the choke with the pedal prior to startup?
Does it start with a smooth idle and then drop off to a rough idle in say one minute?
mcmud is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-09-2012, 11:34 PM   #39
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
hey mcmud. The fuel flow may have been hindered by the slightly kinked line, so ill try it again after I straighten it.

It has a rough idle until it gets hot.

The startup rpm is probably around 1000, yes the choke is completely closed at the beginning, the idle is fairly smooth when I first start it with the higher rpms, and it stays that way until I hit the throttle, then it goes down to around 600. The hot idle of around 600 stays constant even after a minute.

Thanks
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-10-2012, 07:10 AM   #40
mcmud
Web Wheeler
1983 CJ8 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: N.E. Alabama
Posts: 2,650
Quote:
Originally Posted by kovic View Post
hey mcmud. The fuel flow may have been hindered by the slightly kinked line, so ill try it again after I straighten it.
Yes I'm aware that it could be the cause.

Two points which prompted me to make that comment is related to the fact that it had ample fuel to start, warm-up, get you to the place that you applied the hard acceleration and then stalled at the stop.
Their would be ample fuel within the channels and well to temporally accommodate an idle speed even if the bowl fuel sheared from the main jets from the stop in motion, it had ample fuel in reserve for the low rpm idle if it restarted in the typical manner.

The other point is that in all the years of working with the DGxV I have never seen a lean best idle achieved, nor read of it, with 1-3/4 turns on the mixture screw. That setting indicates a very rich mixture is available to be metered in flow by that screw. This brings a thought that the primary idle jet may be stamped under sized or you've over run the *sweet spot* at the setting you've reported.

None of this is an effort to keep you from re-routing that supply line.
It's simply another attempt to help you to find the DGxV able to suit your desire....smooth runs.

Quote:
It has a rough idle until it gets hot.

The startup rpm is probably around 1000, yes the choke is completely closed at the beginning, the idle is fairly smooth when I first start it with the higher rpms, and it stays that way until I hit the throttle, then it goes down to around 600. The hot idle of around 600 stays constant even after a minute.

Thanks
Prior to the next cold start give the fast idle speed screw about 1/4 twist in.
At the start be ready with screwdriver in hand to tweak that screw asap.

The fast idle is recommended to be set between 1350 and 1700rpm.
mcmud is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-10-2012, 02:34 PM   #41
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Oh, the fast idle is suppose to be that high, ok I will try that. And I will also start (when warm) with the mixture screw out 3 turns and then see where it lands with the best idle.

Now you said the canister may not hold vacuum.. Well i noticed when a slight amount of throttle was given I would hear a consistant psst,psst,psst,psst and so on. It took me a while to find out what it was from, but it is coming from the canister, The purge signal, I thinks thats what its called, its the nipple that is higher than the rest. When I unplugged the line from it and held my finger over the nipple it made that psst sound non stop. Is this a leak?

Thanks
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-11-2012, 02:42 PM   #42
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Ok, I tinkered with it some more. I got the mixture screw out to around 2, maybe just a hair under. But if I go out with it even a hair more, the exhaust starts to pop. Also filled it with gas, and unkinked the gas line. Took it for a drive and it still stalls on me if I accelerate hard then let off fast.

Last edited by kovic; 05-11-2012 at 03:28 PM..
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-11-2012, 05:42 PM   #43
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Ok, I gave in and put the .80 primary jet that I have in. It seemed to idle better, tiny shakes. It did stall after hard acceleration, so I turned the mixture screw in a tad, then tried again, it stalled but instantly started back up (judging by the oil pressure gauge). So I turned the mixture screw in a tad more then it did not stall on me, at least for the few test drives I took it on.

The lean best idle with the .80 turned out to be 1 1/2 turns out on the mixture screw.... And I know everyone is going to say that is not right, I'm just confused on what to try next, I know it should be able to run good with the .75 but I just dont know what else to try....
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-11-2012, 06:23 PM   #44
swatson454
Mall-crawlin' Hot Rodder
 
swatson454's Avatar
1983 CJ7 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Dripping Springs, TX (soon)
Posts: 4,803
Sounds fishy. It might be worth your time to go back and double-check your float setting.

Did you hold the top vertically and measure from the side, flush against the gasket to the bottom, inside corner of the float?...

__________________
Live in a way that those who know you but don't know God will come to know God because they know you.
swatson454 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-11-2012, 06:47 PM   #45
kovic
Registered User
1983 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 601
Well was wrong, didnt stall because my linkage bound again causing the rpms to be higher... put a beefier spring on so hopefully it will pull it back,which it did, and now it stalls again.

Swatson, I actually checked it today, I did it to the farthest point away from needle, but ill do it again to the inside corner, and just to be sure....18 mm correct? Or 3/4 inch according to your pic?

Thank you for responding, I'll go readjust float now... and I'll put the .75 primary back in...even tho the .8 allows a smoother idle for me. But I want to make it work.
kovic is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


Suggested Threads





Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.