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Unread 08-30-2002, 11:41 PM   #1
antman
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Is this even possible ?

ok, I am rebuilding from ground up a 78 CJ7. As you know, it has the TH400 tranny and quadratrac unit.

This Jeep is going to be a daily driver when finished. I want fuel injection, and also MPG. I really dont want to do a chevy drop in at this point, but havent ruled it out.

First idea was to rebuild the 304 which is spent. Down the road, toss on a fuel injection kit. When I saw prices, it hurt. Nothing is cheap I know, but dang, has to be a better way all around.

I have seen numerous 4.0 swaps into cj's, but they are all in later models. I want to keep the tranny and quad unit, since they been rebuilt, ready to go, and I want auto with tilt ( call me silly )

I know the 4.0 will go in, but, the problem here is there even an adpater for the tranny to mount up ? I have read that the TH400 needs the power of the V8. Guys, need some guidence here.

Thanks;

Jim

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Unread 08-31-2002, 11:48 AM   #2
CSP
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No adapter is needed. AMC straight sixes and V8's share the same bellhousing bolt pattern. The problem you will run into is the crank position sensor. The 4.0 engines have it located on the flywheel (flexplate on an auto) and your bellhousing will need to be adapted for the sensor to bolt to it. Unfortunately a flexplate which has the sensor in it won't bolt to the torque convertor on the T400. One way around both problems is a harmonic balancer mounted CPS from Hesco. It is expensive though, but I don't know of any other options. Check Novak Adapter's website to see if there's any info there. They tend to have more technical knowledge than Advance does and build better adapters IMO. www.novak-adapt.com
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Unread 08-31-2002, 04:20 PM   #3
antman
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Went to Novak, good information about my tranny and all. They say a V8 would be better suited for my tranny. Since it requires anywhere from 12 to 20 % of the power.

WIll do some more homework, no rush, guess the motor will be the last thing to do. That should give me time to decide and maybe come across a bargin to help influence me as well lol.

Anyone have a CJ7 with quad and TH400 with a 6 cyl ? Wondering how it performs. Is it a dog or what ?


Thanks for the help;

Jim
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Unread 09-03-2002, 04:23 PM   #4
antman
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This is exactly what your talking about CSP correct ?


4.0L Crank sensor relocation kit.


This kit aids in the installation of a 4.0L engine into an early model Jeep that does not have a provision for the stock sensor.
It can also be used when installing a Turbo 400 or 700R4 transmission. This kit re-locates the firing pattern and crank sensor to the front of the engine. This eliminates the problem of drilling the bellhousing and indexing a stock sensor.

So, if this solves that problem, thats cool. What exactly do I need to get then ? Getting a 4.0 should be hard, it's finding a donor in my area thats the hard part. So, what exactly is needed ? CSP, you done this before or what ? lol

Jim

Last edited by antman; 09-03-2002 at 04:50 PM..
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Unread 09-03-2002, 10:17 PM   #5
CSP
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Yep that's what I was talking about. Now you'll need to find a 4.0 flexplate that will bolt to the 400's torque convertor. Novak should be able to help with that one.

I've never swapped a 4.0 with a T400 behind it, but I have with other transmissions. It's a pretty easy swap.
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Unread 09-04-2002, 06:48 AM   #6
lynn
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A good friend of mine just did the 4.0L swap into his '79 CJ7. This CJ also has a non-stock TH400/D20 combo (probably from a Cherokee).
He did relocate the crank sensor to the front.
Overall, I think he has just under $1K into this swap. The 4.0L (from a '94 ZJ) is WELL suited to the TH400 in this light vehicle, it has great acceleration, easily chirps in 2nd, and is getting ~19 mpg...
I'll ask him to check in on this thread, maybe he can help with other questions, like the flexplate, etc..
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Unread 09-04-2002, 08:52 AM   #7
antman
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Excellent !

Once I plan this out, I know it will be well worth it. Gas mileage, power and fuel injection. I was looking at over all horsepower, and its like 180 for the 4.0, my V8 if I rebuild it is at 150. For a daily driver, and hunting rig, the 4.0 really makes the most sense.

Now, getting the parts to make it work wont be hard, getting a donor vehicle/motor and accessories at a good price, I think thats the hard part.

Hesco for the reloacation for the sensor
Novak for the flexplate ( still gotta look for that on thier site/email em )

Progress..thanks guys, for the time and answers. I am feeling more confident everyday. Now to convince my wife on this idea. She already wants garage back, but CJ is down to frame.

Thanks;

Jim
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Unread 09-04-2002, 10:04 AM   #8
CSP
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Antman check with www.jeepconnection.com for the crankshaft dampner kit. They sell Hesco parts and are usually cheaper than buying directly from Hesco. They may not have it listed on their website, so be sure and call them if you don't see it.
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Unread 09-05-2002, 07:07 PM   #9
antman
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Best place for 6 cyl engine mounts ? Love them bolt ups, so easy.
Anyone have em laying around from thier V8 upgrade ?


Just gotta see about the flexplate for the torque converter, emailed both Novak and AA.

What about the fuel tank/pump ? I read about needing to get a diffeent fuel pump. This makes sense to me.

Guy from the forum (Hammyscj) sells complete 4.0's, so now I know where to get the motor, with all accesories as well.

The Hesco kit comes with a new vibration dampner with the CPI that mounts using 3 bolts on the front of the oil pan.

This was taken from :

http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/engine/fi40swap01/


Am I driving you nuts yet CSP ? lol Seriesly, every word from you guys gives me inspiration and courage. I am no super mehcanic, learn as I go, and boy, am I learning here.

Thanks;

Jim

Last edited by antman; 09-05-2002 at 07:59 PM..
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Unread 09-06-2002, 04:34 AM   #10
lynn
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My buddy used an in-tank pump from a Ford Ranger. He had to modify the CJ's pick-up tube slightly, but it wasn't difficult.
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Unread 09-06-2002, 09:50 AM   #11
Grand CJ7
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Here is a copy of the wright up that I put on another board.

My friend of 35 years helped me. We made a bracket to bolt to the 4.0 for the crank sensor and planed to notch the transmission, but the flex plate wouldn’t clear the torque converter. Plan B was to get the crank senor relocating kit from Advanced Adapter (this was a good move) the new damper went right on but the belt hit the sensor bracket. I called AA and was told that they just re-engineered the kit for a two-bolt sensor and forgot to look at the belt (sent a new belt no charge). Installed the belt, no spark. We used a VOM to read the new sensor and compare it to the one I got from the Grand, not even close. Called AA, bad sensor, sent out a new one no charge.
The fuel came from a ’99 Ford Ranger (Part Mike told me to use a Ranger pump?). What I did was drop the tank pull the sending unit measure the depth of the tank and the length of the pick up tube. I cut the pick up tube and installed the pump to the longest dimension to just keep it off the bottom of the tank ran the wires through a hole drilled through the top of the sending unit using a grommet and some hardening gasket stuff to seal the hole. The filter was one that looked like it would work and one the guy at Advanced Auto recommended. I used rubber hose from the sending unit to the filter and hard line from the filter to the fuel rail so keep that in mind when picking out a filter.
The fuse / relay box, along with the harness and computer came from the ’94 Grand. I had to lengthen some of the wires because I mounted the computer on the left side of the firewall under the master cylinder and the relay box of the right fender. We had to run through the wires three times not knowing the computer was the problem that it wouldn’t run longer that a second or two. The Grand had a VTSS (vehicle theft security system) and was working with no way to dis-arm it the bone yard let me exchange it for one out of a ’92 Cherokee.
I had to do the swap in my friend’s garage because I didn’t have the headroom to pull the engine so it took 18 days start to finish (not working every day).
All is well and runs like h--l.
If you have any questions, let me know maybe I can help.
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Unread 09-06-2002, 09:59 AM   #12
lynn
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Cool screen name

I can confirm that this thing really runs great!!

Thanks for dropping in here and helping out.
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Unread 09-06-2002, 06:50 PM   #13
antman
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So, all this time I had all the answers I needed.

CPS relocation bracket,
Computer and harness,

And some odd parts...

I can still use my old flywheel (flexplate) correct ?
Also, will the nose of the torque converter fit into the crank ?
I have been told that the TH400's is smaller.

Since I need a new tank, I was going to buy a wrangler fuel pump for the fuel delivery. That should do the trick

Jim

Last edited by antman; 09-06-2002 at 07:03 PM..
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Unread 09-09-2002, 06:54 PM   #14
antman
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Well, found out what GrandCJ did to make the flexplate work....


"I did however use that plate as a pattern for drilling holes in the stock 4.0 flex plate. But the 4.0 flex plate had a big lip that the crank sensor reads and would not fit over the converter. So I cut and ground down the lip and it works fine."

Sounds like all my answers are answered.

Sensor reloaction bracket from Hesco
Computer and Harness from Hesco
Bushing made for my torque converter to fit
Some drilling and drinding of the 4.0 flexplate

*question about the flexplate, drilling and grinding will affect weight, this shouldnt be a problem correct ? I think not...just making sure.

Thanks All

Now to get the cash.....

Jim
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