ETHANOLl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep CJ Forum > ETHANOLl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ANOTHER Rockridge4wd Creation!! Spare Tire Carrier Delete Cess Recovery Gear Snatch Tow Strap OffRoad @ ROCKRIDGE4WD15 x 8 Black D-Window Steel Wheels Set of 4

Reply
Unread 10-17-2011, 09:20 PM   #1
weasterly
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Juan, TX
Posts: 9
ETHANOLl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GREETINGS: My "Louise" is a 1978 CJ7 Renegade with a 304 V8 which I have had for some 20+ years.

I was down at South Padre Island, [TX] a few days ago and topped off the tank and did a bit of beach combing. 92 degrees and a bit windy. She started getting hot after a few miles of some what slow driving.....to the point I had to stop and turn her into the surf wind, and rev her a bit to cool down. Next day on a return trip of Brownsville, suddenly she sputtered and died. She wanted to start, but just wouldn't. A bit of a delima on a lonely road. It appeared a gas problem. I had a 1/4 tank of gas, so I checked the carb. for function. No gas was squirting into the throat. Semi panic #2 as I thought either the fuel pump went bad as it was a replacement in Warranty OR the "rollover" check valve may have defected. I removed the gas fill cap & put 1/2 gallon of spare gas in the tank thinking my gauge was not indicating correctly.......IT STARTED and run just fine. VAPOR LOCK!!!! I topped off the tank at Pt. Isabel and have had no problems since.

Something had gone wrong. Thinking back I remembered the problems boaters are having with ETHANOL added to gasoline. I checked with the gas station where I topped off at SPI and they said yes they have a 5% Ethanol additive in their product. ETHANOL!!!!@%#$^&(*)_+!!!

JEEPERS BEWARE!!!!!

WME

weasterly is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-17-2011, 09:34 PM   #2
Fellstar
Registered User
2012 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Merrillville, Indiana
Posts: 600
Hate to tell you this but 10% ethanol by volume is pretty much a national standard. It won't hurt your vehicle.
Fellstar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-17-2011, 09:39 PM   #3
Fellstar
Registered User
2012 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Merrillville, Indiana
Posts: 600
In fact much of the Subaru community modifies their vehicles to run Ethanol because while you have to run 30% richer to attain the same power output as normal gasoline. Ethanol runs cooler, and has a higher octane rating thus allowing you to push more air into the compression chamber and run more timing.

Subaru's run for years on 85% ethanol blends on their stock fuel systems.

If you're going to run into problems with ethanol it's going to be clogged injectors or a fuel pump that fails, and this is only going to happen if you dump 70%+ ethanol blends into your truck. Injectors because high concentrations of ethanol tend to eat the rubber fuel lines if they're not of a resistant type, and fuel pumps because the fuel pumps use gasoline's lubricating properties to keep the pump lubricated. Using high content ethanol doesn't allow the fuel pump to be properly lubricated.
Fellstar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-18-2011, 11:44 AM   #4
gosupes
Registered User
1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Monroe, WA
Posts: 1,526
On older vehicles, the alcohol content can attack certain types of rubber o-rings and hoses. These cars were designed and manufactured back 30 years ago when there wasn't methanol blended into the gas.
__________________
1986 CJ7, 4.2 w/4.0 head, TFI-HEI hybrid ignition, Clifford manifold w/Holley 390 w/cold air intake, OBA, 4.5" lift, Woody CV shaft and Tattons in front, 4.10 gears - lunchbox in front, Truetrac in the back, twin-sticked, blower upgrade for running topless, trying to keep it simple.

It's just a Jeep, and if you don't wheel it once in a while, it's not even that.
gosupes is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-18-2011, 11:47 AM   #5
Foundrydude
Registered User
1995 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Flatsville, IA
Posts: 2,692
I think you're on the tip of another problem, the ethanol may be to "blame" but only because something else is sketchy. 5% Ethanol doesn't make a vehicle run any hotter. good luck with the ole jeep
Foundrydude is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-18-2011, 08:23 PM   #6
sbcranger
Registered User
1985 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: long island
Posts: 309
im with foundrydude on this one, ethanol is not likely to present itself with those symptoms.

as for the problem boaters are having with ethanol is that ethanol will absorb its own volume in water. people who leave their tanks partially full will start to have problems with having water in their fuel systems. some of the newer fuel stabilizers will help with this problem.

completely unrelated things. start by going over you fuel system, make sure the fuel lines are tooo close to any heat sources, any rubber lines are in good condition and not allowing air to be pulled in etc etc.
sbcranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-18-2011, 08:36 PM   #7
weasterly
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: San Juan, TX
Posts: 9
Ethonal!!!!!!!!!!!!

OK. Assuming 'FOUNDRYDUDE' has a point and we have talked about this before on the forum about my hard starting problem, [Motorcraft 2100 carb. problem, [August 2011]. Is it possible that the fuel pump is NOT pumping properly at the attempted starting, to supply sufficient gas into the carb. thereby requiring several accelerator pumps and engine turn overs before it starts? That perhaps there is an air leak preventing full pressure?

Opinions please! Thank You: WME
weasterly is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-18-2011, 09:04 PM   #8
Mickey_D
Registered User
1997 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: 40 3'42.36"N 112 2'16.73"W, Utah
Posts: 6,708
Just like to add in here that ethanol has nothing to do with your issue.

My Jeep is almost old enough to collect Social Security. Utah runs a MINIMUM of 10% ethanol. My Jeep hasn't had the choke engaged (manual choke) in 7 months. Two pumps of the pedal and it starts on the first revolution of the crankshaft.

My 77 Olds Cutlass ran on 10% ethanol gasoline for years. My ex-wife's 77 Datsun 810 ran on 10% ethanol. My 74 CJ-5 ran on 10% ethanol. I'm 43 years old and I've owned more than one vehicle for every year I've been alive. Most of them are pre-1980. Ethanol has been used in Washington state (where I grew up) for decades now and it's never induced the issues you spoke about in the first post. I've had those issues before, but they were always caused by other things.


The only time ethanol gasoline ever gave me problems was when I tried mixing my own R/C airplane fuel...
__________________
1997 ZJ 5.2 Orvis, Baby!
1953 Willys M100 trailer Tagalong
________________
[_][][][][][][][][_]


Mickey_D is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-19-2011, 10:42 PM   #9
jeepdaddy2000
Web Wheeler
 
jeepdaddy2000's Avatar
1971 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Eagle Point Oregon
Posts: 6,108
The issue with "oxygenated" fuel isn't how it effect the way your car runs, but what it does to it when it sits. When ehtanol fuel dries, it leaves a film behind. For fuel injected engines, this isn't a problem. Nor do daily drivers see much of an issue. The probem comes with engines that are used infrequently. Lawn mowers, pressure washers, garden tractors and the like can see crusted float bowls and plugged jets. The issues get worse with two stroke engines such as dirt bikes, weed eaters, and leaf blowers. These carbs see the combination of ethanol crust and two stroke oil residue.
jeepdaddy2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-19-2011, 11:15 PM   #10
1986cj
Registered User
1986 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Denver Colorado
Posts: 1,873
Colorado, Denver has been blending it in the gas for many years now mostly in the winter months. I have never had a problem with it but my mileage drops about 4 mpg when I have to use use it. They say it is a much cleaner fuel but If I have to burn more of it to go the same place I realy dont see any saving to the air.
1986cj is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-19-2011, 11:35 PM   #11
BrandonJames
Registered User
1974 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Cedar Grove WI
Posts: 594
My 258 runs fine on 15% ethanol that the local stations carry, so does my other jeep with a 350, both are over 30 years old and i havent had any problems with the gas qaulity going into them
BrandonJames is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-20-2011, 02:12 AM   #12
BagusJeep
Web Wheeler
 
BagusJeep's Avatar
1981 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bali, Indonesia
Posts: 4,259
I have had problems with diesel adulterated with industrial solvents, a common problem in Thailand where there is no duty on the solvents. Rots the seals and causes massive rapid deterioration of diesel injection systems.
__________________
BagusJeep lives in Bali, the Land of Temples.
With a Jeep every prayer counts.

1981 CJ7 258ci - Bagusjeep
1984 CJ7 258ci - Puthijeep
1981 J20 258ci - Gladys
BagusJeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-20-2011, 02:29 AM   #13
John Strenk
Moderator
 
John Strenk's Avatar
1976 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Shalersville Ohio
Posts: 12,967
Quote:
Originally Posted by weasterly View Post
OK. Assuming 'FOUNDRYDUDE' has a point and we have talked about this before on the forum about my hard starting problem, [Motorcraft 2100 carb. problem, [August 2011]. Is it possible that the fuel pump is NOT pumping properly at the attempted starting, to supply sufficient gas into the carb. thereby requiring several accelerator pumps and engine turn overs before it starts? That perhaps there is an air leak preventing full pressure?

Opinions please! Thank You: WME
Usually it's not the fuel pump unless it's allowing the fuel to drain back to the tank. Of course if the fuel filter is mounted upside down, this could also allow fuel to drain back to the tank.

I assume you are running the 3 port fuel filter. If you are not, this could cause your vapor pressure problem.

The fuel pump should not even be needed to start a carburated engine. Usually the choke is enough to get the engine started and run for a little while. If you have to pump it a lot then either your choke is not fully closed or you have a vacuum leak someplace.
John Strenk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-20-2011, 06:33 AM   #14
wellmax
Registered User
1984 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hazel, KY
Posts: 1,068
we have a local station in my area of west ky that still sells non-ethanol gas, for rednecks like me.
so i buy gas for my jeep, lawnmowers, chainsaws and old Fergy tractor at that station.

so far all still run fine.

Problem,
last year a new Hucks station was built in a town near by, they sell diesel so i filled up my Dodge truck there and also filled up two of my small portable fuel tanks with their gas. I figured since the station was new, maybe their underground gas tanks were not full of crap and water, yet.

poured that ethanol gas into my tiller and lawnmower, in no time flat they would not run right, it may not have been caused by the ethanol gas, but it was something as both units when south almost as soon as i put that gas in the tanks.

18 hp lawnmower i finally got running by draining tank and filling with non-ethanol gas, but the 5 hp tiller is still not running.

so, until i cannot buy non-ethanol gas anymore, i will not buy ethanol gas for my small engines.

just my two cents!!!!!

our local small engine shop dude goes to cussing each time you mention ethanol gas.

I maybe the odd ball, but I only buy fuel for my diesel truck at the local BP station where the ambulance service buys their fuel and have had no problems. The last thing you need is water and junk in your diesel truck fuel tank or any vehicle fuel tank for that matter.
wellmax is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-20-2011, 07:10 AM   #15
h2ogun
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Texas, Texas
Posts: 213
While I think ethanol is bad, I dont think that it is your problem although it could be complicating the problem.

33 year old jeep (mine too), sounds like fuel line problems. Some if not all of your fuel line may be that old too. Ethanol "eats" older fuel line, plus the line just gets old and wears out.
h2ogun is offline   Reply With Quote




Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.