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Unread 02-27-2014, 05:52 AM   #5326
Mike Romain
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Not reading 500+ pages....

That said, air in the oil line will make the gauge bounce. I bleed mine at the back of the gauge by loosening the fitting while running.

Hotter temps = thinner oil normally.

Is the engine head grounded to the firewall by a steel mesh cable like the stock setup is? A bad ground path can affect the temp gauge readings. Even Teflon tape on the threads can mess with it. If you need a thread lubricant to get it in tight, think liquid plumbing 'dope'. (Teflon tape is just a lubricant so things can tighten easier, not a sealant)

The readings for #1 likely mean worn rings. To check, add a tablespoon of oil to the spark plug hole and check again. If the compression comes up, it is rings, if not, then valves or head gasket.

Oh, the PCV controls engine sludge, it will fill up with crud fast without one. It is also part of the fuel mix equation because it is a needed controlled vacuum leak.

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Unread 02-27-2014, 06:20 AM   #5327
Matt1981CJ7
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Scott,

Does Clay have breathers on his valve cover, at least? The crankcase pressure has to go somewhere. It's not necessary to suck those vapors back thru the intake, but doing so keeps the engine compartment much cleaner.

I agree with John, it sounds like there's air in the oil gauge's line.

Matt
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Unread 02-27-2014, 07:21 AM   #5328
lucdog
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At what point is the engine appear to be running hot? While stopped at a stop light, or while driving down the road? What does the temp gauge show when the IR shows 200*?
I agree with bleeding the air from the oil gauge line.
No fan shroud, correct?


I don't have a lot of faith in cheap gauges.


Bill
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Unread 02-27-2014, 07:56 AM   #5329
Matt1981CJ7
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Mechanical fan with clutch? If so, you might check the clutch.

A shroud made a 10-15* difference on my 360, according to my IR thermometer.

Matt
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Unread 02-27-2014, 01:24 PM   #5330
mikeyboat
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Glad to see this active again. Can't offer any suggestions on your current problems, but I'm pretty confident yall will get it figured out. Keep it up gentlemen, you've done a great job!
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Unread 02-27-2014, 06:13 PM   #5331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romain View Post
Not reading 500+ pages....

That said, air in the oil line will make the gauge bounce. I bleed mine at the back of the gauge by loosening the fitting while running.

Hotter temps = thinner oil normally.

Is the engine head grounded to the firewall by a steel mesh cable like the stock setup is? A bad ground path can affect the temp gauge readings. Even Teflon tape on the threads can mess with it. If you need a thread lubricant to get it in tight, think liquid plumbing 'dope'. (Teflon tape is just a lubricant so things can tighten easier, not a sealant)

The readings for #1 likely mean worn rings. To check, add a tablespoon of oil to the spark plug hole and check again. If the compression comes up, it is rings, if not, then valves or head gasket.

Oh, the PCV controls engine sludge, it will fill up with crud fast without one. It is also part of the fuel mix equation because it is a needed controlled vacuum leak.
HOLY CRAP!! MIKE ROMAIN!!! Good to hear from you Mike.

This is a glass tub, so I will provide a ground from the head to the dash/frame/batt. There is not one to the head presently. Also, will do the wet test on CYL 1. Thanks for the input.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt1981CJ7 View Post
Scott,

Does Clay have breathers on his valve cover, at least? The crankcase pressure has to go somewhere. It's not necessary to suck those vapors back thru the intake, but doing so keeps the engine compartment much cleaner.

I agree with John, it sounds like there's air in the oil gauge's line.

Matt
No breather, per se, just an open hole, basically. It has the nipple that would attach to the tubing that went to the air filter in the factory air box. Keep in mind it is the 4.0. It is able to vent, but nothing pulling on the crankcase.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucdog View Post
At what point is the engine appear to be running hot? While stopped at a stop light, or while driving down the road? What does the temp gauge show when the IR shows 200*?
I agree with bleeding the air from the oil gauge line.
No fan shroud, correct?


I don't have a lot of faith in cheap gauges.


Bill
Clay called me twice on his way home from school last night. He said he was having issues while driving at 45 MPH... oil pressure changing and temps almost pegged on the temp gauge. I told him to pull off at a lighted area and shoot some temps with the IR reader. It was 200 at the Tstat. I told him as long as the engine sounded good to bring it on home.

I drove it to work today. True, the temp gauge is pegging (second gauge, first one did the same thing). Pegging is around 280*.

Oil pressure at 50 MPH was 50 PSI. That's very good. Pressure dropped when I slowed, as you would expect. Oil pressure never exceeded 60 PSI and pretty much stayed at 50. I think I need to educate Clay a little more! There was no eradic fluctuation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt1981CJ7 View Post
Mechanical fan with clutch? If so, you might check the clutch.

A shroud made a 10-15* difference on my 360, according to my IR thermometer.

Matt
We don't have a shroud for the mechanical fan, and it is offset as on a 4.0. But he also has the electric fan. Turning on the electric fan with the manual switch does not cause temps to decrease. I need to give this more attention over the weekend. Clay is out of town, so I can bang on his Jeep for a couple days!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyboat View Post
Glad to see this active again. Can't offer any suggestions on your current problems, but I'm pretty confident yall will get it figured out. Keep it up gentlemen, you've done a great job!
Glad to have you aboard!! I know we'll figure it out. I'm thinking it isn't as serious as my son makes it sound. I'm more concerned with low pressure on cylinder 1.
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Clay's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/cl...hread-1061897/
Scott's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/sc...5-cj7-1147913/
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http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/f...-okee-1445206/
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Unread 03-01-2014, 06:04 PM   #5332
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I think temps are okay. It is backfiring however. That should be a timing indicator??
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http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/cl...hread-1061897/
Scott's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/sc...5-cj7-1147913/
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http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/f...-okee-1445206/
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Unread 03-04-2014, 09:44 AM   #5333
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Mike! Glad to see you returned!! How are thing your way? Been many times I've wondered how you've been, hated hearing you signed off..

OK, back on topic

I was originally thinking how higher temps would mean lower oil psi, but now it seems you have figured out they are 2 separate issues. That is also a reason most gauges on newer cars are "idiot gauges", where they are basically like a light, on or off, no actual variation.

Have you considered a mechanical temp gauge? Maybe not for permanent use but just to run while sorting things out.
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Unread 03-04-2014, 12:14 PM   #5334
Mike Romain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cutlass327 View Post
Mike! Glad to see you returned!! How are thing your way? Been many times I've wondered how you've been, hated hearing you signed off..

OK, back on topic

.
I moved out to the bush with no internet connection. Have to use a cell phone and finally got one I could type on. Lol. Got stuck with a 3 year contract and itty bitty keys.
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89 YJ Renegade. BBD Carbed 4.0 HO. Locked front and rear with 33x9.5 BFG AT's
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Unread 03-04-2014, 06:03 PM   #5335
Skerr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cutlass327 View Post
Mike! Glad to see you returned!! How are thing your way? Been many times I've wondered how you've been, hated hearing you signed off..

OK, back on topic

I was originally thinking how higher temps would mean lower oil psi, but now it seems you have figured out they are 2 separate issues. That is also a reason most gauges on newer cars are "idiot gauges", where they are basically like a light, on or off, no actual variation.

Have you considered a mechanical temp gauge? Maybe not for permanent use but just to run while sorting things out.
This block and head have no port for a mechanical temp gauge. It was done by the computer, originally. There is a boss on the head I can drill and tap, but I'm intimidated by it... although SLO-ken shows how to do it on his thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romain View Post
I moved out to the bush with no internet connection. Have to use a cell phone and finally got one I could type on. Lol. Got stuck with a 3 year contract and itty bitty keys.
Since you a have 3 year contract, and you're done splitting wood, I guess you have nothing better to do!?!?


I have been reading up on backfiring through the TB. Since you can't adjust timing with the dizzy what are other causes that would cause this? I have read low fuel pressure, dirty TB, bad knock sensor (but we don't have one), bad EGR (again, don't have one), and maybe dirt injectors???

I DO have positive ventilation at the crankcase. There is a direct vacuum from the intake to the valve cover, just no PCV in place.
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"Contemplate the mangled bodies of your countrymen, and then say 'what should be the reward of such sacrifices?' ... If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!" —Samuel Adams

Clay's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/cl...hread-1061897/
Scott's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/sc...5-cj7-1147913/
Fallon (and Dad) Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/f...-okee-1445206/
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Unread 03-04-2014, 07:26 PM   #5336
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Scott, if you are talking about a location for a temp sensor on the 4.0, you can put a water neck on it with a port for the sender. I did this for my TBI conversion, I posted photos on my build thread.....wait, nevermind

Like this...

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Unread 03-04-2014, 07:26 PM   #5337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skerr View Post

This block and head have no port for a mechanical temp gauge. It was done by the computer, originally. There is a boss on the head I can drill and tap, but I'm intimidated by it... although SLO-ken shows how to do it on his thread.
Is the temp sensor in the thermostat housing on the 4.0L?
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Unread 03-04-2014, 07:27 PM   #5338
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It's nothing to be intimidated by... although it is a lot easier to get at when the engine's on a stand.
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Unread 03-04-2014, 07:37 PM   #5339
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If you need two sensors...

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Unread 03-04-2014, 08:43 PM   #5340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 243 View Post
Scott, if you are talking about a location for a temp sensor on the 4.0, you can put a water neck on it with a port for the sender. I did this for my TBI conversion, I posted photos on my build thread.....wait, nevermind

Like this...

Was that a standard 4.0 housing, Dave? Now that you mention it, I DO seem to remember reading about that conversion on your ghost thread! Have to re-look at it to see if it has the same two bosses as yours does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EgulAye View Post
Is the temp sensor in the thermostat housing on the 4.0L?
There were two on some 4.0s. Try-i-n-g t-o re-mem-ber! I think the OBDII had 2 sensors, and the OBDI had only 1, in the T housing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLO_Ken View Post
It's nothing to be intimidated by... although it is a lot easier to get at when the engine's on a stand.
You are much inspiration Ken, but if I drill too deep, or off to the side, then my son needs a new head! Well... THAT being said, I don't want to have to fix his engine too!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 243 View Post
If you need two sensors...

Hmmm... now you got me wondering... Thanks, Dave.
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"Contemplate the mangled bodies of your countrymen, and then say 'what should be the reward of such sacrifices?' ... If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!" —Samuel Adams

Clay's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/cl...hread-1061897/
Scott's Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/sc...5-cj7-1147913/
Fallon (and Dad) Build Thread
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/f...-okee-1445206/
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