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Unread 09-15-2007, 06:37 PM   #1
T-$$
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302 into cj7- tips, info, etc..

i'm sure that its been asked and answered but i am cheap and dont get the search function at this time.

i'm toying w/ the idea of the 302 swap. I want the auto and not sure if i care as far as efi or carb.
i ideally want to get the engine and whole drivetrain out of what ever the donor is. so maybe an old bronco(the smaller ones) would be my best bet.

how about an f-150 w/ a 302 or even a fullsize bronco?-

if i were to go w/ a efi, is it a ***** to hook up the ecm and other sensors?
also, if i were to get a mustang eng., would that be made for more go-go-go and suck as far as low torque for crawling??

i expect that fitting into the jeep period will take some work but what isnt w/ jeeps...

thanks

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Waggy 360, HEI ign, AMC 20 rear w/ Moser 1 piece axle, 5 speed trans, wrangler tub, Forest green Rustoleum paint job, 35x12.5 Conti-trac's, 4" Suspension and 1" Body Lift
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Unread 09-16-2007, 12:51 AM   #2
scrible
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Here's my opinion.

Don't go with a Ford engine in your CJ, it'll be headaches the whole way. I looked into it.

Do what I did and buy a cheap, rusty, Jeep Grand Wagoneer with a decent AMC 360 in it, swap the motor in, and scrap the Wagoneer. All you really will need to change to bolt it in is motor mounts, all your stock wiring should work fine. Most came with an automatic transmission (turbo 400?) I can't remember what came in the one I got but that is an option for you. I just bolted the engine to my t176 4-speed that came in my Jeep stock.

I love my 360. In stock form it produced more than enough power. After I pulled it again, did a rebuild with some performance parts and put the 360 back in, it is now tons of fun.

That's just my opinion.

A good bonus if you do that is you are keeping it all AMC/Jeep
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Unread 09-16-2007, 07:12 AM   #3
T-$$
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does that 360 weigh a ton??

I had an old waggy w/ the 360 and set it in the frame and it just looked soooo big and i couldnt get it to line up straight. it need a maor rebuild so i went w/ 258.
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Unread 09-16-2007, 12:59 PM   #4
slacker92104
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I did the 302 swap because I wanted fuel injection, and I wanted a five speed behind it. Since you don't care about the fuel injection (you might rethink that because it is sooo much better) I would look into the 304 or 360 swap. It will be easier and cheaper. It will give you the power you want. The advantages to the fuel injection are cold weather starts, re-starts on hills, hot re-starts, and the fact it will run the same at any angle, and automatically adjusts to chnging conditions. (I live in Cali, so it's not uncommon for me to wheel at 4000' and then below sea level in the same day) The mustang motors have more horsepower and more torque. I'm not sure about the low end though. You can get some more torque by putting the 164 tooth flywheel on it. It's a little bigger and heavier.
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Unread 09-16-2007, 02:51 PM   #5
Scrambler82
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5.0L Ford is lighter than the original six, shorter and there are a lot of them in the Salvage Yard and it has been done before.

Go to the Salvage Yard and get a 92 or 93 low mileage 5.0 out of a Mustang with the complete engine wiring harness. (good to hear it run if possible)

There are a lot of info on the web and on this forum about the actual hook up.

It would be easier if you had a friend close to you that has knowledge of this swap.

Get all of the info to gether before you buy just to make sure you want to tackle this swap.

Luck,

Here is what my 5.0 looks like...
5.0l-engine-placement-ii.jpg  
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Last edited by Scrambler82; 09-18-2007 at 04:17 PM..
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Unread 09-16-2007, 05:44 PM   #6
T-$$
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i guess i am leaning away from a mustang 302 cause i want the trans and tc that came w/ it so i dont have to screw w/ adapters and that mess. so i was thinking that an old bronco with a good reputation powertrain would be easiest. i dont care about having to do the welding for mounts etc.

i want a crazy v8 so that is why i am leaning towards the 302.
i am not a big fan of any gm products and

am i wrong to think that the 304 and 360 are wicked heavy compared to the 302 or is an older 302 the same weight?

maybe a good 304/360 with drivetrain is the way to go?
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Unread 09-16-2007, 05:59 PM   #7
84MSRB
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What tranny do you have now? The only adapter I had to get was a bellhousing from a late 80's F150 for 30 bucks. The 302 bolted right up.
It ain't running yet, so I can't say much else.
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Unread 09-16-2007, 06:05 PM   #8
Happy Joe
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Forget Jeep V-8s they have been obsolete for years (as have 302s but the injected 302 is available from any scrap yard)... IMO, the only engines to consider are those that have OEM fuel injection, if you go off road. If you want a mall cruiser the go ahead and keep it carburetted jeep.
How hard is it to do the swap? Its relatively straight forward unless you have little injection experience/knowledge. (I second the, above, investigate it thoroughly online recommendation). If you want to spend lots of money aftermarket wiring harnesses are available for the 302 (I normally just customize one removed from a donor car/truck). If this is your first engine swap or you have limited fabrication ability or tools I would recommend not doing it.
For 302s my first choice would be a sequentially injected high output from a 92 or 93 (Mustang/Lincoln) second choice would be a truck 302 with a better cam. If you can stay with OBD I engines and avoid the later OBD II (the duplicate sensors and lack of computer ports make them somewhat more difficult to mod).

No adapters necessary 302s came in vehicles with t-5s, T-176s, and T-18s.
Enjoy!
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...a well prepped, well driven, vehicle should do well in any terrain, including the highway.

Carburetors became obsolete during the last century... do what ever it takes to get fuel injection...It makes bigger grins off road.
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Unread 09-16-2007, 06:47 PM   #9
T-$$
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i currently have the t-5 with the dana 300 i think. i want a v8 with an auto. so i am willing to start over on the powertrain. i'd consider a mustang 302 but then what with the tran and tc? i want to keep this simple as far as adapters and compatibility. so a good donor with the whole package is ideal.
i'm not scared of as mods or improv's so i'm game for most anything.
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Waggy 360, HEI ign, AMC 20 rear w/ Moser 1 piece axle, 5 speed trans, wrangler tub, Forest green Rustoleum paint job, 35x12.5 Conti-trac's, 4" Suspension and 1" Body Lift
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Unread 09-16-2007, 07:25 PM   #10
Happy Joe
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Simplest is a manual tranny. I don't mess with autos, so I cannot really give an opinion there.
Enjoy!
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...a well prepped, well driven, vehicle should do well in any terrain, including the highway.

Carburetors became obsolete during the last century... do what ever it takes to get fuel injection...It makes bigger grins off road.
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Unread 09-16-2007, 08:50 PM   #11
petey156
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i think all ford t-cases have a drivers side drop.
so you will need new axles if u are going with th auto trans.

I have a 351w from an LTD still in the swap process. lots of fun!!
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Unread 09-16-2007, 09:55 PM   #12
slacker92104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petey156
i think all ford t-cases have a drivers side drop.
so you will need new axles if u are going with th auto trans.

I have a 351w from an LTD still in the swap process. lots of fun!!
This is true. A fuel injected 302 will have an AOD automatic behind it. The adapter to a dana 300 is around 6" long and costs over $500. You could keep the t-5 (it will eventually break though) and just bolt the engine to it.
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'81 CJ5, efi 302, AX-15 5 spd, On Board Air, wrangler spring conversion, Astro van Hydro Brakes.
Soon: Custom cut Dana 44 front, wide trac solid axle amc 20 rear, SOA,
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Unread 09-17-2007, 12:10 AM   #13
scrible
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Joe
Forget Jeep V-8s they have been obsolete for years (as have 302s but the injected 302 is available from any scrap yard)... IMO, the only engines to consider are those that have OEM fuel injection, if you go off road. If you want a mall cruiser the go ahead and keep it carburetted jeep.
How hard is it to do the swap? Its relatively straight forward unless you have little injection experience/knowledge. (I second the, above, investigate it thoroughly online recommendation). If you want to spend lots of money aftermarket wiring harnesses are available for the 302 (I normally just customize one removed from a donor car/truck). If this is your first engine swap or you have limited fabrication ability or tools I would recommend not doing it.
For 302s my first choice would be a sequentially injected high output from a 92 or 93 (Mustang/Lincoln) second choice would be a truck 302 with a better cam. If you can stay with OBD I engines and avoid the later OBD II (the duplicate sensors and lack of computer ports make them somewhat more difficult to mod).

No adapters necessary 302s came in vehicles with t-5s, T-176s, and T-18s.
Enjoy!
Saying the AMC V8's are obsolete is like saying that Chevy 350 V8's are obsolete.

What exactly makes them "obsolete" in your opinion? Lack of available scrapyard parts? Parts are not hard to come by at all, any local parts store can get parts for AMC motors for the not much more if not the same as Chevy and Ford V8 parts.

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Unread 09-17-2007, 07:54 AM   #14
Scrambler82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T-$$
i guess i am leaning away from a mustang 302 cause i want the trans and tc that came w/ it so i dont have to screw w/ adapters and that mess. so i was thinking that an old bronco with a good reputation powertrain would be easiest. i dont care about having to do the welding for mounts etc.

i want a crazy v8 so that is why i am leaning towards the 302.
i am not a big fan of any gm products and

am i wrong to think that the 304 and 360 are wicked heavy compared to the 302 or is an older 302 the same weight?

maybe a good 304/360 with drivetrain is the way to go?
OK then there is still a good F-150, manual trans and TC out there in some Salvage Yard just waiting for you to buy it up.
Just try to get the engine harness and accessories with the setup.

As was stated before the Ford Small Block is lighter than the six cylinder it will be replacing.
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Unread 09-17-2007, 10:29 AM   #15
Happy Joe
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Quote:
What exactly makes them "obsolete" in your opinion?
Some of my definitions of obsolete off road engines; (the more categories apply the more obsolete it is)

The company that made them is not in business any more, or no longer supports the engine.
They rely on carburetors or points type ignitions.
They perform poorly at angels in excess of 45 degrees, or when bounced.
They have little to no aftermarket support for performance or replacement parts.
You are more likely to find them in collectors' vehicles or behind barns than on the street.
You have to adapt some parts from other applications to "modernize" them, or to keep them running.
You have to scrounge junkyards for parts, or "special order" them.

Don't get me wrong, AMC engines have their place; as do Ford flat heads, Chrysler hemi's from the 1950s, muscle motors from the 1960s and almost any engine from the 1970s. However given that the number of these engines is constantly dwindling along with their support they are fast becoming better candidates for museums than valid candidates for use off road. More modern, better preforming (off road) candidates for engine replacement than the above mentioned engines are widely available (although even the small block Chevy and Ford are loosing popularity and will eventually, also, join the ranks of engines so obsolete that their use becomes impractical).

The above are just opinions and worth nearly what you paid for them (so please don't bunch your undies!).

Enjoy!
__________________
...a well prepped, well driven, vehicle should do well in any terrain, including the highway.

Carburetors became obsolete during the last century... do what ever it takes to get fuel injection...It makes bigger grins off road.

Last edited by Happy Joe; 09-17-2007 at 10:42 AM..
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