[drummerwookie]

Originally Posted by Jeepdawgs

You may be missing the point a little. We were not saying that you should NOT be able to aquire a CCW it is just that there needs to be some training/instruction needed to obtain a permit. They may have a liscense but they cannot carry on campus. If they carry when they go to a bar full of people then they are stupid. Number one you should never handle a firearm while intoxicated ( imagine trying to shoot straight when your drunk, could easily kill an innocent bystander), number two all it takes is for another drunk to find out you are carrying and think it is funny to go for your weapon. Again, common sense has to take precedence. I think we are all well aware that you don't need a CCW to own a handgun.

around here, unless your a trained and sworn in LEO, even if you have a CCW, you arent allowed to carry into a bar or any where that sells alcohal thats intended to be consumed on the premises. so, if you walk into a wal-mart, to buy a case of beer, since you dont intend to consume the beverage on the premises, you can carry into the store

[mean90yj]

its like what ron white said, there was a shooting in some school, kid shot 7 bullets....8 dead...wtf. I am 19, but i am front canada, where 1/5 of the population owns a firearm, 7 million people. And there are barely over 100 gun deaths each year. Ok so you still do the ratio, it doens't even come close to the amount of gun deaths in the US. I think there defanitly needs to be some control on who can carry a weapon. I personally am all for it, defanitly let the teachers care a 9mm, or a stun gun (dunno how much help a 20 foot cable shooting out will do) but its something. But students allowed to carry guns is just asking for trouble, even if they do allow it, walking through crowded halls, someone gets pissed off and grabs YOUR gun out of its holster and starts shooting. Or like said above, drinking and college defanitly go hand in hand for some people. I was at a party over at my friends house, he got pissed off and was trying to go to his truck to get the .45 out of his glove compartment, this was after he finished off a bottle of grey goose. Gun control is defanitly necessary, all of this "hey lets arm every student" stuff, is like saying "lets arm all of the iraqi citizens to stop terror" no, b/c there are always those few few individuals who ARE looking for trouble, and once everyone starts shooting, who the hell are they going to know to shoot at. its like a mexican stand off (not racist but that is what its called)

[ionakana]

Originally Posted by War Eagle

But we are.....

it's because we all wear overalls with no underwear that gives it away isn't it?

Damn!!

[ionakana]

Originally Posted by TJgreg

I think it would be out of the question to properly train the numbers suggested in skills like weapons retention and situations involving civilians in the vicinity and many others that would build an effective 'law abiding' citizen to stop another VT or similar incident. It is not as simple as having a sidearm and a CCW to stop a killer. You must have to know how to use it effectively in many situations, in which most people do not have.


I am a gun owner and I do believe in rights to carry, but encouraging civilians with little knowledge of how and when to use a weapon is a scary thought.

thats why they call it training, and it's not out of the question to train large numbers of people, you encourage people to go through training. You have to in most states to get a CCP, you just don't go get one like a drivers licence. My father was a gunnery sargent in the Marines, he says it wouldn't be hard at all to train people when and how to use a weapon. There wouldn't be that many more people carrying weapons than there are now, just people better trained to use the weapon. I bet you would be surprised how many cars that pass you everyday have a gun in it.

[War Eagle]

Originally Posted by mean90yj

its like what ron white said, there was a shooting in some school, kid shot 7 bullets....8 dead...wtf. I am 19, but i am front canada, where 1/5 of the population owns a firearm, 7 million people. And there are barely over 100 gun deaths each year. Ok so you still do the ratio, it doens't even come close to the amount of gun deaths in the US. I think there defanitly needs to be some control on who can carry a weapon. I personally am all for it, defanitly let the teachers care a 9mm, or a stun gun (dunno how much help a 20 foot cable shooting out will do) but its something. But students allowed to carry guns is just asking for trouble, even if they do allow it, walking through crowded halls, someone gets pissed off and grabs YOUR gun out of its holster and starts shooting. Or like said above, drinking and college defanitly go hand in hand for some people. I was at a party over at my friends house, he got pissed off and was trying to go to his truck to get the .45 out of his glove compartment, this was after he finished off a bottle of grey goose. Gun control is defanitly necessary, all of this "hey lets arm every student" stuff, is like saying "lets arm all of the iraqi citizens to stop terror" no, b/c there are always those few few individuals who ARE looking for trouble, and once everyone starts shooting, who the hell are they going to know to shoot at. its like a mexican stand off (not racist but that is what its called)

Guns aren't the problem here. The problem is we've created and are perpetuating a culture of fear. No one wonders why it happened or what society could do to prevent it from happening again. Our only answer is "we need more guns because the world is a dangerous place and we're all in constant danger and oh god why is that guy just standing on the street corner like that he might have a bomb in his briefcase!" The difference between "ever vigilant" and "constantly scared" is mighty thin and ego seldom let's a person admit he's on the latter.

[75SV1]

Originally Posted by Jeepdawgs

All the Colleges I know will not allow firearms on campus. Hence the CHL and CCW argument goes out the window.

When I attended Trinidad State Jr. College for Gunsmithing, we were allowed to have firearms in the drom rooms. We carried them over to class. The only weapons were weren't allowed in the dorm were Class 3 (full auto), BB guns (although people had them) and blow guns (again people had them).
Tom

[War Eagle]

And I bet people at culinary school are allowed to carry big knives too.

[Jeepdawgs]

Originally Posted by 75SV1

When I attended Trinidad State Jr. College for Gunsmithing, we were allowed to have firearms in the drom rooms. We carried them over to class. The only weapons were weren't allowed in the dorm were Class 3 (full auto), BB guns (although people had them) and blow guns (again people had them).
Tom

I am assuming when you say "carried them to class" they were made safe, in a zippered/locked case, and ammo was seperate. If the dorm doesn't allow BB and blow guns but allows semi-auto then something is missing. Then again they might have allowed semi-auto for the gunsmith students.

On a side note, gunsmithing is starting to become a lost art. I am glad that you took the time to go to this class.

War Eagle-you beat me too it.

[75SV1]

We weren't allowed to carry a loaded weapon to class, nor have live ammo in class. If a firearm was to be tested, then someone else held the ammo, till the test fire chamber.
Yes, it was a cat incident before I was a student there. Originally, airriflles were sniper weapons. The Austrians used them against Neapoleon. If caught with one, it was instant exacution.
Still, my main point is that there are college campuses that allow(ed) weapons in th dorm. I'm not sure of the other gunsmithing schools policies.
Part of the reason of it being a lost art is there is more money to be made elsewhere. I think to a large extent the trade has gone to more parts replacement. There are still some with the oldtime skills though. Been away from it for about 20 years though.
Tom

[ionakana]

Interesting article

http://www.pierrelemieux.org/artvirginiatech.html

[myrockfight]

Originally Posted by 2005Unlimited

Do you really feel that people in college should carry guns.

Well then lets give them to high school students too. Colmbine ?????

I don't think so

Stereotype much? That statement shows you are very ignorant of the situation at hand and invalidates your opinion to many people.

Apparantly you feel that "people in college" are incapable or are too irresponsible to obtain permits to carry concealed.

Let me educate you on "people in college."

At my university, which is one of the largest in the Southeast of the US, approximately 60% of the students are over the age of 25. Are you assuming that all of those people are incapable of being responsible enough to carry a firearm? You don't think even one out of a hundred people are capable of that?

Do you have any idea how many soldiers are coming back and enrolling in school, courtesy of the GI Bill? Many of them have been soldiers since they were out of high school at 18. More than a few have seen combat. Are they incapable of handling a firearm responsibly? Because they have been doing it for quite some time.

Your problem is that you "feel" topics of discussion out, rather than think about them rationally. Understand that people often form themselves into what you expect them to be. If you expect your peers, children, etc. to act reasonably and with responsibility, the probability of them doing so will increase dramatically.

As a "recruiter" for the organization which you are involved, you should speak more deliberately and with more responsibility. You are putting yourself in a position of leadership.



The above comments go for everyone else here too. I have seen many people on many forums bashing college students because of the stereotype commenting on how irresponsible they are, etc. You are prejudging people.


If you are a student yourself and are going to try to present the argument that you have seen students act this way, they act like idiots, etc., - it isn't valid. The bottom line is that most students don't act in a fashion concurrent to what you have seen in Animal House. If you think your social group is full of idiots, tell them that and then find a more responsible group of people to hang out with. I've hung out with both types of crowds in college and there are far more people who are not irresponsible, drunken idiots.

Yes. I have seen people who are college students act morons. I have also seen doctors, lawyers, and police officers act the same way. But I am not going to say that they are all that way, all the time.. Nor am I going to say that they are all great and wonderful people.

It is what it is. No more. No less. Don't mislead people by repeating ignorant statements and views. Stop to think about what you are saying.

[LandRover]

As a HS teacher, after something like this happens, I can see the benefit to having a gun locked in my desk...then again, that's another weapon in every single classroom for a messed up kid to get ahold of. And for every teacher that I would want to see have a weapon, there are 10 or 12 that would be clueless as to what to do with it. We have an armed officer on campus most of the time (city cop, school resource officer). That's probably the safest/most realistic option.

[SpoiledRotten]

Originally Posted by LandRover

That's valid. "Gun toting Asian" just sounded a bit bigoted when I read it. You could have said a number of other things. Just keeping us all in check...

Quit being so tightarsed and so politically correct. I don't think anyone has assigned you to be the PC police. That is one thing that is messing up our society now. Everyone is expected to be PC when addressing someone else. Don't expect it from me. When I see someone here from another country that may or most likely might not be a legal U.S. citizen, I don't mind using a racially motivated term. If that is what some call profiling, then yes, I will profile in a second and don't care who wants to correct me.
I'm for law abiding citizens carrying guns too. If you act stupid and shoot someone out of a fit of rage, then maybe an armed witness will be watching the whole thing and take the idiot out. No taxes used to try and maintain another prisoner for years to come. I don't have a permit yet, but my shortie forty goes everywhere my vehicle goes. If I have to get involved to protect myself and my family, I'll do it with no hesitations.

I'll bet you will also vote for Hillary.

[LandRover]

Lets see...jeep drivin', mississippi livin', fat, white, gun toting, deep fried, Mexican hating redneck... I bet you vote for Charlton Heston

just joking man. But Hillary? Come on. That's just not cool.

[ionakana]

Originally Posted by LandRover

Lets see...jeep drivin', mississippi livin', fat, white, gun toting, deep fried, Mexican hating redneck... I bet you vote for Charlton Heston

just joking man. But Hillary? Come on. That's just not cool.

Redneck? How dare you!