Jan 30 -- Mythbusters vs. Plane on a Treadmill (finally!) - Page 6 - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > General > General Discussion > Jan 30 -- Mythbusters vs. Plane on a Treadmill (finally!)

Introducing MONSTALINER™ UV Permanent DIY Roll On Bed LineRockridge 4WD IS Taking Zone Offroad Suspension Lift Kits Rough Country Jeep Suspension Deals at Rockridge 4WD!

Reply
Unread 01-22-2008, 12:44 PM   #76
drdemux
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: calgary alberta canada
Posts: 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by red96jeep
thank you, someone understands
Oh boy. I can't wait till you see how wrong you are.

Will you come back and admit you were wrong atleast?

drdemux is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 12:45 PM   #77
ancestralworm
there will be crying
 
ancestralworm's Avatar
2000 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West-BY GOD-Monroe, LA
Posts: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by red96jeep

Quote:
Originally Posted by ucbandit10
the friction between the wheels and conveyor belt are negligable. spinning wheels have nothing to do with lift/air speed. Who care how fast the belt is moving because the plane is still staying in one spot( if it were to match the belt speed). The plane on the belt is only going to produce lift over the section of the wing that is right behind the propeller, which is not enought air to produce enough lift for takeoff. Why would engineers make wings 20+ ft long if the lift over a 5 ft span is enough to fly the thing?
thank you, someone understands
oh spaghetti monster please save us!
__________________
Black Jeep Society victim#19

"The Jeep is America's only real sports car" - Enzo Ferrari

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" - Ben Franklin
ancestralworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 12:46 PM   #78
juiceparn
Registered User
2007 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Quincy, IL
Posts: 733
Quote:
Originally Posted by red96jeep
thank you, someone understands

The prop is going to pull the plane forward regardless of the wheels or the treadmill. When it begins moving forward that is where lift comes from. Nobody said the prop creates the lift except the dip**** your agreeing with. I'll revisit this post to serve crow after the show airs.
__________________
07 JK 4DR 3.5" Rubicon Express, C gussets, Front XHD stubby, winch, Taboo Customs rear bumper with tire carrier, Taboo Customs Rock sliders.
juiceparn is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 12:50 PM   #79
LandRover
Registered User
1998 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Your Head
Posts: 2,232
Quote:
Originally Posted by juiceparn
I don't know who's tag it is but it goes "it's too bad stupidity isn't painful"...
__________________
RHD '98 XJ
RE 3.5", Bushwaker Flat Flares,
OR-Fab bumpers, PowerTrax locker,
Sliders, Goodyear Duratrac 33's
LandRover is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 12:52 PM   #80
Texan4life
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Red Oak, TX
Posts: 854
red96jeep - Which riddle are you trying to explain? The riddle where the treadmill matches the speed of the plane, or the riddle where the treadmill matches the speed of the wheels.

If you are assuming the speed of the treadmill matches the wheel speed, then the problem cannot be solved unless the plane and the treadmill are forced to be still.

If you are assuming the speed of the treadmill matches the speed of the plane, the plane will fly.
__________________
Amendment 10 -
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
Texan4life is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 05:30 PM   #81
dz1087
Registered User
1999 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,749


Is that what I think it is, why it is! That is indeed a wake behind that boat, which means it's moving. Now, it seems to be moving in the same direction that the Hawkeye appears to be setup to take-off in. That would be almost the opposite to the argument presented here! Does the Navy know they can't possibly launch that plane cause it won't take off?
__________________

Air Force Jeep Club - Tail# JF037AD
'03 TJ Sport, Black on White, Stock. [[Gone]]
'99 XJ, Purple, Stock but with new wheels.

Running Doorless? Check your state's Mirror Laws!!
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f176/list-state-mirror-laws-565361/

There can be no fifty-fifty Americanism in this country. There is room here for only 100% Americanism, only for those who are Americans and nothing else.
Theodore Roosevelt
dz1087 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 05:40 PM   #82
AlTheKillerr
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Star IV
Posts: 4,993
i cant wait for the show so people stop *****ing about this. however im going to laugh if they come back and say that its inconclusive (sp)
AlTheKillerr is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 05:47 PM   #83
03Wrangler
Registered User
2010  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Martville NY.... near syracuse, kinda
Posts: 1,662
what if the treadmill were to suddenly stop? would the plane suddenly launch like a rocket? i think not
03Wrangler is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 05:51 PM   #84
CHRRRIS
Registered User
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 1,396
It will take off. (Bolded, underlined, period'd (? lmao), and in the decisive color of red, for maximum emphasis).

It would be so easy to make a .gif comparing what happens to an airplane taking off from an air strip and from a giant conveyor belt... but I ain't got .gif maing skills, so the non-believers are gonna have to wait 'til the 30th.
__________________
It's easier to go down a hill than up it but the view is much better at the top.
-Henry Ward Beecher

Current - '98 Black Z28 with some goodies
Previous - '97 Gun Metal Blue TJ

Northern Illinois Extreme Jeep Club
www.ExtremeJeepClub.com
CHRRRIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 05:56 PM   #85
CHRRRIS
Registered User
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 1,396
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03Wrangler
what if the treadmill were to suddenly stop? would the plane suddenly launch like a rocket? i think not
It would continue on until it was up to ground speed (from the prop) where it is then able to take off, and then it will...

The treadmill plays no part in take off of an airplane, as the wheels are in no way being powered to make it move forward... when an airplane is on the air strip, the straight-away part, the prop kicks on and pulls the plane up into the air... the wheels are free-rolling.

Same goes for a boeing... The jets kick on on the straight-away and the wings push it into the air... the wheels receive no power and are free-rolling.

Make a treadmill twice the length of a runway and the plane will take off in the same distance it would on a normal runway.
__________________
It's easier to go down a hill than up it but the view is much better at the top.
-Henry Ward Beecher

Current - '98 Black Z28 with some goodies
Previous - '97 Gun Metal Blue TJ

Northern Illinois Extreme Jeep Club
www.ExtremeJeepClub.com
CHRRRIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 06:18 PM   #86
Bgeddes
Ridin' with the King
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: NEPA
Posts: 1,175
The propreller provides forward thrust, this moves the wing forward through a mass of air. Based on the Beurnulli (sp?) principle, air travelling over the top and bottom of the wings at different speeds, lift is produced.

An airplane can fly without the propeller providing thrust, it's called gliding, the forward motion is provided by gravity. Airplanes can fly BACKWARDS too, providing the wind is blowing faster than their stall speed.

Helicopters fly because their wing moves through the air independently of the airframe. The wing has to move through a MASS of air in order for it to produce lift. Unless the treadmill is in a wind tunnel, forget it.

Quote:
it still has to use the ground to move on until it get's enough speed to create lift
You are kidding right? Ever seen thos BIG tractors that push airlines away from the terminal? Why would you need them if the wheel are powered?
__________________
'05 KJ CRD and '00 XJ Classic > Stock DDs
Wanted - Early CJ - running but restorable
Bgeddes is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 06:24 PM   #87
Kyoseki
Inconceivable!
 
Kyoseki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: A wretched hive of scum and villainy
Posts: 6,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by dz1087
Is that what I think it is, why it is! That is indeed a wake behind that boat, which means it's moving.
Ah! But nobody said the treadmill had a catapult! *stir*
__________________
Due to lack of interest, tomorrow has been canceled
Kyoseki is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 06:26 PM   #88
SomeGuysName
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 219
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyoseki
It depends on the wording of the question;

If the treadmill is set to match the plane's forward speed then unless you have some particularly sticky wheels and an incredibly asthmatic engine, the plane will take off and the treadmill will simply be traveling at the same speed in the opposite direction.

If the treadmill is set to match the wheel's forward speed then you have created a situation that's first of all impossible to attain in real life, but mostly, the plane cannot move at all without having it's wheels travel faster than the treadmill, thus violating the only condition, ergo the plane isn't allowed to move and so cannot take off.

Mythbuster's will be testing the first scenario since the second scenario is impossible to create in the real world, therefore their plane will quite obviously fly.
Not necessarily on them using the first scenario...there are two different kinds of speed on a wheel, linear and rotational...the linear speed of the wheels will match the forward speed of the plane...using the rotational speed would indeed break the question. So it really depends on which definition you are going to use for speed...if they are talking about linear speed then either question can be used.

My vote is still: It will fly....
SomeGuysName is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 06:26 PM   #89
opiv
Registered User
2000 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: ny
Posts: 1,257
The plane will take off and then get stuck on the handles... the treadmill wins...

__________________
Get me my tools and beer.
opiv is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-22-2008, 06:29 PM   #90
Kyoseki
Inconceivable!
 
Kyoseki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: A wretched hive of scum and villainy
Posts: 6,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuysName
Not necessarily on them using the first scenario...there are two different kinds of speed on a wheel, linear and rotational...the linear speed of the wheels will match the forward speed of the plane...using the rotational speed would indeed break the question. So it really depends on which definition you are going to use for speed...if they are talking about linear speed then either question can be used.
I can see where you're coming from, but if you're talking linear speed of the wheel then effectively you're talking about the forward velocity of the aircraft though.

By specifically referring to the wheel rather than the aircraft as a whole, the implication is made that you're talking about the rolling speed of the thing and not the forward velocity of the wheel/airframe as a whole.
__________________
Due to lack of interest, tomorrow has been canceled
Kyoseki is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


Suggested Threads





Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.