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Unread 12-21-2012, 02:59 AM   #31
GermanyChris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilBrew View Post
That's cool, every LE agency and military in the world over the last 20 years, and the majority of CC users disagree with your choice. But you can use your six shooter and hope there's someone next to you with a semiauto in case you need a 7th round rofl.
Military and LE look for capacity hence the military change from the 45 to the 9MM M9..

I really don't care what a majority of CC users use they are nothing more than fickle consumers buying what companies produce. It's way cooler to have a SA on your lower back than a smaller caliber revolver. I bet if someone would do an internet search it would be found that in most CC situations there is one or two rounds being fired, blocks long running gun fights are for the movies.

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Unread 12-21-2012, 03:57 AM   #32
2006_Sport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanyChris

Military and LE look for capacity hence the military change from the 45 to the 9MM M9..

I really don't care what a majority of CC users use they are nothing more than fickle consumers buying what companies produce. It's way cooler to have a SA on your lower back than a smaller caliber revolver. I bet if someone would do an internet search it would be found that in most CC situations there is one or two rounds being fired, blocks long running gun fights are for the movies.
Except for the fact that the Marines are switching back to the .45.

And the m9 is a pile of ****. I hate shooting that pistol We have one in the safe. Only time it gets taken out is to clean it and lube it so it doesn't get messed up from sitting.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 07:04 AM   #33
GermanyChris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2006_Sport View Post
Except for the fact that the Marines are switching back to the .45.

And the m9 is a pile of ****. I hate shooting that pistol We have one in the safe. Only time it gets taken out is to clean it and lube it so it doesn't get messed up from sitting.
The marines are trying to move back..there still isn't any around here and we have a few thousand marines and sailors here and even some important ones..

Did I say the M9 was a wonderful weapon? I simply stated that the military switched M9 for capacity..it also helped that the 9MM is NATO standard which goes back to point a.

The weapon carried in a CC situation is a personal to someone as their shoes, there is no one standard that is applicable to everyone.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 08:20 AM   #34
Moabrubi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilBrew View Post
I can't believe how many of you are touting the reliability of a revolver over a glock. They're both EXTREMELY reliable period. You guys should try to make these points over a glocktalk.com and see the response you get lol.
Right.. because it says glock on the side it NEVER jams. I've never shot too light of a load or limpwristed a revolver causing it to jam.

Glocks can be shot in dirt, mud, whatever, but the fact is that a revolver won't have the possibility of jamming.If the revolver clicks pull the trigger until it goes boom, try doing that with a glock.

I dont care what glocktalk has to say as they a probably a bunch of tacticool nerds, these are my own opinions from shooting. I like Glocks and all but comparing them to the Marines or Police is silly. They want the most rounds they can fit because there is a very real threat that they will be in a firefight all of the time. Of course a full size auto is better for that. Your average ccw owner isn't fighting the taliban and doesn't need 15 shots.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 09:40 AM   #35
DeltaForceB85
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First of all, someone who is going into a firefight with the Taliban carries a rifle with a minimum of 7 30 round magazines. Not a Glock with 15 rounds.

Secondly, I have fired thousands upon thousands of rounds through Glock pistols in all weather conditions and every shooting position you could think of and a few that you probably wouldn't. I have never had a malfunction that I can remember. EVER.

Thirdly, if you believe that the normal concealed carry situation does not need more than 6 rounds, you are sadly mistaken. In a shooting situation, the average police officer's accuracy drops down to 11%. That's a trained officer. The minimum a person can shoot to become an officer is 80%. Most police officers are VASTLY more proficient with their firearms. And most concealed carry (and police) shootings take place at 7yards or less.

These officers are put under stress and pressure as they send thousands of rounds down range. They are put through multiple live scenarios. They are trained and prepared for a high stress shooting situation.

And their accuracy drops to 11%. 1 out of 10 shots at 7 yards or less.

Average concealed carry person does not get a tenth of the training and range time as these officers.

And you are trying to say that the extra rounds don't matter?

Sorry. That is sheer ignorance.

If you had the same accuracy in a shooting situation as a police officer, and only 6 rounds you have a 66% chance that one (and only one) of those rounds will hit the shooter. Sorry. I would NOT stake my life on those odds.

I had to go through an active shooter shoot house scenario in POST school with a revolver shooter.

I was shot in the back with simunitions because he ran out of ammo and did not have time to reload. He looked like an abstract painting. I was paired with him for a 6 flip plate shooting competition. He didn't make it past the first round. No revolver shooter made it past any semi automatic shooter in any round in that competition.

And if you want to argue that they are more accurate, I won our long range competition with an 87 yard hit on an 8 inch metal plate.

So don't kid yourself. In a real scenario, a reliable semi automatic like a Glock will triumph over a revolver. Period.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 10:58 AM   #36
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Being comfortable, both mentally and physically with your weapon is vital. Double stack mags don't work for me, harder to conceal and I'm missing the end of my trigger finger...
I love revolvers and shoot single action revolvers for fun, generally there's one very handy to me at all times.
I love the 1911 too, great design, and usually more $$ because of being customized, and pretty heavy, which is why I don't carry one anymore.
The glock 36 is one weapon that I'd really like to own, single stack, light, and dependable...what more could one ask for??
OP, you are in a great position, working at a gun shop...shoot 'em, that's how you'll really know what's comfortable for YOU...
I think the Glock 36 would be a great gun for CC.........
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Unread 12-21-2012, 10:59 AM   #37
BlueDevilBrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaForceB85
First of all, someone who is going into a firefight with the Taliban carries a rifle with a minimum of 7 30 round magazines. Not a Glock with 15 rounds.

Secondly, I have fired thousands upon thousands of rounds through Glock pistols in all weather conditions and every shooting position you could think of and a few that you probably wouldn't. I have never had a malfunction that I can remember. EVER.

Thirdly, if you believe that the normal concealed carry situation does not need more than 6 rounds, you are sadly mistaken. In a shooting situation, the average police officer's accuracy drops down to 11%. That's a trained officer. The minimum a person can shoot to become an officer is 80%. Most police officers are VASTLY more proficient with their firearms. And most concealed carry (and police) shootings take place at 7yards or less.

These officers are put under stress and pressure as they send thousands of rounds down range. They are put through multiple live scenarios. They are trained and prepared for a high stress shooting situation.

And their accuracy drops to 11%. 1 out of 10 shots at 7 yards or less.

Average concealed carry person does not get a tenth of the training and range time as these officers.

And you are trying to say that the extra rounds don't matter?

Sorry. That is sheer ignorance.

If you had the same accuracy in a shooting situation as a police officer, and only 6 rounds you have a 66% chance that one (and only one) of those rounds will hit the shooter. Sorry. I would NOT stake my life on those odds.

I had to go through an active shooter shoot house scenario in POST school with a revolver shooter.

I was shot in the back with simunitions because he ran out of ammo and did not have time to reload. He looked like an abstract painting. I was paired with him for a 6 flip plate shooting competition. He didn't make it past the first round. No revolver shooter made it past any semi automatic shooter in any round in that competition.

And if you want to argue that they are more accurate, I won our long range competition with an 87 yard hit on an 8 inch metal plate.

So don't kid yourself. In a real scenario, a reliable semi automatic like a Glock will triumph over a revolver. Period.
Preach it brother.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 01:22 PM   #38
Moabrubi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaForceB85 View Post
First of all, someone who is going into a firefight with the Taliban carries a rifle with a minimum of 7 30 round magazines. Not a Glock with 15 rounds.

Secondly, I have fired thousands upon thousands of rounds through Glock pistols in all weather conditions and every shooting position you could think of and a few that you probably wouldn't. I have never had a malfunction that I can remember. EVER.

Thirdly, if you believe that the normal concealed carry situation does not need more than 6 rounds, you are sadly mistaken. In a shooting situation, the average police officer's accuracy drops down to 11%. That's a trained officer. The minimum a person can shoot to become an officer is 80%. Most police officers are VASTLY more proficient with their firearms. And most concealed carry (and police) shootings take place at 7yards or less.

These officers are put under stress and pressure as they send thousands of rounds down range. They are put through multiple live scenarios. They are trained and prepared for a high stress shooting situation.

And their accuracy drops to 11%. 1 out of 10 shots at 7 yards or less.

Average concealed carry person does not get a tenth of the training and range time as these officers.

And you are trying to say that the extra rounds don't matter?

Sorry. That is sheer ignorance.

If you had the same accuracy in a shooting situation as a police officer, and only 6 rounds you have a 66% chance that one (and only one) of those rounds will hit the shooter. Sorry. I would NOT stake my life on those odds.

I had to go through an active shooter shoot house scenario in POST school with a revolver shooter.

I was shot in the back with simunitions because he ran out of ammo and did not have time to reload. He looked like an abstract painting. I was paired with him for a 6 flip plate shooting competition. He didn't make it past the first round. No revolver shooter made it past any semi automatic shooter in any round in that competition.

And if you want to argue that they are more accurate, I won our long range competition with an 87 yard hit on an 8 inch metal plate.

So don't kid yourself. In a real scenario, a reliable semi automatic like a Glock will triumph over a revolver. Period.
A few that I probably wouldn't? You dont know me so don't try to put it off like you are superior.

Say what you want, but you can't argue that for a ccw, a revolver is more dependable. Of course ill take a full size glock over a revolver as a Police officer soley for the magazine capacity. But for 1 or 2 more shots in a carry gun its hardly worth it.Maybe it's because I'm not as bad *** as you but I have had a glock jam before.

You all act like I said glocks were pieces of junk and jammed everytime. I am just saying a glock is MY number 2 choice. If you want to carry one i could care less.
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Unread 12-21-2012, 01:33 PM   #39
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Unread 12-21-2012, 07:21 PM   #40
marksman1941
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Alright yall. Calm down. i dont want a flame fest on whether glocks or revolvers are better. I'm asking about a Glock 36. If you have viable input about other weapons I will listen, but please quit *****ing to each other about which gun is better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krutj View Post
Being comfortable, both mentally and physically with your weapon is vital. Double stack mags don't work for me, harder to conceal and I'm missing the end of my trigger finger...
I love revolvers and shoot single action revolvers for fun, generally there's one very handy to me at all times.
I love the 1911 too, great design, and usually more $$ because of being customized, and pretty heavy, which is why I don't carry one anymore.
The glock 36 is one weapon that I'd really like to own, single stack, light, and dependable...what more could one ask for??
OP, you are in a great position, working at a gun shop...shoot 'em, that's how you'll really know what's comfortable for YOU...
I think the Glock 36 would be a great gun for CC.........
It's good, but not as good as you think. I don't know of any gun stores in Oregon that have test ranges. Certainly ours doesnt. I can play with guns all I want, but shooting them is not possible.
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Unread 12-22-2012, 08:52 AM   #41
DeltaForceB85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moabrubi

A few that I probably wouldn't? You dont know me so don't try to put it off like you are superior.
No. I don't know you. But given the fact that you stated 15 rounds in a handgun was enough for a person to go into a firefight I'm pretty sure you cant be current or former armed forces. Or current or former law enforcement. Which means you have probably only been to ccw related training schools.

I don't know of any ccw training school where you fire from a seated position over a car steering wheel, flat on your back between your legs (scary) prone behind a 6" barricade and I could continue but I won't because it would be redundant.

I simply said a few you probably wouldn't because when I went through my second phase of POST school I was shooting from positions I had never thought about before. I figured if I hadn't thought about em, somebody else probably hadn't either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moabrubi

Say what you want, but you can't argue that for a ccw, a revolver is more dependable. Of course ill take a full size glock over a revolver as a Police officer soley for the magazine capacity. But for 1 or 2 more shots in a carry gun its hardly worth it.Maybe it's because I'm not as bad *** as you but I have had a glock jam before.
Lets go through this again. A trained law enforcement officers accuracy drops down to 11% in a shooting scenario.

With 6 shots (some smaller revolvers only have 5) you only have a 66% chance that any of your rounds will hit your attacker. And that's IF you have the same accuracy in that situation as someone who has spent hundreds of hours and thousands of rounds training for it.

If my Glock jams during a fire fight I can tap rack bang it in less than 1 second. It takes a lot longer to reload a revolver.

2 more rounds gives me an 88% chance that I am going to hit my attacker. And if I carry another clip and have learned to do a tactical reload, I now have a full 15. That's dependable. 6 rounds is not dependable by statistics alone.

If your Glock jammed it had a defect, is improperly serviced or you were using crappy ammo. Get it checked out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Moabrubi
You all act like I said glocks were pieces of junk and jammed everytime. I am just saying a glock is MY number 2 choice. If you want to carry one i could care less.
No. I act like you said that 6 rounds was reliable in a scenario when your adrenaline spikes through the roof, you lose fine motor control, experience loss of vision and tunnel vision and have no time to get a sight alignment and sight picture.
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Unread 12-22-2012, 09:23 AM   #42
DeltaForceB85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marksman1941
Alright yall. Calm down. i dont want a flame fest on whether glocks or revolvers are better. I'm asking about a Glock 36. If you have viable input about other weapons I will listen, but please quit *****ing to each other about which gun is better.

It's good, but not as good as you think. I don't know of any gun stores in Oregon that have test ranges. Certainly ours doesnt. I can play with guns all I want, but shooting them is not possible.
Alright, I apologize. No more flaming (I prefer the term educating) revolver shooters.

For CCW, I do like the 36 because of its single stack and slimmer slide. I've shot them before and they are a lot of fun. Check the grip on it out though. My friend has bigger hands than I do and found it difficult to manage. One of the girls that were shooting with had smaller hands and had issues depressing the magazine release button on it, so make sure you are comfortable with that as well.

If you are not familiar with purchasing a semi auto handgun, here are a couple of tips.

If the store owner will let you, clear it and with it pointed in a safe direction slowly dry fire it. Pay attention to the feel of the trigger and how much pressure it takes to squeeze it.

Hold it squarely in your hand. If there is space between the grip and the inside of your knuckles or the palm of your hand, it's a little narrow for you.

Rack the slide to the rear and engage the slide release with the thumb of your strong hand. If you can't reach it or struggle to, the grip is a little wide for you (or the slide release is in a bad place for the shape of your hand)

You can over come those issues, but buying a gun that you are more comfortable shooting is easier. ;-)

If you want to do a lot of shooting with it, consider the Glock 26, .45 rounds are expensive to practice with and if they start restricting ammo sales they get hard to find. (Experienced that 4 years ago myself.) 9mm rounds are everywhere. They are cheap to shoot, and they weigh a lot less.

The issue some people have with 9mm is over penetration and that its terminal ballistics aren't as good as 40 or 45. So if you do get a 9mm you would want to get every day carry ammo comparable to Speer Gold Dots or Winchester Rangers which is a little more expensive but gives you better terminal ballistics and less of a chance that you'll shoot through someone and hit an innocent bystander.

My favorite ccw is actually the ruger lc9 because I'm a smaller guy so the lighter weight and smaller size make it easier to conceal for me.
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Unread 12-22-2012, 06:40 PM   #43
tangotag
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The Glock 36 is a decent carry gun, I carry one. It is roughly the same size except skinner than a Glock 19 but has less magazine capacity. There is no light rail on the 36 model so the front is a little smaller too.
A decent gun belt, and a quality holster are the key for comfortable daily carry. I normally carry 19 rounds as configured below. After daily carrying this for 6 months a Glock 26 and 19 feels much thicker.
With regards to a shot-timer, I am still faster shooting 9mm Glocks and they have more capacity giving you more potential critical hits on a bad guy, for about the same size, before a reload.
It's personal preference and right now I prefer the Glock 36 accepting the slightly extra recovery time between shots.
Don't get too caught up in the caliber debate, handguns still only shoot handgun bullets. Critical hits is what matters.
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Unread 12-22-2012, 06:45 PM   #44
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I carried a Glock 23 for years, put between 10-12k rounds through it and the only hiccup I ever had was with Wolf ammo (hard/old primers I think). Being a double-stack mag definitely made concealing it a little bit of a challenge for sure. I've since gotten a Sig P239 (single stack 9mm). It matches my Glock in reliability so far (prolly have about 3k rounds through it), but beats it in conceal-ability. FWIW...
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Unread 12-22-2012, 07:03 PM   #45
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Love my 357 s@w Idc who you are when I pull it on someone they will **** there self in fear
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