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Is it worth getting a diesel?

13K views 90 replies 37 participants last post by  GIRLSELLSCARS 
#1 ·
I'm looking to get a WK and I'm curious about going the diesel route. My goal for the vehicle is to make it a daily driver that I can still take on the trails. Nothing too crazy, but adding a winch, lift, and tires is definitely in the plans.

I like the idea of getting better mileage and torque from a diesel, but I'm wondering how expensive these are to repair. I'm looking at '07 or '08 vehicle. A friend of mine had the diesel Liberty and ultimately got rid of it because how expensive it was to repair. He said that there were so few made that the parts were crazy expensive when they could even find them.

So maybe it's better to go for the v6 or v8 and just deal with the mileage penalty.

I'd appreciate any advice and excuse me if this question has been asked a million times before, I just joined this forum.
 
#3 ·
Search for CRD FAQ and read up on the diesel WKs. They are very reliable but there are known issues. If you educate yourself you'll be ok. The big draw from them is the huge difference in MPG and being able to go up to 500 miles on a tank if you do a lot of highway driving.
 
#4 ·
I had the same questions and decided to buy a '07 Diesel about 3 weeks ago. True, they were only an option for 2 years in the US, but I decided that since this engine/trans combo has been used in hundreds of thousands other Mercedes vehicles, parts and repair should not be too hard.
I think the diesel is a great alternative to the Hemi. It has the same towing power, but gets several MPG better fuel mileage!
 
#6 ·
I had a diesel VW Jetta for almost 11 years (just sold it last month) and was really interested in the CRD when I went looking for a GC a year and a half ago. The number on the used market were few and far between unless I wanted to buy one long distance.

In the end, I went with a Hemi. They were readily available and I was able to get a 2008 Limited in mint condition with a great service record. It's not my daily driver and I only drive about 9000 miles a year in it. If I drove it more miles I might have waited a while longer to try and find a diesel in my area.

Good luck with your search!
 
#8 ·
I had a diesel VW Jetta for almost 11 years (just sold it last month) and was really interested in the CRD when I went looking for a GC a year and a half ago. The number on the used market were few and far between unless I wanted to buy one long distance.

In the end, I went with a Hemi. They were readily available and I was able to get a 2008 Limited in mint condition with a great service record. It's not my daily driver and I only drive about 9000 miles a year in it. If I drove it more miles I might have waited a while longer to try and find a diesel in my area.

Good luck with your search!
you drive more miles in your non daily driver than i do in my actual daily driver! (CRD)

its a nice engine OP, at least try a test drive, if the pedal feels slightly mushy off the line compared to the gas versions then that can be fixed with a tune.
 
#9 ·
As the original owner of an '07 CRD WK, I'd have to say...definitely not! I just collected my CRD from the dealer after its second round of swirl motor/flap repair in the last year, and on the way home the check engine light came on again. Yes, the diesel will deliver HEMI grunt with better-than-6-cylinder fuel economy, but the added hassle (and cost) of maintenance, to me, just are not worth it...and that's assuming that you are lucky enough to get one that has no mechanical troubles. If you do a lot of research on here you'll find that, for a vehicle that only comprised 3% of WK production in '07, the CRD exhibits far more than its share of engine-related problems. I can't help that the engine is "a Mercedes" (woohoo). A garage queen is still a garage queen, and if you have to remove or bypass equipment that Mercedes or anyone else installs on/in an engine in order to get it to run reliably, then that engine is not reliable, period. I suppose if you enjoy tinkering and trying to solve problems with your engines, then you might not mind dealing with this combination...but me, I'm sick to death of this crap and when the vehicle is gone I'll be thrilled.

That's just the CRD part of the WK equation. As for the rest of the vehicle...it is now obvious that the WK was an under-developed design that went into production before it was ready for public consumption and, once in production, development stopped. My vehicle has had numerous electrical and HVAC issues and, along with tons of other owners on here, mine has had (nearly since day one) an unresolved ongoing intermittent severe drive line vibration. Drive train vibration issues are quite common in WKs, regardless of which engines are installed. Most folks have replaced (in many cases multiple times) drive shafts/u-joints in attempts to solve this problem, usually with limited or no success. Changing out my rear drive shaft only altered slightly the circumstances under which the vibration manifests itself. The worn u-joints that many have believed to be the problem are beginning to appear to be just a symptom that is caused by the actual problem(s?) farther upstream somewhere in the drive train...possibly a defective coupling between the transmission and the transfer case, etc. Nobody outside of Jeep appears to know for sure, and if Jeep knows they're not saying, they're just leaving us all to twist in the wind.

While there must be owners of CRD WKs out there who've had few (or even no) problems, I'd bet good money that most of them are unaware of just how lucky they are. It's very difficult to recommend a vehicle with this much baggage to anyone, so I'd have to say...choose a different vehicle. Obviously, JMO...YMMV
 
#13 ·
If you do a lot of research on here you'll find that, for a vehicle that only comprised 3% of WK production in '07, the CRD exhibits far more than its share of engine-related problems.
1dzlwk you sound like you've a crap WK, so I sympathise, but there always some crap vehicles. Pick ANY vehicle that you want instead and you'll find others on those forums with their own lemon. As you say lots of your problems are about the WK irrespective of engine although emissions equipment is messing up pretty much all modern motors and will continue to do so. You also seem to have had a rubbish dealer who no doubt tucked you up for the swirl job.

I don't know if the 3% of WK production includes Europe, but you must surely know that literally hundreds of thousands of vehicles use that engine, and the vast majority of WH/XH in Europe are CRD.

For myself, I am the 3rd owner of my XH, and the only mechanical failure I had was EGR and I thrash my CRD like a peasant treats a donkey. A Hemi wouldn't be suitable in the UK, as fuel is over $10 a gallon here.

OP, IMHO you live a a country with cheap juice, and so enjoy and get the Hemi as you're mileage is still low and it'll be cheaper to buy, but get what you want, otherwise you'll never be happy!
 
#10 ·
1dzlwk said:
As the original owner of an '07 CRD WK, I'd have to say...definitely not! I just collected my CRD from the dealer after its second round of swirl motor/flap repair in the last year, and on the way home the check engine light came on again. Yes, the diesel will deliver HEMI grunt with better-than-6-cylinder fuel economy, but the added hassle (and cost) of maintenance, to me, just are not worth it...and that's assuming that you are lucky enough to get one that has no mechanical troubles. If you do a lot of research on here you'll find that, for a vehicle that only comprised 3% of WK production in '07, the CRD exhibits far more than its share of engine-related problems. I can't help that the engine is "a Mercedes" (woohoo). A garage queen is still a garage queen, and if you have to remove or bypass equipment that Mercedes or anyone else installs on/in an engine in order to get it to run reliably, then that engine is not reliable, period. I suppose if you enjoy tinkering and trying to solve problems with your engines, then you might not mind dealing with this combination...but me, I'm sick to death of this crap and when the vehicle is gone I'll be thrilled. That's just the CRD part of the WK equation. As for the rest of the vehicle...it is now obvious that the WK was an under-developed design that went into production before it was ready for public consumption and, once in production, development stopped. My vehicle has had numerous electrical and HVAC issues and, along with tons of other owners on here, mine has had (nearly since day one) an unresolved ongoing intermittent severe drive line vibration. Drive train vibration issues are quite common in WKs, regardless of which engines are installed. Most folks have replaced (in many cases multiple times) drive shafts/u-joints in attempts to solve this problem, usually with limited or no success. Changing out my rear drive shaft only altered slightly the circumstances under which the vibration manifests itself. The worn u-joints that many have believed to be the problem are beginning to appear to be just a symptom that is caused by the actual problem(s?) farther upstream somewhere in the drive train...possibly a defective coupling between the transmission and the transfer case, etc. Nobody outside of Jeep appears to know for sure, and if Jeep knows they're not saying, they're just leaving us all to twist in the wind. While there must be owners of CRD WKs out there who've had few (or even no) problems, I'd bet good money that most of them are unaware of just how lucky they are. It's very difficult to recommend a vehicle with this much baggage to anyone, so I'd have to say...choose a different vehicle. Obviously, JMO...YMMV
Have you implemented the known fixes of the swirl motors issues? We have made it very clear that a Jeep dealer and a Swirl Motor repair do not mix..ever. Seems you have only one issues with the CRD engine and it is the one issue that everyone knows about.

Why not exercise your rights and trade or sell the CRD?

There are a handful of people on here who love to tinker with their CRD. You will notice that the same group of people generally post and discuss their CRD.

Not sure what state you are in, but seems to me you have a Lemon Law case.....
 
#37 ·
If by "implemented the known fixes" you mean have I defeated my CCV emission control devices, I don't believe in that solution, so no, I have not/will not go down that road.

The vehicle belonged to my wife before we were married, so I inherited it. She'll be the one to make the decision to keep/dump it, and she's starting to come around to the notion of trading it off while it still has some of the extended warranty left on it.

The state I'm in does have a "lemon law", but it only applies in the first 12 months of ownership, so we're way beyond that solution.

that was almost politician'esque! or maybe I missed the part where you answered if you could still argue that a CRD was a more cost efficient option for somebody who drives 10k year and does no towing?

I do have a hard time wrapping my head around a CRD being anymore capable than it's gasoline powered counterpart when it comes to the type of off-road situations that most people on this site are putting their vehicle through.

it really comes down to a couple factors imo. drive more than 15k miles/year? get a CRD! going to do lots of towing over sizable distances? get a CRD! plan on doing both? DEFINITELY get a CRD! in most all other situations get an 08+ 4.7L or a HEMI, save yourself like $5k and call it good!
My problems aside, people crunching EPA numbers for cost/benefit comparisons should realize that diesels almost always comfortably exceed their EPA ratings. The EPA test cycle is notoriously hostile toward diesels for some reason. The EPA said my CRD was only good for 23mpg on the highway, yet that's what it delivers in town, while typically returning 25-26 on the highway. I've also found that it'll do a good 10% better than that at high altitude (7-10k ft). How often, and under what circumstances, will a HEMI WK exceed (or even equal) its EPA rating?

Another aspect that doesn't show up in the numbers, unless you look carefully, is the driveability benefit. Most folks who are just driving around are operating their vehicles in the 1500-2500rpm range. That's right where diesels hit hardest...they are tuned to deliver their very best in day-to-day use. A HEMI only has CRD torque if you rev it to well over 3000rpm. Cost/benefit comparisons typically ignore this substantial driveability benefit of a diesel, a benefit that manifests itself every time the car moves. How do you put a dollar value on that?
 
#11 ·
Given everything stays the same as far as costs and repairs between a gas or Diesel are concerned, at 50 cents more for a gallon of diesel (in my area at least ), is it worth it ? I know brand new Diesel trucks are more expensive the gas trucks so I was wondering at 50 cents more for diesel, how long does it take to make up for the extra cost of a diesel if you drive an average amount every year. I don't know very much about Diesels as I have never owned one but I have some friends that own them and It seems many of them are always working on them. Maybe it's just the brand ? I always thought these things were supposed to run forever.
 
#12 ·
Research, research, research. This question comes up a lot so there's 100s of posts that ask this same question. In fact so many people are erroneous on their info that I've included it in my WK CRD FAQ that has links to actual factual info and not forum posts by anonymous people. One study does the TCO of gas and diesel vehicles. In essence, you pay more up front in the purchase but fuelly and other mpg calculation show that the CRD gets significantly better than EPA mileage with no modifications and the Hemi almost never gets EPA without modifications and careful driving. Also those who are anti diesel gloss over the fact that if you want to trade up or sell the diesel will have much higher resale value to about what you paid in the difference up front. Gas fluctuates a lot where diesel is more stable and in winter diesel goes up some b/c it's a heating oil substitute but in the summer the delta is much lower as gas prices go up due to much more travel in the warmer months and diesel is not needed for heating oil so it doesn't go up much. In fact around May-June diesel may be only 10 cents more and in cases where I live lower than the regular unleaded (I wish I could buy 100 gallon barrel and fill it up at home but HOA doesn't allow it)
 
#14 ·
"I like the idea of getting better mileage and torque from a diesel, but I'm wondering how expensive these are to repair. I'm looking at '07 or '08 vehicle. A friend of mine had the diesel Liberty and ultimately got rid of it because how expensive it was to repair. He said that there were so few made that the parts were crazy expensive when they could even find them."

In terms of how expensive to repair.... it could be crazy high if something really goes sideways but could happened with any Jeep. The maintenance is higher if you don't do it yourself..... an oil change at dealer is something like $120 and why many CRD owners do it themselves. But you can go between 6250-12500 miles per. As far as the Liberty CRD and parts availability, I had one too before my current WK CRD and they are night and day. On parts - the liberty CRD engine to my knowledge wasnt in any other US based vehicles at the time where the WK 3.0 is in the Sprinters in the US as well as all over EU. Good luck in your comparisons and decisions. It's a tough one.
 
#15 ·
So it seems that it's 7 to 2 in favor of the diesel so far.

I'm willing to tinker with the engine but I haven't done much of that in the past. Is this a good engine to learn on or is it just too complicated?

I've only seen a few CRDs for sale, so if I go this route I guess I'll be looking for a long while.

Thanks again for all the advice.
 
#17 ·
So it seems that it's 7 to 2 in favor of the diesel so far.

I'm willing to tinker with the engine but I haven't done much of that in the past. Is this a good engine to learn on or is it just too complicated?

I've only seen a few CRDs for sale, so if I go this route I guess I'll be looking for a long while.

Thanks again for all the advice.
There are 2 within 60 miles it appears. Check autotrader. Next you need to find and speak to the CJD dealerships near you and talk to their diesel tech about how many he has/had serviced.
 
#16 ·
I vote Diesel

Since I tow an RV around a lot, I vote go for the diesel.

I have an 07 CRD and have had the swirl experience, and replaced on glow plug, and I am about to dig into a turbo actuator issue. That's about it. The swirl fix is easily resolved now. The glow plug cost me $37.00 and 1/2 hour of my labor. I just ordered a turbo actuator for $300.00....we'll see how that goes.

If you have a dealer do repairs....it is big $$$$$$$. They want $7000 parts and labor to replace a turbo and will not do just the actuator.
 
#18 ·
I'll say that I love our WK with the Hemi. I don't think you'll be disappointed either way. And I'd bet overall running costs are about the same between the two. Hemi parts will be cheaper/readily available and finding someone to service it will be easier. You may save a little money with the CRD if you keep it for a long time. If you're towing heavy loads often, then crd is probably better, but for me the hemi has plenty of power to tow as much as I'm comfortable towing with the wk. Just try and decide which Pros and Cons are most important to you.
 
#19 ·
I'm looking to get a WK and I'm curious about going the diesel route. My goal for the vehicle is to make it a daily driver that I can still take on the trails. Nothing too crazy, but adding a winch, lift, and tires is definitely in the plans.

I like the idea of getting better mileage and torque from a diesel, but I'm wondering how expensive these are to repair. I'm looking at '07 or '08 vehicle. A friend of mine had the diesel Liberty and ultimately got rid of it because how expensive it was to repair. He said that there were so few made that the parts were crazy expensive when they could even find them.

So maybe it's better to go for the v6 or v8 and just deal with the mileage penalty.

I'd appreciate any advice and excuse me if this question has been asked a million times before, I just joined this forum.
Over here in the uk there really isn't much of a decision to make due to the cost of petrol (gas) vs diesel.

I've a 2007 wk crd with 50k miles on the clock of which I've done circa 20k only issue I've had was with the 4wd low range actuator going on the blink but that's nothing to do with the engine itself. I can honestly say that in diesel form it's no slouch as it produces peak torque at 1800rpm which makes for effortless driving.

I'd recommend you test drive both options and make your choice that way.

Good luck and which ever you choose it will be a great choice of truck.

:2thumbsup:
 
#20 ·
It took me about 7 months to find my CRD. I ended up finding it in arizona a little over 400 miles away. I am very happy with it so far. I jus took a road trip and got a high of 25.6mpg. Ive put around 5k miles on it so far and no problems related to the engine yet (knock on wood) It is actually in the shop right now getting the shocks and struts replaced and the 4wd repaired. (all under warranty)

Will
 
#21 ·
It really boils down to how much you plan on driving. I did some math a few days ago and it would be something like $700/year in fuel savings if I drove 15k miles/year. (16mpg vs 23mpg) I don't drive 15k+ miles/year, so I don't really see the value myself.

Another thing people will argue is the longevity of the CRD vs everything else. They just need to stop. There are people with 300k+ on the gas motors in their WK with no major repairs. Do you really plan on driving your Jeep that long?
 
#23 ·
It really boils down to how much you plan on driving. I did some math a few days ago and it would be something like $700/year in fuel savings if I drove 15k miles/year. (16mpg vs 23mpg) I don't drive 15k+ miles/year, so I don't really see the value myself.

Another thing people will argue is the longevity of the CRD vs everything else. They just need to stop. There are people with 300k+ on the gas motors in their WK with no major repairs. Do you really plan on driving your Jeep that long?
That's exactly my thoughts on it. I've never done the math, but I am curious if the mileage savings outweigh the nearly twice as expensive oil changes though. (I change mine at 6-7k miles to be 100% safe, I've never had it tested but really should)

My first year with my CRD I put 31k miles on it, so I think I probably broke even. I haven't had any trouble with the engine at all. It's got gobs of torque and is a blast to drive. I'm now at 100,300 miles (bought it a little over a year ago with 60.5k)

My only qualms are the transmission, which I feel is hit or miss with shift quality (but I also just hate automatics in general. I wish I could put a standard in this thing without spending ungodly amounts of money...)

There were only 3 CRDs in a 400 miles radius from me when I was looking. I looked at one that seemed to have something wrong with it (super high backpressure it seemed, probably a clogged DPF) and then the second one I looked at was mint. I drove from CT to New Hampshire for it.

The other thing I like about diesels are that yes, you spend more money on fuel, but if you had a gas engine with as much torque you'd be most likely be paying for 93 octane gasoline anyways which makes the fuel cost difference much closer anyways. (aside from the ecoboost f150 which runs on 87... direct injection is amazing) Diesel can make way more power straight outta the pump.
 
#24 ·
I love diesels but don't think I'd drive a grand cherokee with one. I had a 2002 duramax before my Jeep and had the injectors on it fail. Naturally, they failed months after their special warranty ended. Needless to say, $3000 later I sold it because I couldn't stomach the thought of it happening again, which it could at any time, I learned after spending countless hours on duramaxforum.com.

With that being said, I loved my duramax. 18mpg in town and 20-22 on the highway. I never used it for towing or anything, it just didn't make sense to me to buy a 1/2 ton truck and get 12mpg without diesel capability. It had gobs of power and was effortless to drive. Driving my V6 gasser feels super underpowered now. If diesel wasn't 75 to 90 cents more expensive than gas here, I'd go the diesel route again. It just happens come tax time you can always count on another 5 a gal no matter what. I can't support that anymore.

Long story short, if diesel in your area is within 30 cents of gas. Do it.
 
#26 ·
I love diesels but don't think I'd drive a grand cherokee with one. I had a 2002 duramax before my Jeep and had the injectors on it fail. Naturally, they failed months after their special warranty ended. Needless to say, $3000 later I sold it because I couldn't stomach the thought of it happening again, which it could at any time, I learned after spending countless hours on duramaxforum.com.

With that being said, I loved my duramax. 18mpg in town and 20-22 on the highway. I never used it for towing or anything, it just didn't make sense to me to buy a 1/2 ton truck and get 12mpg without diesel capability. It had gobs of power and was effortless to drive. Driving my V6 gasser feels super underpowered now. If diesel wasn't 75 to 90 cents more expensive than gas here, I'd go the diesel route again. It just happens come tax time you can always count on another 5 a gal no matter what. I can't support that anymore.

Long story short, if diesel in your area is within 30 cents of gas. Do it.
Did you buy that duramax new or had you just not researched it much before buying it used? The LB7s were notorious for injector problems and a huge pain in the *** to change them on. The ones after the lb7 had less injector problems and easier to change if a failure was to happen. (as I'm sure you now know... lol) I was thinking about getting rid of my WK for a crew cab LBZ or an LLY duramax but decided against it for money reasons.

Don't mean to hijack the thread. Just wanted to throw that in there.

I'm still hoping for that whole 'it's expected this 3.0 engine goes 200,000 miles in a delivery van before a rebuild' stands true for my jeep.
 
#34 ·
All this talk of initial cost vs gas engine is irrelevant now. A CRD hasn't been in a WK in the US in 6 years. I bought a used one, and yes, it was priced a bit higher than a comparable gas WK. I'm very happy with the CRD's fuel mileage that a gas V-6 owner would be happy to get, PLUS I can actually tow something substantial.
Diesels aren't for everybody, but I am happy with mine!
 
#39 ·
I have a Liberty CRD and a 2008 GC CRD. My Liberty is my everyday driver and is now at 132k and going strong. I save my GC CRD for long hauls, mostly towing. For that reason, I only have 40k on my GC. Of that 40k, I estimate that 25k are towing miles. Since before I acquired my diesels I towed with a v6 gasser, I have direct basis for comparison. The gasser will tow at about 11mpg; and the diesels tow the same rig at 17 to 20 mpg. Refueling with gas typically yields about 200 mile intervals; vs about 300 miles with diesels. For the long distance towing that I do, this is a big payoff in time and cost savings.

I have done only one long distance trip with the GC without towing and measured a total trip mileage calculation of 24.5mpg typically driving at 65 to 85 mph.

Except for a radio replacement while still under warranty, my GC CRD has been trouble free and required only scheduled maintenance.
 
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