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Unread 02-16-2014, 08:33 PM   #1
ISUzj
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2005 WK 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: TheMoines, Iowa
Posts: 786
Replaced plugs, have to give it gas to start

I recently bought my WK, and it was starting hard every now and then. I pulled the plugs and there were worn out, and it seemed to start better for about a week. went from Champions to NGK coppers

Now again, I need to press the gas pedal to get it to start. otherwise I just sit there and crank it and nothing happens.

Is this a TPS issue? or would this be related to the crank pos sensor?

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Unread 02-16-2014, 10:41 PM   #2
maloj2003wj
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If u originally had champions, you should stick to them. I believe they switched to ngks in 2008. U can checkout wkjeeps.com they have a bunch of useful info.
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Unread 02-17-2014, 01:50 PM   #3
90grandoneer
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I call BS on the use of only Champions. I've run copper NGK's (LZTR4A-11, Stock No. 5306) in both my 05 Hemi LX and 06 Hemi WK for many, many thousands of miles and have never had a hint of trouble. I even run my WK with SOS coils and .060 gaps, and it runs better than it ever did. The LX gets the same treatment next, but I want to switch to the late valve covers/coils first. On the Champions, if they can't even make the same part number between dealer and aftermarket alike, I don't want any part of them. Gotta be black or silver top (or whatever) is absolute BS. I also used to work on recip. aircraft engines, and Champions were the worst, followed closely by Autolite. It appears they haven't improved much. Strange it took Chrysler a few years to figure this out too.

ISUzj, since yours is an 05, you also need to check the resistance of the spark plug wires, especially if you have over ~75K and they've never been changed. A new/relative new 3 ft. long wire should have a resistance of ~18,000 ohms or there abouts. The old rule of thumb for resistance type spark plug wires is, no more than ~10,000 ohms per foot. While plug wires are not likely your problem, it can cause misfire/stalling issues. If you have to change them, I would recommend you either purchase the Taylor Shorty wires (I currently have these on my 05), or convert to the later, no plug wire setup like I plan on doing.

Your problem could be any number of things but, since this is a new to you vehicle and it obviously hasn't had much TLC, I'd highly recommend you do a major (60K or 100K) service on the entire vehicle, including all engine sensors (MAP/Cam/Crank/O2), TB cleaning, Trans/diff/Xfer case service, EGR/PCV Valves, etc. I am sure you'll be surprised what you find. You should also consider adding a catch can (a must on the Hemi, IMO), especially if, when you do the TB cleaning, you find the intake manifold plenum very contaminated with oil. Chances are also very good that the PCM/TCM CALID flash files are no where near current. My 06 WK was 4 updates behind when I bought it back in 09. Also check the fuel pressure. My guess is once you've got the maintenance up to date, your problem will vanish.
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Unread 02-17-2014, 02:35 PM   #4
ISUzj
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: TheMoines, Iowa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 90grandoneer View Post
I call BS on the use of only Champions. I've run copper NGK's (LZTR4A-11, Stock No. 5306) in both my 05 Hemi LX and 06 Hemi WK for many, many thousands of miles and have never had a hint of trouble. I even run my WK with SOS coils and .060 gaps, and it runs better than it ever did. The LX gets the same treatment next, but I want to switch to the late valve covers/coils first. On the Champions, if they can't even make the same part number between dealer and aftermarket alike, I don't want any part of them. Gotta be black or silver top (or whatever) is absolute BS. I also used to work on recip. aircraft engines, and Champions were the worst, followed closely by Autolite. It appears they haven't improved much. Strange it took Chrysler a few years to figure this out too.

ISUzj, since yours is an 05, you also need to check the resistance of the spark plug wires, especially if you have over ~75K and they've never been changed. A new/relative new 3 ft. long wire should have a resistance of ~18,000 ohms or there abouts. The old rule of thumb for resistance type spark plug wires is, no more than ~10,000 ohms per foot. While plug wires are not likely your problem, it can cause misfire/stalling issues. If you have to change them, I would recommend you either purchase the Taylor Shorty wires (I currently have these on my 05), or convert to the later, no plug wire setup like I plan on doing.

Your problem could be any number of things but, since this is a new to you vehicle and it obviously hasn't had much TLC, I'd highly recommend you do a major (60K or 100K) service on the entire vehicle, including all engine sensors (MAP/Cam/Crank/O2), TB cleaning, Trans/diff/Xfer case service, EGR/PCV Valves, etc. I am sure you'll be surprised what you find. You should also consider adding a catch can (a must on the Hemi, IMO), especially if, when you do the TB cleaning, you find the intake manifold plenum very contaminated with oil. Chances are also very good that the PCM/TCM CALID flash files are no where near current. My 06 WK was 4 updates behind when I bought it back in 09. Also check the fuel pressure. My guess is once you've got the maintenance up to date, your problem will vanish.
Phew.. thats a lot of info, but probrably all correct:

Everything I read on Champs Vs NGK was bascailly as long as they are Copper core, they should be fine.

Already did the Throttle body clean, and yes it was filthy. A catch can is on my list of things to do(once it warms up outside). I am ordering a MAP/ Cam/ Crank sensor, haven't got the O2's yet. I have pretty decent gas mileage, so I will do those last.

Did the front and rear diff service, trans has been serviced. Just need to do the diff. Oil still has 2.5K on it yet, I cleaned my PCV valve and haven't done anything with the EGR( wouldnt I get a CEL for that one?).

So after all my sensors are replaced, I will take a look at the wires. I got a Fluke at home, and I will check ohms when I get a chance. Taylor shorties have been on my list since I did plugs, I want to get rid of that mess up top.

Thanks for the advice, I will report what I figure out for others when I get around to it all.
__________________
Can't wait to get started, but my wallet can......
~~~_______oooo_
~~ / ../...\...\_____\
~~[_---_____---_\-\\\\\\-\
~~~(o) )-o---(o) )-o---) )
94ZJ 5.2 Red; Rusty's 3" Coils,Skyjacker hydro's, Brush Guard, Custom Rear Bumper, Custom Roof Rack, KVG Quick Discos, 31-10.50-15's DAYTON TIMBERLINE A/T OBA 2 Gallon tank
Can't buy it? BUILD IT!! Do it cheap too cuz your in college

My Build Thread Align your jeep yourself B N B#175
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Unread 02-17-2014, 03:09 PM   #5
90grandoneer
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2006 WK 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: City of Trees
Posts: 1,860
The EGR may or may not throw a code, depending on how bad it is. When mine went out (~60K IIRC) it threw a code. I have DashHawks on both my vehicles and I just cleared the code. It came back the next day so I just changed the valve. Symptoms of a bad one are erratic, almost stalling idle, low speed surging, and reduced performance and fuel economy.

Sounds like you have a pretty good handle on things. If you're fuel economy is pretty good, your O2's may still be pretty good. How many miles on it? If changing the other sensors doesn't fix your issue, something else may be going on. As far as the O2's go, if you need a little more info., here's a thread I did a few years ago after I had problems: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f67/o...rimer-1182446/ You may or may not find it helpful. Good luck and keep us posted.
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06 GCO, Dk Khaki, QDII, Flshing Hi 3rd Bk Lt, MDS "ON" Lt, Airtab Vortex Gens, Debadged, Fumoto Drain Valve, BT Catch Can, Chopped EGR Tube, SRT8 CAI, K&N Filter, Sonnax Trans Line Press Booster, SC Tuner W/Adv Trans Tune App, DS Tuner, Cust tubular hdrs w/3 in Magnaflow/Xlerator AP Exh Sys, Bilsteins, SRT Springs/Sways, Cust Eng Cvr, SRT8 frt/rear bumpers, FRI Sidewinder Cam/6.1 valvetrain, SLP 25% UD Pulley, BBK true 90mm T-Body, SOS Ign Coils w/.060 spark plug gaps, SRT Reps with 265/45&295/40X20's.
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