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Unread 04-22-2011, 12:10 PM   #16
WK-916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifted_up View Post
It automatically disables everything besides the limited slip feature when you shift into 4 low. No need to mess with anything. The only way to completely disable it would be to pull the abs fuse.
The limited Slip feature you are referring to is call Traction Control

And you can unplug the Connector to the ABS Stepper motor to disable Traction Control without pulling a fuse

So people are saying two different things....

One is saying it Turns the TC off when in 4low

Another is saying it turn off ESP and Leaves on TC... Which one is it???

You do know ESP and Traction Control are seperate things right? ESP isn't traction control....


Can anyone clarify.....?

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Unread 04-22-2011, 12:24 PM   #17
WK-916
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Ok here is some clarification:

ESP modes - additional information


ESP can be disengaged by the driver, causing less ESP intervention, placing more vehicle control in the driver’s hands. SRT drivers and off-road enthusiasts may wish to partially disengage the system for more spirited driving or extreme maneuvers requiring additional wheel slip, such as highspeed cornering or rapid acceleration from a standstill.

The availability of the Fully ON, Partially OFF and Fully OFF modes varies by vehicle type: normal, SRT and select 4x4 vehicles.

Normal vehicles
Normal vehicles consist of Chrysler and Dodge automobiles and 2WD SUVs. They feature two of the modes: Fully ON… and Partially OFF. ESP Fully OFF mode would not typically be offered.

SRT vehicles
SRT models (except Grand Cherokee) and police vehicles feature all three Modes: Fully ON… Partially OFF… and Fully OFF.

Select 4x4 vehicles
Select 4x4 vehicles also feature all three modes. LESS ESP intervention may be valuable in situations where some wheel slip is desirable. ESP Partial Off mode will allow for more wheel slip, while the Fully Off mode will allow for even more wheel slip by completely disabling the All-Speed Traction Control. In Fully Off mode Yaw Control and Electronic Roll Mitigation are also disabled. When the vehicle’s transfer case is in the 4LO mode, the ESP Fully Off mode is automatically engaged.

Operation modes

Fully On

Fully engaged, active ESP means all modes — all active, all the time. This is called the Fully ON mode and should be used for normal driving. The Fully ON mode completely activates the Antilock Brake System, Low-Speed Traction Control, All-Speed Traction Control, ESP Yaw Control, and Electronic Roll Mitigation. By default, whenever the vehicle is started, ESP is Fully ON or fully active.

Fully ON is automatically engaged, requiring no specific driver input. The system defaults to Fully ON each time the key is turned from the “off” to the “on” position or when shifting the transfer case on 4x4 vehicles. One push of the ESP button will put ESP back into the Fully ON mode if the vehicle is already in the Partially OFF or Fully OFF setting.

Partially OFF

The Partially OFF mode provides less automatic control by modifying the all-speed traction control and ESP yaw control thresholds. This will allow for limited wheel slip for high-performance driving situations, or driving off-road.

To select the Partially OFF mode, a single press of the “ESP OFF” button at any speed is all it takes. A warning lamp in the instrument cluster will illuminate.
esp_modes_operation_01s.jpg  
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Unread 04-22-2011, 12:51 PM   #18
sal-XK
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I off road and rock crawl my QT2 all the time so here is what I know. 4LO turns ESP off and turns traction control to partial off. Partial meaning the traction control will allow a lot more tire slip then in any other setting for extra traction while in snow, mud and sand. The only way to completely turn it off is to pull the fuse or install a switch on the fuse to do it easier. The system how ever seems to detect what you are in like sand versus rocks. If one wheel is spinning but other is completely still (found in rock crawling a lot) the system figures that out vary fast and engages the spinning wheel forcing power to the other wheel. If one wheel is spinning but the other wheel is spinning as well just not as fast ( like sand,mud,snow) the system delays and doesn't immediately jump in allowing more tire spin to occur. But when it does kick in with lots of wheel spin happening its very violent. This is my experience using the system.
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:03 PM   #19
nostaw22
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Check out this article they wrote about the JK ESP system... Most of it is similar to what is in the WK. They go through the different modes of "On" and "Off":

http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticles/electrical/154_0905_wrangler_control_system/index.html


JW
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:14 PM   #20
sal-XK
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here are two videos you can see the difference in how the system is reacting

Rocks you can see the tire is not spinning to bad before the system stops it.

This one is sand you can see the system is allowing more spin and you can her the clunk when the tire is grabbed and the spider gears are pissed off.
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:23 PM   #21
WK-916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nostaw22 View Post
Check out this article they wrote about the JK ESP system... Most of it is similar to what is in the WK. They go through the different modes of "On" and "Off":

http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticles/electrical/154_0905_wrangler_control_system/index.html


JW
The system is different
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:24 PM   #22
WK-916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sal-XK View Post
I off road and rock crawl my QT2 all the time so here is what I know. 4LO turns ESP off and turns traction control to partial off. Partial meaning the traction control will allow a lot more tire slip then in any other setting for extra traction while in snow, mud and sand. The only way to completely turn it off is to pull the fuse or install a switch on the fuse to do it easier. The system how ever seems to detect what you are in like sand versus rocks. If one wheel is spinning but other is completely still (found in rock crawling a lot) the system figures that out vary fast and engages the spinning wheel forcing power to the other wheel. If one wheel is spinning but the other wheel is spinning as well just not as fast ( like sand,mud,snow) the system delays and doesn't immediately jump in allowing more tire spin to occur. But when it does kick in with lots of wheel spin happening its very violent. This is my experience using the system.
I just gave you an explanation right from Chrysler.... a full overview of operation... read it.... has a lot of good info
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:26 PM   #23
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When the vehicle’s transfer case is in the 4LO mode, the ESP Fully Off mode is automatically engaged.

=

Brake only Traction Control and No ESP
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:28 PM   #24
sal-XK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WK-916 View Post
I just gave you an explanation right from Chrysler.... a full overview of operation... read it.... has a lot of good info
I don't need to read it bro, I live it! I use the system all the time and provided a visual explanation of how the traction control works. I'm off road at least twice a week I have a pretty good understanding of the traction control system.
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:31 PM   #25
WK-916
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"I don't need to read it bro, I live it! "

WOW that was alittle corny dude.....
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:33 PM   #26
sal-XK
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Originally Posted by WK-916 View Post
"I don't need to read it bro, I live it! "

WOW that was alittle corny dude.....
Ya think? I though it sounded pretty good.
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:36 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by sal-XK View Post
Ya think? I though it sounded pretty good.
I wasn't trying to insult... Just trying to give clarification with exact factual explanation from Chrysler, instead of going "I 'sense' it doing this" without knowing exact mechanics....

I find that little chart the best explanation for TC and ESP function w/ 4lo
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:39 PM   #28
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"The system how ever seems to detect what you are in like sand versus rocks. If one wheel is spinning but other is completely still (found in rock crawling a lot) the system figures that out vary fast and engages the spinning wheel forcing power to the other wheel"

=

"The system also uses Throttle Anticipate – sensing quick movement in throttle from a stop – and it takes steps to maximize traction before tire slippage even occurs"
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:42 PM   #29
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Yes but the manual leaves a lot to the imagination like what is modified thresh hold exactly ? So if you watch the videos and just stare at the tires you can see the difference going from rock to sand.
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Unread 04-22-2011, 01:46 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sal-XK View Post
Yes but the manual leaves a lot to the imagination like what is modified thresh hold exactly ? So if you watch the videos and just stare at the tires you can see the difference going from rock to sand.
Modified threshold means.... different "mapping" of software....

Looking at Tires spinning in the air and then grabbing doesn't tell me ESP is on/off, Traction is Full/Partial on, or Roll Mitigation is On/Off....

I am just answering the guys question in post # 1.... he wanted to know if TC was on during 4low....

Well yes it is.... partially.... The Engine part of the TC is off.... Brake Part of TC is ON.

I don't need an explanation, besides I can't view you-tube from the PC I am at.
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