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Unread 11-16-2010, 08:21 PM   #16
smcginnis87
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is there a wright up on how to change the starter ? or some where that has pics ?

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Unread 11-18-2010, 09:44 PM   #17
Budasac
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REMOVAL
3.7L / 4.7L
1. Disconnect and isolate negative battery cable.
2. Raise and support vehicle.
3. Note: If equipped with 4WD and certain transmissions,
a support bracket is used between front axle
and side of transmission. Remove 2 support
bracket bolts at transmission. Pry support bracket
slightly to gain access to lower starter mounting
bolt.
4. Remove two bolts (3) if equipped with an automatic
transmission.
5. Move starter motor (4) towards front of vehicle far
enough for nose of starter pinion housing to clear
housing. Always support starter motor during this
process, do not let starter motor hang from wire
harness.
6. Tilt nose downwards and lower starter motor far enough to access and remove nut (2) that secures battery positive
cable wire harness connector eyelet (1) to solenoid battery terminal stud. Do not let starter motor hang from
wire harness.
7. Remove battery positive cable wire harness connector eyelet (5) from solenoid battery terminal stud.
8. Disconnect battery positive cable wire harness connector from solenoid terminal connector receptacle.
9. Remove starter motor.
5.7L V-8
1. Disconnect and isolate negative battery cable.
2. Raise and support vehicle.
3. Note: If equipped with 4WD and certain transmissions,
a support bracket is used between front axle
and side of transmission. Remove 2 support
bracket bolts at transmission. Pry support bracket
slightly to gain access to lower starter mounting
bolt.
4. Remove two mounting bolts (2).
5. Move starter motor towards front of vehicle far
enough for nose of starter pinion housing to clear
housing. Always support starter motor (1) during
this process, do not let starter motor hang from
wire harness.
6. Tilt nose downwards and lower starter motor far
enough to access and remove nut that secures
battery positive cable wire harness connector eyelet
to solenoid battery terminal stud. Do not let starter motor hang from wire harness.
7. Remove battery positive cable wire harness connector eyelet from solenoid battery terminal stud.
8. Disconnect battery positive cable wire harness connector from solenoid terminal connector receptacle.
9. Remove starter motor.





This is from the service manual. Couldn't copy the pics. You can buy the service manual in pdf format on E-bay for about $5. So worth it. Tells you how to diagnose and replace every part on the truck.
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Unread 11-23-2010, 07:28 AM   #18
brentwoodkris
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Location: CoMo
Posts: 73
Well turns out there was a hard frost last night. Click no start x 10. Got it on try #11. I replaced the battery myself last week with a Enermaxx beast so it's not that. Busted out the tester just in case, but everything checks out. I'm going to install a block heater anyways, and maybe the extra warmth on the block will fix this issue. I really don't think it's the starter because when it is warm, it turns over flawlessly. Crappy Mopar wiring is my guess. Most likely a faulty relay (the one you hear click when you turn the key) although I've checked it a dozen times and it's good. I've seen posts about people hitting the relay in the electrics box and having success, almost like it was frozen.
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Unread 12-08-2012, 03:16 PM   #19
contractorguy
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Help! I need a "how-to" to remove/replace the starter motor in my 2005 5.7L Hemi WK. I've been scouring the web. Budasac's steps for a 5.7L do not match my Jeep at all.

The 2005 5.7L WK has a horizontal cross member supporting the transmission (not the "two bolt bracket"), that also secures the front suspension at both ends, which is in the way. Also, the drive shaft is directly underneath the starter. Further blocking access is the exhaust pipe that crosses directly under. I've replaced starters, but have never seen one so inaccessible!

Can it be that NO ONE on the web has removed a starter from a 2005 5.7L WK?

My WK began intermittently not starting - just a click, or series to clicks, and occasionally some weak cranking. The Jeep starts with jumper cables or a helper battery. The battery (two years old) puts out 12.7 volts, and hydrometer shows a specific gravity of over 1.300 in all cells at 60 degrees, indicating a very healthy charge. Terminal connections are clean of corrosion and tight. Further, the headlights come on full with the key, and do not dim while cranking. OBD II reader displays no error codes. At this point, I do not suspect the battery. I swapped the starter relay with the A/C relay (identical). No help. It's a California Jeep, never driven in salt or snow, and always garaged with 110K miles. Still, I looked at the battery harness pigtails that attache to the starter motor solenoid, which are clean, and corrosion free (from what I could see). I banged on the starter with a 2 pound hammer - no effect. Pushed the yellow wire terminal to more fully seat the connector at the solenoid (used a long steel bar). No help. I suspect a bad starter motor.

What is the procedure for removing this thing?!
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Unread 12-09-2012, 12:03 AM   #20
contractorguy
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Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 6
Nothing?

I couldn't wait. Here's how I removed the starter:

On hand:
1/2" air impact wrench
3/8" air wrench
13mm, 14mm and 15mm wrenches and sockets
1/2" and 3/8" socket wrenches and breaker bar
large assortment of socket extensions
Ramps, floor jack, jack stand
LED headlamp, trouble light
Fish hook removal pliers
Gin


1. Drove up on ramps. This is going to be a breeze. I've replaced lots of starter motors.
2. Put cardboard under the car, as my creeper wouldn't provide enough working clearance.
3. Removed the skid plate. Hmm. Where's the starter? Easter egg hunt begins.
4. Noticed that I can't even get my hand through between the cross member, exhaust and front drive shaft to get near the starter.
5. Snaked a hammer through this maze, and banged on the starter. Tried starting - no help (slow turning engine, then clicks).
6. Can see the yellow wire attached to a terminal - snaked a 20" metal bar through, and pushed on it (as if corrosion may be the problem). Attempted starting again; no help.
7. Used a creative combination of ratchet extensions to reach the forward axle flange bolts. Removed all four. My Craftsman 1/2" air impact wrench couldn't do it (its 30 years old). Used a breaker bar. The bolts are in with blue lock tight, and fought me the whole way out.
8. Pulled the axle back, and pushed it aside - only gives a couple of more inches clearance, but its enough. Considered removing the other end.
9. Removed the two starter motor bolts with a Frankenstein combination of ratchet wrench extensions. Removed the neg battery terminal.
10. The starter motor comes off, but is trapped in its location. I removed the two 10mm bolts holding the heat shield to it.
11. Unable to access the hot cable or yellow terminal wire attached to the solenoid. Considered removing the exhaust. Loosened exhaust bolts.
12. Injured thumb. Went inside in disgust. Had some drinks. Surfed again for anyone else in my situation.
13. Found something about needing to remove the drivers side wheel and inner fender well.
14. Without removing ramps, jacked up the front left suspension to raise the tire off the ramp. Added a jack stand for safety.
15. Removed the wheel.
16. Removed three plastic rivets, which attached the plastic inner fender to sheet metal. Destroyed them in the process. (found replacements later at Harbor Freight).
17. Folded the inner fender well out of the way, exposing a portal into the engine bay about as big as a possum. Only one had fits through at a time.
18. Cannot remove the electrical connections from the starter, as its flopping around. Oh, and its ok to let it hang by the wires. They are plenty strong.
19. After a long time, going between the possum hole, and under the Jeep, I finally bolted the starter BACK to the engine for some leverage.
20. With the starter finally in a fixed position, returned to the possum hole, and yanked the hot cable until a nearby plastic cable tie broke off, giving me some slack (not much).
21. Poked a pair of really long fish hook removing pliers into the possum hole, and disconnected the yellow wire terminal from the starter solenoid.
22. Bent the red cable enough to put a few different wrenches on the nut holding it to the solenoid. Started with a deep ended wrench, then socket wrench. Its tight.
23. Both wires off, unbolted the starter again from the engine. Snaked it out of the Jeep, past the (now freed) driveshaft. Swore a few times in victory. Paraded the starter motor past wife (who responded with quizzical looks). Did I mention its the wife's car? I made that Jeep my bi*ch.
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Unread 12-09-2012, 07:34 AM   #21
blizzboy283
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Location: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,327
Quote:
Originally Posted by contractorguy
Nothing?

I couldn't wait. Here's how I removed the starter:

On hand:
1/2" air impact wrench
3/8" air wrench
13mm, 14mm and 15mm wrenches and sockets
1/2" and 3/8" socket wrenches and breaker bar
large assortment of socket extensions
Ramps, floor jack, jack stand
LED headlamp, trouble light
Fish hook removal pliers
Gin

1. Drove up on ramps. This is going to be a breeze. I've replaced lots of starter motors.
2. Put cardboard under the car, as my creeper wouldn't provide enough working clearance.
3. Removed the skid plate. Hmm. Where's the starter? Easter egg hunt begins.
4. Noticed that I can't even get my hand through between the cross member, exhaust and front drive shaft to get near the starter.
5. Snaked a hammer through this maze, and banged on the starter. Tried starting - no help (slow turning engine, then clicks).
6. Can see the yellow wire attached to a terminal - snaked a 20" metal bar through, and pushed on it (as if corrosion may be the problem). Attempted starting again; no help.
7. Used a creative combination of ratchet extensions to reach the forward axle flange bolts. Removed all four. My Craftsman 1/2" air impact wrench couldn't do it (its 30 years old). Used a breaker bar. The bolts are in with blue lock tight, and fought me the whole way out.
8. Pulled the axle back, and pushed it aside - only gives a couple of more inches clearance, but its enough. Considered removing the other end.
9. Removed the two starter motor bolts with a Frankenstein combination of ratchet wrench extensions. Removed the neg battery terminal.
10. The starter motor comes off, but is trapped in its location. I removed the two 10mm bolts holding the heat shield to it.
11. Unable to access the hot cable or yellow terminal wire attached to the solenoid. Considered removing the exhaust. Loosened exhaust bolts.
12. Injured thumb. Went inside in disgust. Had some drinks. Surfed again for anyone else in my situation.
13. Found something about needing to remove the drivers side wheel and inner fender well.
14. Without removing ramps, jacked up the front left suspension to raise the tire off the ramp. Added a jack stand for safety.
15. Removed the wheel.
16. Removed three plastic rivets, which attached the plastic inner fender to sheet metal. Destroyed them in the process. (found replacements later at Harbor Freight).
17. Folded the inner fender well out of the way, exposing a portal into the engine bay about as big as a possum. Only one had fits through at a time.
18. Cannot remove the electrical connections from the starter, as its flopping around. Oh, and its ok to let it hang by the wires. They are plenty strong.
19. After a long time, going between the possum hole, and under the Jeep, I finally bolted the starter BACK to the engine for some leverage.
20. With the starter finally in a fixed position, returned to the possum hole, and yanked the hot cable until a nearby plastic cable tie broke off, giving me some slack (not much).
21. Poked a pair of really long fish hook removing pliers into the possum hole, and disconnected the yellow wire terminal from the starter solenoid.
22. Bent the red cable enough to put a few different wrenches on the nut holding it to the solenoid. Started with a deep ended wrench, then socket wrench. Its tight.
23. Both wires off, unbolted the starter again from the engine. Snaked it out of the Jeep, past the (now freed) driveshaft. Swore a few times in victory. Paraded the starter motor past wife (who responded with quizzical looks). Did I mention its the wife's car? I made that Jeep my bi*ch.
That's some fine ingenuity there!

Great write up, especially the parade part.
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Unread 12-09-2012, 10:36 AM   #22
modette
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Location: Monument, CO
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Yep, I could not get my starter out on the Hemi, but it turned out it was a corroded and lose terminal wire...since I have had NO issues. If I got to replace the starter I'm dropping the cross members and pulling the shaft out to have access, I tried rotating it and what have you like they talk about int he service manual and I tried from the wheel well and no luck at all. But glad it was just the connection...oh and when I do replace the starter one day I'm buying the starter blanket to help protect it from the heat.
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Unread 12-11-2012, 04:55 AM   #23
contractorguy
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Update on my starter-removal-from-hell...

Modette, there was no corrosion at all on my terminals, and all connections were tight. I also considered dropping the cross member, but it ties in with the front suspension, and might get complicated.

O'Reilly's had one a starter for a reasonable $105. Got it in using a reverse sequence, as posted above. Loosely installed the two starter motor bolts - just enough so I could bolt on the cable from the battery through the "possum hole" in the wheel well. Reaching one hand at a time, I used a 1/4" drive 13mm socket wrench to snug it, then a deep offset 13mm 12 point wrench to tighten the nut holding the cable lug to the solenoid... and then the stud sheared off! DOH!

Ok, pulled the starter AGAIN. The stud is made of copper - not steel. REALLY? To attach a heavy battery cable with a large steel lug? Its reman'ed in China - "Ultima" brand. I can't recommend it. Returned it to O'Reilly's and got my core back. Yep, the original has a steel stud.

I called INTEX Auto Parts in San Jose (usually the best price), and was quoted $270 for a reman starter. REALLY? Sorry, guys, I have to keep calling around. (The O'Reilly clerk said a starter from the dealer might run $500).

Next stop was A&M Auto Parts - an old time place with some cool old guys that have been there forever. Should have gone there first. They tested my starter while I watched. At first, it didn't spin, then did slowly. Repeat attempts got a full spin out of it. The old guy said it was "dragging", and may have a bad spot on the stator. If it stops there after a start, it won't start again, and that banging it with a hammer might move it enough to start again (I actually HAD tried banging it with a hammer - no luck).

They can have one overnight for $189. Fine. I went home and took apart the core. The stator that contacts the brushes is dark and worn, and there's only a hint that grease was ever in it. The stator does not spin freely - takes some effort. Besides that, I don't see an obvious fault.

Hoping I have a positive recap to post tomorrow.

Last edited by contractorguy; 12-11-2012 at 09:22 AM..
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Unread 12-11-2012, 09:59 AM   #24
modette
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^ From my Jeep Dealers website: $107.10 with $50 core Charge
http://www.perkinsmotors.com/order-parts.html
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Unread 12-11-2012, 10:10 AM   #25
modette
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Or do a rebuild kit yourself: http://www.starteralternatorrebuildk...rokee-4-0-5-7/

I just contacted them out of curiosity to see how much, I'll let you know what they say for a 5.7L.
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Unread 12-11-2012, 08:37 PM   #26
modette
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Well not impressed with the guys email:

"Sorry, no kit for that" but yet he list a KIT NUMBER...LOL Guess he likes short emails.
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Unread 12-11-2012, 11:31 PM   #27
contractorguy
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Success! ...But there was something else wrong, too! (and Modette, thanks for the info!)

Here's the recap and Lessons Learned...

I neglected to mention earlier that to remove the starter, you also must pull the oxygen sensor with a 22mm wrench.

A&M Motor Supply had a different brand of starter motor this morning, but it also had a copper stud for attaching the battery cable (are they all like this now?) I passed on it, afraid I'd shear the stud off like the previous starter with a copper stud, and instead decided to open up mine and see if I could find out what's really wrong. I watched a few youtube videos. So, that makes me an expert now, right?

No burnt wires inside, missing commutator segments, and the four brushes looked long enough to use. So far, so good.

Now for the bad: thick black dust (from the brushes?) covered everything. Whatever original grease was present had hardened into waxy crud. The commutator contacts were black (should be shiny copper), and black crud filled the gaps between the commutator segments.

I shot everything with a can of electrical contact cleaner, scrubbed it with a toothbrush, and dried with compressed air.

Each of the four brushes had burrs on one side, I guess in the direction that the commutator spun. I used a tiny file to remove those.

I cleaned the gunk from between the commutator segments with a piece of hacksaw blade. It was a perfect fit.

An emery board restored the blackened commutator segments to shiny copper color.

I applied some dialectic grease to the gears and other moving parts (from O'Reilly's - comes in a small dispenser can for around 8 bucks) . If any of it migrates to any electrical parts inside, it won't short it out - I hope. I used it sparingly.

Putting it back together requires some way to keep the brushes compressed while putting this assembly (part of the end cap) over the commutator. I used zip ties, then cut them off just before closing it up (it will be obvious when you get to that point).

Cleaned and lubed, the starter and solenoid functioned perfectly when connected to a battery on my work bench - encouraging!

About this time, I called Normandin Jeep, San Jose, and discovered they have a starter in stock for $168 (a new design heat shield is required for $40 more). DOH! I'd have bought one.

Convinced I had restored my starter, I installed it in reverse order: Loosely bolt the starter with the two 15mm bolts, then move to the "possum hole" in the wheel well to connect the wires. Back under the Jeep to attach the heat shield with two 10mm bolts. Tighten the two starter bolts. Reinstall the oxygen sensor. Use new Lock Tight Blue on the four 15mm drive shaft bolts.

Now, go back to the wheel well and re-attach the solenoid wire lug! Somehow, I managed to push it off while re-installing the heat shield.

Reattach plastic inner fenderwell with three new plastic rivets. Mount wheel. Reconnect the battery. Turn the key: Click click click....

Ok, this was VERY disappointing. The starter worked on my bench minutes earlier. I went back to the battery with a volt meter - 12.0 (not 12.7 a day ago). Hmm. I attached a jump start battery to it, and turned the key - the engine turned a bit, then back to clicking. The battery is now suspect again.

When this first happened, I tested the battery with a volt meter and hydrometer, and both looked good (see earlier post). This time, I pulled the battery and took it to Wal Mart, where it came from - it was still within the three year warranty period. After an hour of waiting in lines, they put it on a tester that seemed to put a load on it. A print out showed the rated cold cranking amps as 765, and the tested CCA as 330 - along with "REPLACE BATTERY". I got a replacement battery. Had to pay an additional $45 because they no longer stocked mine. Whatever.

Back in the Jeep, and it starts fine. Drove it off the ramps, attached the skid plate, and I'm done. So, was a starter refurbish really needed? I saw it "drag" when tested at A&M Motor Supply, so I think it had issues. Clearly, the battery was bad, even though a hydrometer showed it with a full charge. I guess the capacity had been reduced so that under load it would not produce the rated amps, regardless of how well the chemistry looked.

I hope this helps some one in the future.
starter_5.jpg   starter_3.jpg   starter_2.jpg   starter_4.jpg   starter_6.jpg  

starter_1.jpg  
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Unread 12-12-2012, 08:57 AM   #28
modette
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Well I emailed the guy...this is what he had to say and my email to him...

Dear Mark,
Excellent advise. We are currently working on exactly that.
As a matter of fact, the Mitsibishi starter will be our very next release.
We are going to start shooting any day now. The alternator is a little more complicated though.
Just curious ...which jeep forum are you in ?
Mike

From: Mark - Gmail <modette@gmail.com>
To: MICHAEL W LAUER <m.lauer@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Tue, December 11, 2012 10:41:10 PM
Subject: Re: [your-subject]

On 12/11/2012 8:19 PM, MICHAEL W LAUER wrote:
> Sorry, no kit for that

You might want to look into getting a kit for the 5.7L Hemi's or the Hemi's in general as its a common issue with these motors for the starter to go out.

Plus, I'm sure people at the Jeep forum would flock to buy one.

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f67/

Just out of curiosity why do you show a KIT for this engine on your site?
kit number: 11155

Thank you,
Mark Odette
RMAR Director of Marketing & Promotions
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Unread 12-12-2012, 09:06 AM   #29
modette
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Monument, CO
Posts: 433
contractorguy - Thanks for the pictures.

So your saying you did need a new battery!!! Yeah I don't trust the load testing they do at like Autozone...they claimed a battery was good when it was bad, same happened to a friend of mine. Maybe just me but easy enough to change a battery out and not all that expensive when it comes to automotive things.
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Unread 03-10-2013, 08:58 PM   #30
andybwell
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: sierra madre, california
Posts: 5
2005 hemi jeep will not start

After over a year, and the dealership unable to duplicate click non start click problem, I purchased a battery charger that displayed the battery % of charge capacity ( http://www.walmart.com/ip/Schumacher...Start/13005738) for about $100. When my jeep only clicked instead of starting, the :battery charge was less than 85%. After charging to 100%, my jeep starts every time!
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