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Unread 08-22-2011, 11:40 AM   #1
73pumpkin
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73 Wagoneer stock what can you tell me?

I just bought a 73 Wagoneer with a 360 in it. Is this an AMC 360? I need to lift it to haul a trailor and a SOA on the front and a shackle flip seem to be the quickest best solution. BJs has a new complete spring replacement kit for more money but perhaps less trouble. Has anyone used this kit yet? Does it come with the proper drivetrain and steering modification parts? Can you still get their old front end SOA kit? By the way, what drivetrain, transfer case front/rear axle components were stock on a 73? Where is identification stamped or labeled about these components?

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Unread 08-22-2011, 08:01 PM   #2
Dr. Marneaus
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Yes, the 360 is an AMC 360 (what else would it be?).

In 73 you have a dana 30 closed knuckle front end. Not terrible but nothing spectacular. Bigger turning radius than the open knuckle D44's that were offered in 74.

Your transmission is a GM TurboHydramatic400 (TH400). 3 speed. Good strong tranny, easy to rebuild, parts everywhere for em, just not very efficient (3 speed). it may or may not be a nailhead pattern. Get under the truck and check if it has an adapter (spacer) between the engine and bellhousing. 74 was the first full year of using a TH400 with an actual AMC bolt pattern, previous ones used a spacer ring and an adapter on the crank to move the flexplate back.

Your t-case would be a Dana20 if it's part time. Again, great case, plenty strong enough. Most people's complaint is that the low range isnt very "low" and that could use improvement. They are easy enough to twinstick if you so wish.

Rear end would be a D44, standard.

If you have a tow package you have 3.31 gears, if not, you probably have 2.somethings.

you have drums all around. have fun going bigger than 33s without discs or hydroboost. Its scary sometimes on my 33's with stock brakes.

The BJs spring kits are good. I'm running a 4" kit on mine and like it. Not sure about their SOA kits.

SOA requires a lot of work...shackle flip, hi-steer, brake lines, etc etc. A lot more work than people think.

I love my 73, but there are some weird things. 73 was almost a cusp year, lots of changes afterwards (d44 front, discs up front, changed to bridged rockers, blah blah blah).

if you want more info that is readily avaiable, and with way more people into FSJ's, join up on www.ifsja.org.
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The Beast Build Thread: Marns '73 Wagoneer Thread ----- The Camper Build Thread: Marns 1980 Jayco JayFinch6 Build Thread

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Unread 08-23-2011, 09:42 AM   #3
73pumpkin
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Thanks so much for the loads of information, Andrew. I had seen mention of a lot of older wagoneers with Buick motors in them, that is why I was not certain that it might be an AMC. I am not all that familiar with Jeep other than the fact that they used a lot of parts from other manufacturers over the years. When you put the BJ lift kit on, do you have to change the pitman arm or other steering components? Also, do you have to shim the front and/or rear pumpkins to relieve strain on the universal joints? Are any of these parts provided with the kit or do you buy them seperately?
I bought this jeep for $800 and it runs well and the body is straight. The interior is pretty good. Heck it was worth the tires on it probably. Someone has disconnected the heater assembly and I need to look at that first. Winter is just around the corner and I'll need defrost. Could you possibly send pictures of the engine compartment of your 73? It looks to me like they relocated the alternator and I don't understand a defunct cooling fluid pump located top right as you are looking at the front of the engine. Also, if you take pictures, could I have a picture of your hitch? I expect if commercial hitches ever existed, the after market companies have long ago discontinued them. I'll have to have one fabricated.
I want to tow a 19 foot trailor with this thing and I do not think it was a towing package. the trailor has electric brakes so that will help. What is a hydroboost and how much trouble is that to add? Do you know if they make disc adaptor kits or do most people just swap out the axles? I kind of like the beast the way it is now, even its current curb height, but the towing issue probably will demand some changes.
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Unread 08-23-2011, 10:53 PM   #4
Dr. Marneaus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 73pumpkin View Post
Thanks so much for the loads of information, Andrew. I had seen mention of a lot of older wagoneers with Buick motors in them, that is why I was not certain that it might be an AMC. I am not all that familiar with Jeep other than the fact that they used a lot of parts from other manufacturers over the years. When you put the BJ lift kit on, do you have to change the pitman arm or other steering components? Also, do you have to shim the front and/or rear pumpkins to relieve strain on the universal joints? Are any of these parts provided with the kit or do you buy them seperately?
I bought this jeep for $800 and it runs well and the body is straight. The interior is pretty good. Heck it was worth the tires on it probably. Someone has disconnected the heater assembly and I need to look at that first. Winter is just around the corner and I'll need defrost. Could you possibly send pictures of the engine compartment of your 73? It looks to me like they relocated the alternator and I don't understand a defunct cooling fluid pump located top right as you are looking at the front of the engine. Also, if you take pictures, could I have a picture of your hitch? I expect if commercial hitches ever existed, the after market companies have long ago discontinued them. I'll have to have one fabricated.
I want to tow a 19 foot trailor with this thing and I do not think it was a towing package. the trailor has electric brakes so that will help. What is a hydroboost and how much trouble is that to add? Do you know if they make disc adaptor kits or do most people just swap out the axles? I kind of like the beast the way it is now, even its current curb height, but the towing issue probably will demand some changes.

The buick motors are buick 350's, and tend to be the older wags, as you have noticed.

I didnt install my lift, it was installed by the previous owner within 9 months of be buying it. The front has no shims, the rear does have shims to correct the pinion angle. I dont think the 4" kit required a drop pitman arm, mine looks stock. All the other steering looks stock. I would shoot them an email over on BJ's or give them a call about whats included they are very helpful, but pretty sure it's a full kit.


Here are some pics of my engine compartment:





(radiator out)


Accessories coming off:





new engine going in






Sorry, just tried to give you as many complete angles and shots as possible, haha. That's how the compartment on my 73 is set up, the only thing that changed with the engine swap was the ignition system for the new motor is electronic (from an 87) and not a points system as was original in 73.

I'll try to remember to snap some pictures of my hitch next time i'm out there.
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The Beast Build Thread: Marns '73 Wagoneer Thread ----- The Camper Build Thread: Marns 1980 Jayco JayFinch6 Build Thread

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Unread 08-24-2011, 11:58 AM   #5
73pumpkin
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Those are great pictures Andrew. I've been following your extensive thread about the rebuilding of your 73. It is pretty long so I have been doing 10 or 20 pages a day. Some of my questions may be answered as I read it. Why did you swap out your engine? That looks like a tranny fluid cooler or an AC coil behind the radiator with the new engine. Is it? My first problem will be getting the heating back together. It looks like one hose comes off ofthe water pmp to the heater coil and the other comes off of the rear of the block. I still have this mystery pump hanging down under the power steering pump. It is not an Ac compresser. Any ideas what it used to do? I have a similair thing in my old Dodge van that used to run a rear heater but I don't find any evidence of that. I may put some air bag helper springs on the rear for towing. Anyway, thanks for all of your help. I may upgrade my membership here to send pictures of the pumpkin. (It is a burnt orange color.)
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Unread 08-24-2011, 02:29 PM   #6
Dr. Marneaus
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Yeah, It goes (from rear to front) Radiator, AC condensor, Transmission cooler (it's a b&m plate style).

I replaced the engine because I was getting alot of noise from the old one, knocking, tapping, sounded like both top and bottom noise, so I just pulled it. The original motor (orange one) will get rebuilt and put back in eventually. This motor is more of a temporary setup.

Perhaps the pump you have is a smog pump, for air injection. You can see the big bolts on the outside of my exhaust manifolds. Even in 1973 they has emissions crap on these trucks, and the manifolds are setup for air injection. The smog pump pushed fresh air into the exhaust, in order to get the cat to burn hotter.

That is most likely what you're seeing under the PS pump, I believe it was on the driver side of the engine. I dont have one, it (as well as all other emissions crap) has long since been removed, which is now causing issues for me passing emissions.

PS, you'll be able to post pictures once you have 20 or 30 posts and 30 days of membership or something like that.
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Unread 08-26-2011, 07:36 PM   #7
73pumpkin
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looked at another Jeep today

I looked at another Jeep today that was similar to mine. It was a 78 4 door Cherokee with a 401 in it for $1500. I got the chance to look over the engine compartment to see where some of the missing goodies go. I think this one was a quadratrack. It was a little rough but not too bad. If I hadn't bought the one I have, I would have dealt with the man on it. mine is a bit better shape I think. It seems to me people were saying that the 401s are hard to come by. i know of two of them now. i know of another 77 Wagoneer for $500 with a running 401 and Quadrotrack. It is a little rougher yet, but still easily restorable or beefing up for a real enthusiast. If my mystery pump is a smog pump, and i think that it is, where did it hook on the exhaist system? I do not see a place for it on the manifolds. I only see one outlet nipple on it and no intake other than some fins behind the pulley. is there a connection beyond the cross over pipe? I am still reading through your gargantuin thread, Andrew. it is a great read.
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Unread 08-26-2011, 09:15 PM   #8
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thread hijacker here: dr marneaus- what walmart battery are you running?
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Unread 08-29-2011, 12:58 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 73pumpkin View Post
I looked at another Jeep today that was similar to mine. It was a 78 4 door Cherokee with a 401 in it for $1500. I got the chance to look over the engine compartment to see where some of the missing goodies go. I think this one was a quadratrack. It was a little rough but not too bad. If I hadn't bought the one I have, I would have dealt with the man on it. mine is a bit better shape I think. It seems to me people were saying that the 401s are hard to come by. i know of two of them now. i know of another 77 Wagoneer for $500 with a running 401 and Quadrotrack. It is a little rougher yet, but still easily restorable or beefing up for a real enthusiast. If my mystery pump is a smog pump, and i think that it is, where did it hook on the exhaist system? I do not see a place for it on the manifolds. I only see one outlet nipple on it and no intake other than some fins behind the pulley. is there a connection beyond the cross over pipe? I am still reading through your gargantuin thread, Andrew. it is a great read.
They connected to each exhaust port on the manifold, there should be fittings and banjo bolts, 4 per manifold. its possible yours were switched out.

I dont know a ton though, i never had any of that crap since I bought it, removed by previous owners, and i pass emissions testing without any of it, except for a cat.

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thread hijacker here: dr marneaus- what walmart battery are you running?
No idea, i accidently drained it 100% and bought a new duralast. it was way bigger than whatever the book called for.

I think it's 875 CCA's with a 120 min reserve capacity. I replaced the walmart one with a duralast that had the same exact specs.
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The Beast Build Thread: Marns '73 Wagoneer Thread ----- The Camper Build Thread: Marns 1980 Jayco JayFinch6 Build Thread

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Unread 08-29-2011, 07:29 PM   #10
73pumpkin
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So those are called banjo bolts huh? Can I get rid of them any other way than swapping out exhaust manifolds? My jeep never had Ac as far as I can tell. There is no secondary black plastic duct and vent box beneath my dash. Was that only for AC or did only heated models have it and the previous own has ripped it out and tossed it on me. I read your full Beast rebuild, Andrew. It was extremely helpful. What is the beast doing now?
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Unread 08-30-2011, 12:52 PM   #11
Dr. Marneaus
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So those are called banjo bolts huh? Can I get rid of them any other way than swapping out exhaust manifolds? My jeep never had Ac as far as I can tell. There is no secondary black plastic duct and vent box beneath my dash. Was that only for AC or did only heated models have it and the previous own has ripped it out and tossed it on me. I read your full Beast rebuild, Andrew. It was extremely helpful. What is the beast doing now?
Yeah, banjo bolts. They are essentially just hollow bolts that allow air to flow through. All you need to do to remove the air tube system is....put regular bolts in the holes.

Mine still have all the spacers from the banjo bolts on them, something about that threadsize only coming in the wrong length or something, but you can just remove the banjo bolts and install regular bolts from the hardware store to seal the holes up.

The under dash unit is only for AC, its 100% separate from the rest of the heating/ventilation system. The controls on the gauge cluster are only for heat/defrost/vent, the unit under the dash has its own fan control and temp control, so you arent missing anything. I wish mine worked, haha.

It's not doing much now other than driving well, i'm working on installing some relays to remove the load from the headlight switch, and then hopfully driving it 500+ miles this weekend on a camping trip, scary.
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Unread 08-31-2011, 09:03 PM   #12
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I imagine that I will have to go through the ducting just as you did on your Beast. I think that this was a base model plain Jane machine when purchased new. Good luck on your trip.
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Unread 08-31-2011, 09:56 PM   #13
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I imagine that I will have to go through the ducting just as you did on your Beast. I think that this was a base model plain Jane machine when purchased new. Good luck on your trip.
Thanks.

You should start up a build thread, just to keep track of what you are doing. I dont see alot of 73's here on jeepforum, or on IFSJA.org, in fact any 63-73 rigs are fairly rare.

Start a thread and show some pictures, I'd love to see it.
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Unread 09-01-2011, 08:22 PM   #14
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I will probably get around to upgrading my membership here and posting some pictures tomorrow. Money is way tight right now, so I probably won't be spending a lot on it right away. I think that it has lived all of its life in Wyoming or other dry states because i have found very little rust. I have been window shopping parts on line and talking to mechanics about topend or total rebuilds. Winter is coming on and I probably need to look at the heater/defrost first.
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Unread 09-01-2011, 10:55 PM   #15
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I will probably get around to upgrading my membership here and posting some pictures tomorrow. Money is way tight right now, so I probably won't be spending a lot on it right away. I think that it has lived all of its life in Wyoming or other dry states because i have found very little rust. I have been window shopping parts on line and talking to mechanics about topend or total rebuilds. Winter is coming on and I probably need to look at the heater/defrost first.
FYI, you can post pictures once you have 30 (i think) posts in the technical forums (general discussion doesn't add to your post count).

I still suggest upgrading if you have the cash, but even if you dont you can post pics eventually by just being a supporting memeber.

The way I look at it is that this website has saved me more than $30.00 in parts or labor, so why not donate it?

Regardless, I'd love to see your waggy. You can even post links to it on photobucket.com or similar, and a supporting member can quote you and show the pictures in the thread.

As for rebuilds, from what I have seen, for a full rebuild you'd be looing at around 2500 bucks minimum if you drop it off and pick it up running.

For a rebuild where you pull the block, strip it down, and do SOME assembly, you'll be around 1500-2000. I have my original 1973 block (painted california emissions orange) sitting on a stand in my garage waiting for me to have the funds to rebuild it and get it dropped back into the truck to replace the 1987 motor i installed as a hold over.

As I have said, feel free to ask about anything in specific about your 73, and if I can help I will. I am equally as active on ifsja.org (international full size jeep association) if you want to find me over there.

Sorry I havent grabbed pics of the hitch setup yet!
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The Beast Build Thread: Marns '73 Wagoneer Thread ----- The Camper Build Thread: Marns 1980 Jayco JayFinch6 Build Thread

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