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Unread 06-16-2013, 11:36 AM   #361
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I am going to put my 2 cents into this discussion. My brother used to own a welding shop for about 20 years and I was able to use his big Miller 240 volt MIG welders. Then a few years back he sold his shop and went into teaching. So I was without access to a welder for awhile until my son wanted one to work on his junk with and purchased a Hobart 140. I for the life of me could not weld decent with that thing. Last week I used a friends Miller 252 and it welded like a dream. So I came home and not being able to find a good used one ordered a new M252 for a little over $2000. It arrives tomorrow and I am like a kid on Xmas eve. Now I know this welder is out of the budget of most but I figure it is something I could sell for what I paid for it, hand it down to my son or even his kids. Not to mention the ease of use and the quality of welds, I really feel that it is worth every penny. Just something to keep in mind. Good luck, Dave

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Unread 06-16-2013, 01:08 PM   #362
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Sweet! way more than entry level but certainly a good welder that will last a long time even in a everyday use situation. Can't go wrong with Miller.

We use Miller pretty much through out our shop. A buddy of mine has a lincoln 110v unit that I borrow from time to time to tack stuff.

Here is a pic of my favorite welder. It is a multi-process Dimension 652 with a D-74Dx dual head feeder. In the pic it is set-up with two sizes of 70s6 wire, 1/6" and .035" . It has independant flow meters to custom tune and will do mig, tig, stick and (my favorite) carbon arc gouging. It is 3ph only so I gotta be close to big power. It draws almost 100amps on 240v. We can do fluxcore too with it. One side has a 500amp gun and the other has a 400amp gun, both Twecos:



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Unread 06-17-2013, 02:57 PM   #363
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Quick Question: My local community college has a beginners welding class called "Combination Welding". It is a prerequisite for all other welding courses. I don't know what combination welding is, exactly, compared to the other types.
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Unread 06-17-2013, 07:40 PM   #364
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Originally Posted by MadGerbil View Post
Quick Question: My local community college has a beginners welding class called "Combination Welding". It is a prerequisite for all other welding courses. I don't know what combination welding is, exactly, compared to the other types.
Probably a introductory course to mig/tig/stick and maybe even gas welding/cutting.
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Unread 06-23-2013, 09:15 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by Delox View Post
Im very much a newbie to the world of welding, but I would really like to get into it since it opens up alot of fabrication doors for me.


I have welded once or twice with a mig welder (wire), it was a hobart handler, ran on 120v

I would like to purchase something with a little more capability, since I hope to build up bumpers and basic bull bars, along with being able to fix up my exhaust.

I am looking into purchasing a lincoln 220v stick welder (since they seem very cheap and have a good reputation)

I do not, however, know how to stick weld, though I have been watching videos.

I am just confused on one thing really, I though you needed argon (or some other gas) being exhausted onto the weld pool, but from the looks of it, with a stick welder, you just put the stick into the stinger, and attach the other end to your work, and just go at it by making an arc. how can this be? How do you give it an arc sheild? Do you need an arc shield?


thanks

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Unread 07-05-2013, 11:16 AM   #366
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I am new to Jeeps. Always loved them, always wanted one. Recently I purchased a 1986 CJ-7 partially completed project and am planning to completely rebuild it. I also own and operate a Machine & Welding shop and have been welding for around 20 years. We work on everything from simple repairs and fab work to large projects like derrick masts for oil service equipment that need to be magna-fluxed and x-rayed.

I'd like to throw my 2 cents in and give you some pointers. With Mig (GMAW) welding cleanliness is everything. Most of the steel you will buy has mill scale on it and this can have an effect on the quality of the weld. Usually you will want to remove the mill scale and get to the bare metal you will get a cleaner weld with less spatter. You can remove this with a grinding wheel or in a lot of cases just use a wire wheel on your angle grinder.

A bit about technique
When welding steel with a mig you will always get your best welds in the flat position. Assuming you are welding two plates at 90 degrees to each other and you are doing a fillet weld you have two directions to position your gun while welding. Up and Down / Left & Right. In the up and down position you want to have your gun tip at a 45 degree angle to the material. There are sometimes when you would want to raise or lower the gun to change angle like if you are welding different thicknesses of metal and you want to concentrate the heat on the thicker piece.

The second , left/right , direction is usually controlled by rolling your wrist to rotate the mig gun and change the angle in the direction of travel. In general if you have the gun at 90 degrees to the plate in the plane of travel you will get the most penetration and strength of weld. Changing the angle can change the amount of penetration as well as the appearance of your weld.

Finally, you can push or pull the gun while welding. Most instructors will teach you to pull the gun from left to right while welding and angling the gun slightly in the direct ion you are travelling. This helps ensure you get adequate fill and the shielding gas stays concentrated around the weld pool. I my self like to push from right to left as I am right handed and can see better with this method. You will get generally get a flatter weld bead and have to be careful as now the shielding gas can sometimes become interrupted and you will get porosity in your weld.

Equipment
When purchasing a welder you will generally have lighter duty machines that run .023 welding wire and have lighter duty cycles, meaning that for every minute of continuous weld you have to let it cool for so many minutes. For a large majority of hobbyists and home users this never really becomes an issue as you are never welding straight for extended periods of time, you generally tack parts and then make a couple welds and then it cools while you move onto the next piece. These small welders do really well on light gauge materials, like body panels, mufflers, etc.. they can weld up to 1/4" thick material in a single pass in some situations.
Next we have higher amp rated machines and usually come equipped with a mig gun capable of running 0.035 & .045 welding wires ( usually you just switch out drive rollers and contact tips to switch between sizes.). 0.035 wire is the most common and will serve you for 99.9% of your projects. 0.045 and in some cases 0.065 is used when you are are not wanting to make multiple passes.

You also can run your welder using flux cored wire to avoid using a shielding gas although you will get a lot more spatter that you need to clean up later. For best results you would want to S-6 welding wire and a tri-mix welding gas. A tri-mix is more money than straight CO2 and usually blends oxygen, helium, co2 and sometimes argon. You will get cleaner welds, better wetting action, better tie in and the least amount of spatter.

In my shop we have a large Cannox 450 Amp 3 Phase welder. It is a power supply with stand alone wire feeder. We can run up to 0.065 wire with it but 99% of the time it is loaded with Lincoln Murex S-6 0.035 wire. We also have a Lincolm 350MP with a 25ft push-pull gun set up for welding aluminum. We have a Lincoln PowerMig 255 (Approx $2500.00 here in Canada) and a Lincoln PowerMig 216 (Around $1800). The 255 can adjusted in finer increments, has digital gauges, and is slightly higher amperage that the 216. We picked up the 216 at auction for $400 bucks so we had a spare welder around in the event one of ours goes down.

In the past I have used the Millermatic 252's and just did not like how they welded but that is my preference, they do make great equipment, I just prefer the lincoln stuff. Also I run all the same consumables in my guns so I do not have to stock different parts for each system.

Other Notes
I also read one of the posts that stated if you are butting pieces of metal up you want to bevel them at 45 degrees to weld. This is incorrect. You want to put a 30 degree bevel on the plate so when you but the two pieces together you get a 60 degree included angle for your weld. Also you do not bevel all the way to the bottom. in most cases you leave a 3/32" flat on the bottom of each piece and then gap the plates by 3/32" to get proper fill.

This was a long post and I tried my best to describe things as best I can. If anyone is interested I can post some diagrams if that will help.

Also feel free to ask questions. I will try my best to answer.
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Unread 07-06-2013, 09:18 AM   #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndkohlman View Post
I am new to Jeeps. Always loved them, always wanted one. Recently I purchased a 1986 CJ-7 partially completed project and am planning to completely rebuild it. I also own and operate a Machine & Welding shop and have been welding for around 20 years. We work on everything from simple repairs and fab work to large projects like derrick masts for oil service equipment that need to be magna-fluxed and x-rayed.

I'd like to throw my 2 cents in and give you some pointers. With Mig (GMAW) welding cleanliness is everything. Most of the steel you will buy has mill scale on it and this can have an effect on the quality of the weld. Usually you will want to remove the mill scale and get to the bare metal you will get a cleaner weld with less spatter. You can remove this with a grinding wheel or in a lot of cases just use a wire wheel on your angle grinder.
That pretty much pertains to any welding process,any oil,grease,mill scale,dirt,,etc can and will cause perosity and lack of fusion unseen

A bit about technique
When welding steel with a mig you will always get your best welds in the flat position. Assuming you are welding two plates at 90 degrees to each other and you are doing a fillet weld you have two directions to position your gun while welding. Up and Down / Left & Right. In the up and down position you want to have your gun tip at a 45 degree angle to the material. There are sometimes when you would want to raise or lower the gun to change angle like if you are welding different thicknesses of metal and you want to concentrate the heat on the thicker piece.

The second , left/right , direction is usually controlled by rolling your wrist to rotate the mig gun and change the angle in the direction of travel. In general if you have the gun at 90 degrees to the plate in the plane of travel you will get the most penetration and strength of weld. Changing the angle can change the amount of penetration as well as the appearance of your weld.

Finally, you can push or pull the gun while welding. Most instructors will teach you to pull the gun from left to right while welding and angling the gun slightly in the direct ion you are travelling. This helps ensure you get adequate fill and the shielding gas stays concentrated around the weld pool. I my self like to push from right to left as I am right handed and can see better with this method. You will get generally get a flatter weld bead and have to be careful as now the shielding gas can sometimes become interrupted and you will get porosity in your weld.

Equipment
When purchasing a welder you will generally have lighter duty machines that run .023 welding wire and have lighter duty cycles, meaning that for every minute of continuous weld you have to let it cool for so many minutes. For a large majority of hobbyists and home users this never really becomes an issue as you are never welding straight for extended periods of time, you generally tack parts and then make a couple welds and then it cools while you move onto the next piece. These small welders do really well on light gauge materials, like body panels, mufflers, etc.. they can weld up to 1/4" thick material in a single pass in some situations.
Next we have higher amp rated machines and usually come equipped with a mig gun capable of running 0.035 & .045 welding wires ( usually you just switch out drive rollers and contact tips to switch between sizes.). 0.035 wire is the most common and will serve you for 99.9% of your projects. 0.045 and in some cases 0.065 is used when you are are not wanting to make multiple passes.

You also can run your welder using flux cored wire to avoid using a shielding gas although you will get a lot more spatter that you need to clean up later. For best results you would want to S-6 welding wire and a tri-mix welding gas. A tri-mix is more money than straight CO2 and usually blends oxygen, helium, co2 and sometimes argon. You will get cleaner welds, better wetting action, better tie in and the least amount of spatter.
Tri-Mix is a heck of a lot more pricy then a common 75/25 for welding common mild steel these guys are working on,Tri-Mix is really an overkill for these situations.
If you are getting any spatter with fluxcore,you are just plain not running it right,it's a whole different animal and technique compared to hardwire..

In my shop we have a large Cannox 450 Amp 3 Phase welder. It is a power supply with stand alone wire feeder. We can run up to 0.065 wire with it but 99% of the time it is loaded with Lincoln Murex S-6 0.035 wire. We also have a Lincolm 350MP with a 25ft push-pull gun set up for welding aluminum. We have a Lincoln PowerMig 255 (Approx $2500.00 here in Canada) and a Lincoln PowerMig 216 (Around $1800). The 255 can adjusted in finer increments, has digital gauges, and is slightly higher amperage that the 216. We picked up the 216 at auction for $400 bucks so we had a spare welder around in the event one of ours goes down.

In the past I have used the Millermatic 252's and just did not like how they welded but that is my preference, they do make great equipment, I just prefer the lincoln stuff. Also I run all the same consumables in my guns so I do not have to stock different parts for each system.

Other Notes
I also read one of the posts that stated if you are butting pieces of metal up you want to bevel them at 45 degrees to weld. This is incorrect. You want to put a 30 degree bevel on the plate so when you but the two pieces together you get a 60 degree included angle for your weld. Also you do not bevel all the way to the bottom. in most cases you leave a 3/32" flat on the bottom of each piece and then gap the plates by 3/32" to get proper fill.
That would be in a test shop or strict coded work that is required by a stringent weld QC process sheet,the angle on it only depends on the thickness of the base metal being welded,i've had weld process sheets tell me me several different angles it had to be beveled,many at a 45...
The main purpose of a bevel is to ensure a total 100% penetration and fusion of the welded joint,as long as the bevel is wide enough to ensure no pockets and lack of fusion,it really doesn't matter what accurate bevel it is,you are just opening up the joint to be able to weld all the way through,you just need enough to penetrate and fuse all sides of the welded joint..


This was a long post and I tried my best to describe things as best I can. If anyone is interested I can post some diagrams if that will help.

Also feel free to ask questions. I will try my best to answer.
Thats all pretty good advice for someone going into heavy industrial welding/joining in a serious heavy duty fabrication shop or feild work...

These guys are learning to and use processes for much smaller scenarios on Jeeps and trailers........

As far as i see so many people saying there is no way around a lot of spatter when using fluxcore,its just a different animal and needs to be ran different,its harder to catch on than a GMAW(MIG) process,but,it also is a much stronger weld.

the high majority of these guys/girls will be using 220v portable machines in the range of 180-211 amp.. .023 ,.030 and .035 wire,running .045 wire on those machines will put a serious strain on the machine and make a short life span of it,even though they can run .045,it's not reccomended to use it regularly.

This is a pic of some .035 fluxcore i ran for an example a while back with my little Lincoln Pro-Mig 180 when i had several people saying its impossible to run fluxcore without a lot of spatter,you just have to run it correctly....
fluxcore1.jpg

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Unread 07-06-2013, 08:58 PM   #368
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My intention was not to recommend using 0.045 wire or buy what I have. The tools I have were acquired over a lot of years and are used in a business. My intention was to provide information.
Flux-core is fine it's better than not having a welder at all. It's just my opinion.
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Unread 07-08-2013, 11:02 AM   #369
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndkohlman View Post
My intention was not to recommend using 0.045 wire or buy what I have. The tools I have were acquired over a lot of years and are used in a business. My intention was to provide information.
Flux-core is fine it's better than not having a welder at all. It's just my opinion.
it was good advice..and i opologise for making it look like i was dis-respecting..which i had no intentions.

I just pointed out the facts that new commers may take that they may need to spend thousands to get started and have to use a protractor to get an exact bevel for a butt joint.

Some times i am just so forward and blunt speeking it seems on the forum i am being dis-repectful,but i am just the type of person that gets to the point quick...lol...
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Unread 08-06-2013, 02:55 PM   #370
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BTW What was the movie with "Multipass" in it?
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Unread 09-26-2013, 04:06 AM   #371
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Howdy all,

I apologize, but I have not been able to read through all 25 pages of this thread yet, and I am in a bit of a hurry to get a welder, and get practicing. I am planning a big trip at the end of October, and the local shops are not working out for me, so I have resigned to welding my projects myself.

I have welded one time in my life, about 20 years ago welding 3/4" thick steel plates into the bed of dump trucks for a girlfriends dad. I did a lot of welding over 10 trucks and 3 plates in each bed, all with a Lincoln stick welded. I do not recall the specific type.

Anyway, I have access to a crappy no name 120v ( there is no writing on it, so I have no idea on anything) flux core welder, but I do not trust it to anything. I am needing to weld brackets onto an axle. It is a Ford 8.8 that I have under the jeep, but would obviously remove and strip clean for new brackets. Other than that, I might build my own cage down the road, but probably not, and I might try my hand at a tire carrier and rock sliders.

I will never weld sheet metal, or anything non jeep except diy stuff; and rarely that.

Would a stick welded work for my needs?

Would a mig be better / worse?

Should I look for 220?

I know ac / dc is best for stick, but will 120 cut it? If not, I am okay with putting a 220 outlet in, just curious to save time & money.

I have a budget of $500-1000 tops, as I just cannot see spending a ton of cash for an item ill use a few times.

Thanks for any help, and I hope it does not sound like I am unwilling to read the thread, I did read a lot of it, but I did not read every post.
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Unread 11-05-2013, 05:29 PM   #372
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I think I read every post, over the last few days and we are on the electricians schedule to run the wires to my garage. We are already running other wires there so a dedicated welder circuit is pretty much just materials so the wife said I can. I asked for a 110v/20a circuit, with the plan of buying a small Mig because I don't see myself ever needing anything more then that. The electrician suggested a 220v/30a. I have about a week to make a decision. Any suggestions/recommendations are very welcome.

I do not know how to weld so I'll be learning. Probably the biggest thing I'll weld will be bumpers and sliders. I'd estimate 1/4" is as big as it'll get, which is why I'm leaning towards a 110v Mig.
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Unread 11-05-2013, 05:50 PM   #373
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I think I read every post, over the last few days and we are on the electricians schedule to run the wires to my garage. We are already running other wires there so a dedicated welder circuit is pretty much just materials so the wife said I can. I asked for a 110v/20a circuit, with the plan of buying a small Mig because I don't see myself ever needing anything more then that. The electrician suggested a 220v/30a. I have about a week to make a decision. Any suggestions/recommendations are very welcome.

I do not know how to weld so I'll be learning. Probably the biggest thing I'll weld will be bumpers and sliders. I'd estimate 1/4" is as big as it'll get, which is why I'm leaning towards a 110v Mig.
Your last paragraph answers your question. Spend a couple bucks more on the wiring and get the 30A 220 installed and some more bucks for a 180-210 Mig. I have a really nice working 140 amp 110 volt Lincoln and there is no way it can weld 1/4" stuff with confidence. Folks will say they can, but it just ain't worth the trouble. On a 110 volt unit you will run into massive duty cycle issues welding 1/4" stuff with flux core on high gear. Very aggravating and iffy welds. I use the 110 volt on gas mig for thin metal and smooth welds. Terrible duty cycle, but great welds. For heavy metal I use a Hobart AC/DC (heavy metal) unit which really is a work horse. I am thinking about selling both and getting a nice "Hobby" style 190 Hobart 220 volt mig unit.
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Unread 11-10-2013, 12:03 AM   #374
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Would someone be able to sum something up for me.
My dads company has an arc, mig and tig I have access to. I have limited experience with mig (inconsistent though), tried arc once and never even seen a tig. So with access to all of these which one would I use for what application? I would like to weld thick and thin steel, aluminium and stainless for strength, looks and seal (water). I dont know which I should learn first and what to use for what seeing as I have no preference for cost or skills.
Thanks.
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Unread 11-14-2013, 02:34 PM   #375
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Would someone be able to sum something up for me.
My dads company has an arc, mig and tig I have access to. I have limited experience with mig (inconsistent though), tried arc once and never even seen a tig. So with access to all of these which one would I use for what application? I would like to weld thick and thin steel, aluminium and stainless for strength, looks and seal (water). I dont know which I should learn first and what to use for what seeing as I have no preference for cost or skills.
Thanks.
If the equipment is free, I would try TIG. The old adage of needing to burn rods or wire to make you better is true, just as you weren't a good driver, you will need to practice.
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