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Unread 10-25-2007, 07:58 PM   #16
bdmonist
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No thickness in mind, just trying to fully understand the concept.

The rating is basically a single pass rating right? My thought process was that since you are really only welding say 1/4 inch or so thickness at a time, that once you get to a thickness that requires multi passes, then thickness really becomes a mute point, and you are really talking about number of passes instead of thickness. I have only used gas, no flux core yet. So if I can only go 3/16 or so with gas, then I should be able to do 3/8 as long as I make 2 passes, and 3/4 as long as I make 4 passes, etc.

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Unread 10-25-2007, 08:30 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdmonist
No thickness in mind, just trying to fully understand the concept.

The rating is basically a single pass rating right? My thought process was that since you are really only welding say 1/4 inch or so thickness at a time, that once you get to a thickness that requires multi passes, then thickness really becomes a mute point, and you are really talking about number of passes instead of thickness. I have only used gas, no flux core yet. So if I can only go 3/16 or so with gas, then I should be able to do 3/8 as long as I make 2 passes, and 3/4 as long as I make 4 passes, etc.

Your concept is correct but the number of passes is wrong. For the best welds durring multiple passes, you want to weld in a beveled area. Usually both sides cut at 45* angles so your first pass (root pass) bonds the metal then your next few passes cover and fill. If you were to weld 1/2 plate 3/16 at a time you would need 3 total layers but 6 beads. root pass, 1 bead then next layer run one bead on each side of root pass then top layer you would run 3 overlapping passes to finish it off. All while cooling ALOT in between.

And always clean out as said above after each pass.

As for the machine rating, to give an idea. My 1/2 structrual steel test was done at 174amps using flux core.
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Unread 10-25-2007, 08:38 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdmonist
No thickness in mind, just trying to fully understand the concept.

The rating is basically a single pass rating right? My thought process was that since you are really only welding say 1/4 inch or so thickness at a time, that once you get to a thickness that requires multi passes, then thickness really becomes a mute point, and you are really talking about number of passes instead of thickness. I have only used gas, no flux core yet. So if I can only go 3/16 or so with gas, then I should be able to do 3/8 as long as I make 2 passes, and 3/4 as long as I make 4 passes, etc.
look at this site.

http://content.lincolnelectric.com/p...ature/e734.pdf

They show single pass only up to 3/16" on your welder for shielded gas welding. They don't show multipass shielded gas weld specs. 1/4" single pass with flux core, and up to 1/2" multi pass if you go to .045 wire.

No it is not a math equation. Here's a mind picture. Say you have 2 pieces of 3/16" plate you want to butt weld. You would bevel or Vee the edges and weld them together. Now flip the plate over and looky see how deep the weld went. With that 175 it probably went all the way through. Now take 2 pieces of 3/4" plate and do the same. The gap at the top of the Vee/Bevel you had to grind out will be pretty wide. It will take a lot of welding to fill that Vee. So, if 3/16" = 1 pass that does not mean 3/8" = 2 passes. To butt weld 3/8" I'd say at least 3 passes will be needed to get full penetration.

BTW What was the movie with "Multipass" in it?
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Unread 10-25-2007, 08:48 PM   #19
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I understand the bevel and multi pass concept. Now, looking at the pdf, does the fact that it doesn't list multi pass for mig mean that I should not attempt that and always go flux core for multi pass requirements? or is using gas Ok as long as adequate passes are made?

Thanks for the help guys - If this has somewhat gone beyond the scope of this thread please let me know, but I guess this can help out when considering a welder as well.
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Unread 10-25-2007, 09:00 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdmonist
I understand the bevel and multi pass concept. Now, looking at the pdf, does the fact that it doesn't list multi pass for mig mean that I should not attempt that and always go flux core for multi pass requirements? or is using gas Ok as long as adequate passes are made?
Hopefully some expert with gas shield welding will chime in. I only have a 140 welder and it will only do 10 gauge gas shield. I never have tried multi pass with it. It does do multi pass with flux core very well.
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Unread 10-25-2007, 09:07 PM   #21
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You can do mulitpass with just gas but it does not have as good results as flux core.

That being said, I have done several practices with multi pass on 1/2 plate with MIG and passed bend tests. My main tests were Flux core only because that is what the steel co's want in this area.
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Unread 10-25-2007, 09:58 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigbob

BTW What was the movie with "Multipass" in it?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8745953206463004779&q=leeloo+dallas+multipass&total=2&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

btw, can anyone explain why its good to get an a/c d/c over just an a/c welder? like the actual benefits?
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Unread 10-25-2007, 10:33 PM   #23
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Also if someone has some good charts to the differences in stick electrodes that would be cool. And maybe discuss the applications.
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Unread 10-26-2007, 08:03 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delox
You win!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delox


btw, can anyone explain why its good to get an a/c d/c over just an a/c welder? like the actual benefits?
A wider selection of rod can be run with having both, or should I say, all three polarities. D/C has a better looking weld and can do fairly thin work as well. It is hard to weld A/C on real thin metal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scotch740
Also if someone has some good charts to the differences in stick electrodes that would be cool. And maybe discuss the applications.
Here is some info on welding rod; http://tinyurl.com/2cntgn

I have had great luck with the Fleedweld 180 and Jetweld 70. They have a 7018 A/C now which I don't think I have ever used. Sounds good though.
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Unread 10-26-2007, 10:54 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigbob
Here is some info on welding rod; http://tinyurl.com/2cntgn

I have had great luck with the Fleedweld 180 and Jetweld 70. They have a 7018 A/C now which I don't think I have ever used. Sounds good though.
Good table, kinda what I was looking for. I was more wondering what the numbers stood for. Are the first few after the E the tensile strength? My teacher said the first numbers are the tensile strength, ie E6011 has a tensile strength of 60KSI? What are the last 2 numbers for? I found a good chart over the summer but can't seam to locate it any more.
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Unread 10-26-2007, 11:18 AM   #26
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stick welder uses no gas...i just picked one up a couple weeks back. i like it a lot and it welds 1/8" metal on about 80 or 85 amps and goes up to 100 amps...which should weld 1/4" (with multiple passes) or 3/16", both of which are fine for bumpers. it will be fine for thinner stuff like sheetmetal thin. just make sure you turn the amperage down or it will burn holes through it

by the way, if you've never stick welded don't expect to pick it up on your first try...you will stick the electrode to the metal many times before you learn it. when it sticks this requires you to give a little jerk to get it unstuck from the metal (it welds itself to the metal).
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Unread 10-29-2007, 06:08 PM   #27
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An FYI for everyone looking for a welder - I looked and looked for a good deal on the Lincoln 175, I knew that was what I wanted. The cheapest I found it locally was about $560 at Lowes. I ended up buying one new in the box off ebay for about $440 to my front door - Just another option for those looking for some good deals.
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Unread 10-29-2007, 06:27 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdmonist
An FYI for everyone looking for a welder - I looked and looked for a good deal on the Lincoln 175, I knew that was what I wanted. The cheapest I found it locally was about $560 at Lowes. I ended up buying one new in the box off ebay for about $440 to my front door - Just another option for those looking for some good deals.
That is a good deal. You have a link to that seller/dealer or was this a one of a kind sale? Bob
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Unread 10-29-2007, 06:58 PM   #29
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It was Bruni03, but it was an auction, not a buy it now. I just checked, he doesn't have anything for sale. It may have been a one time thing for him.
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Unread 11-04-2007, 09:18 AM   #30
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Couple of questions for you all... I am looking to pick up a welder shortly. My plans include building skids, bumpers, maybe control arms and welding up suspension stuff later. Also I may build a new cage at some point when I decide for a full frame tied in cage...

If I am reading right will a regular stick be able to do most of this? And semi-easy to learn on?


I may also want to do sheet metal work on my heep and other vehicles too, so I can cut down the voltage and I should be fine for that as well?
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