New welder looking for some technical advice - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > General Technical Discussions > Fabrication Shop > New welder looking for some technical advice

New jk doors from steinjagerOconee Off-Road Free Shipping Lifts Tires Bumpers Tops andWarn, Smitybilt, Engo, Rugged Ridge Winches at CCOR

Reply
Unread 02-15-2014, 04:20 PM   #1
jeepn4life92
Registered User
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Metuchen, nj
Posts: 420
New welder looking for some technical advice

Alright, so I got myself a Lincoln easy mig 140 for Xmas and gave been practicing on my welding skills and trying to hone them into something presentable. I'm getting pretty good with laying down beads of weld on flat surfaces but my welds become really uneven and sloppy looking when I've got to weld on something that's vertical or standing up. My worry is when it comes time to weld the 3 link and 4 link brackets to my frame (obviously I can't just roll it over like I can the axle to make it flat and easy to work with) that my welds will be sloppy with poor penetration and no good. What advice do some of the seasoned welders have on this? Should I be welding top to bottom or opposite? Any other tips or tricks will help...
Thanks

__________________
nothing is a five minute job
jeepn4life92 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-15-2014, 04:32 PM   #2
AtTheHelm
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South Lake Tahoe, CA
Posts: 730
You'll get better penetration going uphill. Just keep practicing on scap all you can. You can make a jig that holds your practice pcs in a vertical position too. Also check out Jody's YouTube vids under the name weldingtipsandtricks, he has some great instructional videos.
AtTheHelm is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-15-2014, 07:47 PM   #3
mecmar44
Registered User
2004 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Quad Cities, Illinois
Posts: 7
Vertical up is dependent on your technique and there are several techniques that you can use to weld and it may be different for everyone. The approach that I take is to imagine a triangle and move your mig gun in that motion, pausing on the sides to ensure good fusion. Your triangles will overlap as you complete them and work your way up. It may help to turn your heat down a tad which allows the puddle to solidify quicker.
mecmar44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-22-2014, 06:52 AM   #4
Shadownwpa
Senior Member
 
Shadownwpa's Avatar
1991 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Meadville, Pa
Posts: 620
Learn to watch your weld puddle, when you figure out what look corresponds to a nice looking weld then you repeat it. Also.. if you havn't figured it out yet make sure you clean the base metal before you weld it.
__________________
My build thread...
Shadownwpa is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-02-2014, 09:02 AM   #5
huntermett
Registered User
1965 CJ6 
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Claremore, OK
Posts: 19
a lot depends on what filler material you are using for flux core uphill is the strongest and if you are using mig wire downhill will work just fine . as for my qualifications for saying this is . I am a structural welder for a living and use both mig and flux daily . good luck
huntermett is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-03-2014, 09:10 AM   #6
StanF
Registered User
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,116
Welding under a Jeep is no fun at all...

Is your Lincoln 140 big enough to do frame brackets for your suspension? It seems a little small to me.
__________________
My Ammo Can Console: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f12/yet-another-ammo-can-project-finished-1498520/
My 8.8 Swap: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f12/yet-another-ford-8-8-swap-extras-1565339/
StanF is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-03-2014, 04:55 PM   #7
jeepn4life92
Registered User
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Metuchen, nj
Posts: 420
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanF View Post
Welding under a Jeep is no fun at all...

Is your Lincoln 140 big enough to do frame brackets for your suspension? It seems a little small to me.
Lincoln says it's good for 5/16 single pass, and I've been getting good penetration for that when welding nice and slow
__________________
nothing is a five minute job
jeepn4life92 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-03-2014, 06:00 PM   #8
82JeepCJ7
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 4,813
If you are running hardwire and 75/25 gas, you can weld in any position and it will be a clean weld. The biggest factor with hardwire is to make sure the welding surface is clean first. If you do end up attempting to weld something thicker, you can pre-heat the area first, or make smaller, multiple passes in a good V ground into the material. Welding is like painting, its in the prep work.

I'm usually running 1/16" dual shield in all positions. NEVER rely on a downhill pass to be strong. There will be no penetration as well as weld deposition.

On larger welds, (in this case, welding 2" thick material together) use multi-pass.


Practice on making your vertical welds. I use a slight whipping motion from side to side. Never pausing in the middle. Only a short pause on the sides to let the puddle build. Then its up diagonally to the other side, pause, whip to other side.
__________________
Beat it to fit, paint it to match!

Wheel, Wrench, Repeat.
82JeepCJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-03-2014, 08:21 PM   #9
Gordon-0
Registered User
2002 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by 82JeepCJ7
If you are running hardwire and 75/25 gas, you can weld in any position and it will be a clean weld... NEVER rely on a downhill pass to be strong. There will be no penetration as well as weld deposition
Newbie here.
I have a hobart 140 running 0.24 wire and 25/75 gas.

Whenever I weld vertically uphill, the puddle seems to fall back down over itself and get really boogery looking.

Also, do you push uphill or drag?

I can get really nice looking welds going vertically downhill dragging the puddle.

Is there anything I should be doing differently?
Gordon-0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-04-2014, 06:23 AM   #10
82JeepCJ7
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 4,813
Slow your wire speed down. I will pull (drag) the puddle up hill. looking at this drawing I found on the internet, its very close to what I do. I will pause on one side (very briefly) then weave to the other side. I never stop in the middle. Pause, weave. Making an upward zig-zag pattern.

__________________
Beat it to fit, paint it to match!

Wheel, Wrench, Repeat.
82JeepCJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-04-2014, 07:13 AM   #11
Gordon-0
Registered User
2002 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 157
I will try that. I'm having trouble picturing how to position myself to pull vertically uphill, but I will try it.

I see the pattern you posted... That's what I try and do, but I tend to try and round my corners more.

Thanks for the tips.
Gordon-0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-04-2014, 11:25 AM   #12
StanF
Registered User
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepn4life92 View Post
Lincoln says it's good for 5/16 single pass, and I've been getting good penetration for that when welding nice and slow
I'm surprised that I'm the only one questioning this...a 110V machine doing 5/16" stock is uncommon in my experience. As a comparison, my 50A, 220V Hobart 210MVP is only rated to 3/8".

The Lincoln webpage actually says you have to use their special flux wire:
"MIG weld 24 gauge up to 3/16 in. (4.8 mm) sheet metal in a single pass. Weld up to 5/16 in. (7.9 mm) steel using self-shielded Lincoln Electric Innershield® (FCAW-S) wires."

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...ncolnElectric)
__________________
My Ammo Can Console: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f12/yet-another-ammo-can-project-finished-1498520/
My 8.8 Swap: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f12/yet-another-ford-8-8-swap-extras-1565339/
StanF is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-05-2014, 06:23 AM   #13
82JeepCJ7
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 4,813
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon-0 View Post
I will try that. I'm having trouble picturing how to position myself to pull vertically uphill, but I will try it.

I see the pattern you posted... That's what I try and do, but I tend to try and round my corners more.

Thanks for the tips.
I always have my gun pointed up hill just a bit.
__________________
Beat it to fit, paint it to match!

Wheel, Wrench, Repeat.
82JeepCJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-05-2014, 06:26 AM   #14
82JeepCJ7
Registered User
1982 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 4,813
This is what I build.





__________________
Beat it to fit, paint it to match!

Wheel, Wrench, Repeat.
82JeepCJ7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-05-2014, 07:50 AM   #15
Gordon-0
Registered User
2002 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by 82JeepCJ7
I always have my gun pointed up hill just a bit.
I am not arguing with you, but if your gun is pointed away from the puddle, isn't that "pushing" not "pulling"?

I was taught that the gun should always point into the puddle for best penetration... Again, maybe not ALWAYS true, in every situation.

I'll give your method a try.

I think that more likely it just comes down to how good you are and what you are most comfortable with, and hanging upside down so you can pull uphill is probably not comfortable for 99% of weldors, so compromises have to be made.

Nice bucket BTW.
Gordon-0 is offline   Reply With Quote




Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.