mulitplaz anyone try one - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > General Technical Discussions > Fabrication Shop > mulitplaz anyone try one

Introducing MONSTALINER™ UV Permanent DIY Roll On Bed LineToxic Brakes - 3000 PSI Braided Stainless Steel Brake LineCess Recovery Gear Snatch Tow Strap OffRoad @ ROCKRIDGE4WD

Reply
Unread 06-26-2014, 08:25 AM   #1
steiny93
Registered User
1991 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: moorhead, mn
Posts: 164
mulitplaz anyone try one

stumbled upon this the other day http://www.multiplaz.com/ check out a few of the videos http://www.multiplaz.com/video

almost seems to good to be true, found some limited info online; but it seems incredibly versatile. I called the company and got some more info

Some specs
• Weld (steel/aluminum/copper/stainless/cast)
• Cut (steel/aluminum/copper/stainless/cast plus other stuff like ceramic tiles or any other nonconductive materials)
• solders and brazes
• Pulls 9.6 amps at 110v or 5amp at 220v (those aren’t a typo, WOW!)
• Consumes tap water + isopropyl alcohol (the stuff you get at Walmart for like a $1). 3 oz’s per 20 minutes of work
• Uses standard welding rods (non flux)
• Proprietary rods for copper/cast

I have arc and wire feed experience; this would be arc style in the sense that you use rods to weld vs. a wire feed scenario. But this is also shielded so you would get the pretty wire feed welds vs. the nasty flux welds of arc or non shielded.

Anyone every play with one of these?

steiny93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-26-2014, 12:09 PM   #2
kjg26
Registered User
1993 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North of Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 1,787
Quote:
Originally Posted by steiny93 View Post
stumbled upon this the other day http://www.multiplaz.com/ check out a few of the videos http://www.multiplaz.com/video

almost seems to good to be true, found some limited info online; but it seems incredibly versatile. I called the company and got some more info

Some specs
• Weld (steel/aluminum/copper/stainless/cast)
• Cut (steel/aluminum/copper/stainless/cast plus other stuff like ceramic tiles or any other nonconductive materials)
• solders and brazes
• Pulls 9.6 amps at 110v or 5amp at 220v (those aren’t a typo, WOW!)
• Consumes tap water + isopropyl alcohol (the stuff you get at Walmart for like a $1). 3 oz’s per 20 minutes of work
• Uses standard welding rods (non flux)
• Proprietary rods for copper/cast

I have arc and wire feed experience; this would be arc style in the sense that you use rods to weld vs. a wire feed scenario. But this is also shielded so you would get the pretty wire feed welds vs. the nasty flux welds of arc or non shielded.

Anyone every play with one of these?
Interesting. Couldn't find a price though.
__________________
Black 1993 YJ 4.0, 5 Speed
Slowly but surely getting better and better. Trailer build soon!!
kjg26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-26-2014, 03:38 PM   #3
AtTheHelm
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South Lake Tahoe, CA
Posts: 716
It is an interesting concept. The quality of the tool and the price etc is kind if a biggie when deciding if its worth it.
It says it can weld up to 2" mild steel, which is sort of a red flag.
AtTheHelm is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-27-2014, 12:46 AM   #4
athos76
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 1,524
Looks more like brazing/soldering than true welding. I'd have to see tensile tests on the "welds" before I could even think about getting one.
__________________
2006 I6 6-Speed X, 33" Goodyear Duratrac, 8.8.
athos76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-27-2014, 05:21 AM   #5
SemperFiGuy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 23
Pricing, I could buy a lot of fab equipment for the price, ouch:

http://shop.multiplaz.com/
SemperFiGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-27-2014, 11:08 AM   #6
steiny93
Registered User
1991 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: moorhead, mn
Posts: 164
$1995 is the price

I was thinking it'd be the bomb for the trail for repairs
steiny93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-29-2014, 10:58 AM   #7
freeskier93
Web Wheeler
 
freeskier93's Avatar
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Longmont, Colorado
Posts: 6,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by athos76 View Post
Looks more like brazing/soldering than true welding. I'd have to see tensile tests on the "welds" before I could even think about getting one.
"Multiplaz 3500 can weld, solder, braze, harden, and cleanse metals including steel, aluminum, copper, cast iron, bronze and other metals"

It works by turning a water or water/alcohol solution it into plasma, like a plasma cutter. Unlike a plasma cutter the plasma is "colder", but still hotter than even arc welding or TIG (depending on what temperatures you want to look at). It's also more compact because it's not using compressed gas, it's vaporizing the water, water/alcohol to turn into plasma.

Plasma cutter ~ 25,000 C
Multiplaz ~ 8,000 C
__________________
Build Thread
My life in 2010: Chronicles of painting my Jeep
Axle Re Gear and Swap

CU Boulder Aerospace Engineering
freeskier93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-29-2014, 12:51 PM   #8
Ironworker709
Moderator
 
Ironworker709's Avatar
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Millen Area,Georgia
Posts: 3,281
They've been around for quite a few years,they have been trying to market them for a long time,but no one is buying into them.

You can weld 2" of steel in multi-passes with any good 220v wirefeed and stick machine,thats just a marketing campaign to try and "hook and reel" the unknown..........

For the price i personaly wouldn't even come close to buying one..and they have never been proven anywhere...if they were as good as they claim,you'd see them on jobs everywhere,and i've yet to see one anywhere

Also,Because of the way it's setup and runs,you'd also have to rely on their consumables totaly,not like you can find them anywhere but from them only,and i've never seen any weld supply shops supply them...

From what i've seen of them, online and they're marketing tactics,they are just another product like"FREE Tesla Energy Device!,Never pay for Electric Bills again!"..........
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
Ironworker709 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-29-2014, 10:43 PM   #9
Ironworker709
Moderator
 
Ironworker709's Avatar
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Millen Area,Georgia
Posts: 3,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by freeskier93 View Post
"Multiplaz 3500 can weld, solder, braze, harden, and cleanse metals including steel, aluminum, copper, cast iron, bronze and other metals"

It works by turning a water or water/alcohol solution it into plasma, like a plasma cutter. Unlike a plasma cutter the plasma is "colder", but still hotter than even arc welding or TIG (depending on what temperatures you want to look at). It's also more compact because it's not using compressed gas, it's vaporizing the water, water/alcohol to turn into plasma.

Plasma cutter ~ 25,000 C
Multiplaz ~ 8,000 C
It also never mentions any type of a clean Inert atmosphere it would need for true welding steel..there is no gas involved,so that means no inert gasses used..there is also no mention of any flux that would have to be used in a quality weld on steel....there is no way around making a quality weld without an inert atmosphere,it'll look like a peice of volcanic rock

Pretty much as athos76 already mentioned..it would pretty much be an overkill brazing technique used for welding....thats no benefit on any type of real welding needing any kind of real structural strength...

So the real benefit of the machine would probably only be plasma cutting without a compressor and do some minor brazing..not even close to being worth 2 grand for that...i'd just spend the 2 grand on a nice Hypertherm and leave the welding up to a real welding machine...
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
Ironworker709 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 10:49 AM   #10
freeskier93
Web Wheeler
 
freeskier93's Avatar
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Longmont, Colorado
Posts: 6,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709 View Post
It also never mentions any type of a clean Inert atmosphere it would need for true welding steel..there is no gas involved,so that means no inert gasses used..there is also no mention of any flux that would have to be used in a quality weld on steel....there is no way around making a quality weld without an inert atmosphere,it'll look like a peice of volcanic rock

Pretty much as athos76 already mentioned..it would pretty much be an overkill brazing technique used for welding....thats no benefit on any type of real welding needing any kind of real structural strength...

So the real benefit of the machine would probably only be plasma cutting without a compressor and do some minor brazing..not even close to being worth 2 grand for that...i'd just spend the 2 grand on a nice Hypertherm and leave the welding up to a real welding machine...
It says on the website it uses a "vapor shield". Not very clear although I'd have to assume its a water vapor shield. No idea how well that works, but based on some research and reading other forums it doesn't seem to work very well. People who've demoed it seem to agree the welds are incredibly porous.

I spent $650 on my Hobart 190, looks like I could pick up a Miller Spectrum 375 for about $1300. Both those machines are rated to 3/8" steel. Add a couple hundred more bucks for a spool gun and I can do aluminum. For about the same price I could handle anything I care to handle in the garage and by the looks of it do it much better.
__________________
Build Thread
My life in 2010: Chronicles of painting my Jeep
Axle Re Gear and Swap

CU Boulder Aerospace Engineering
freeskier93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 11:35 AM   #11
Ironworker709
Moderator
 
Ironworker709's Avatar
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Millen Area,Georgia
Posts: 3,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by freeskier93 View Post
It says on the website it uses a "vapor shield". Not very clear although I'd have to assume its a water vapor shield. No idea how well that works, but based on some research and reading other forums it doesn't seem to work very well. People who've demoed it seem to agree the welds are incredibly porous.

I spent $650 on my Hobart 190, looks like I could pick up a Miller Spectrum 375 for about $1300. Both those machines are rated to 3/8" steel. Add a couple hundred more bucks for a spool gun and I can do aluminum. For about the same price I could handle anything I care to handle in the garage and by the looks of it do it much better.
I seen the "vapor shield" claim..
Any real weldor would put 2+2 together and say"so..water and alcohol vapors would be an inert atmosphere?...hey guys,i have a bucket full of tack welds on my truck,,will you go fetch them for me?"...lol

Thats just more proof this invention is just another "snake oil" product..
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
Ironworker709 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 12:34 PM   #12
steiny93
Registered User
1991 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: moorhead, mn
Posts: 164
so we still don't have anyone that has used one? I'd really like to hear from someone who has played with one.

I'm very intrigued by the cutting of non conductive's feature as well as the ability to weld when not at the shop. The consumables are available at your local welding supply stores (I called multiplaz and got the part numbers). My local shop didn't know anything about the multiplaz but they had the rods. I think I'm going to pick one up and give it a try; they have a money back deal so I'll just play with it right away to make sure I'll be happy with it.

I have way more into my other welders so wants another $2k
steiny93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 12:39 PM   #13
freeskier93
Web Wheeler
 
freeskier93's Avatar
1997 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Longmont, Colorado
Posts: 6,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709 View Post
I seen the "vapor shield" claim..
Any real weldor would put 2+2 together and say"so..water and alcohol vapors would be an inert atmosphere?...hey guys,i have a bucket full of tack welds on my truck,,will you go fetch them for me?"...lol

Thats just more proof this invention is just another "snake oil" product..
It's a little more complicated than that, CO2 isn't an inert gas. Being inert isn't a requirement, it simply has to be non reactive or not reactive enough to matter, or reactive in a way that's beneficial.
__________________
Build Thread
My life in 2010: Chronicles of painting my Jeep
Axle Re Gear and Swap

CU Boulder Aerospace Engineering
freeskier93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 02:12 PM   #14
Ironworker709
Moderator
 
Ironworker709's Avatar
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Millen Area,Georgia
Posts: 3,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by freeskier93 View Post
It's a little more complicated than that, CO2 isn't an inert gas. Being inert isn't a requirement, it simply has to be non reactive or not reactive enough to matter, or reactive in a way that's beneficial.
It is quite simple..C02 is not an inert gas itself,BUT,it helps creates an INERT ATMOSPHERE.

It is used as an INERT gas for spray transfer welding for the fact it will create a hotter INERT atmosphere....BUT!..in spray transfer MIG it is used in the form of 90/10...90 %Argon/10%C02.
Straight C02 is only recomended for a DUAL shield,which is a fluxcore with C02.

Some people use straight C02 for home MIG welding because it's cheaper,BUT,straight C02 MIG welding is NOT recommended in any weld process sheets i've ever seen,or even the wire manufacturers...why?..because it's known to cause hydrogen weld embrittlement....

I wonder how much hydrogen embrittlement the by-product of a mix of water and alcohol would cause?...

If you want some more reading material by seasoned weldors on the web of this machine,and a few who have actualy tested the weld capabilites of this thing,hop on over here and read a lil...also..notice the 'one" guy who claims he bought it and it's GREAT!..but has never yet to produce any pictures of the actual finished welds,along with Multi-plaz's website,,they show some "in action" shots..but never a finished weld.......i would imagine for good sales tactic reasons.....

http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php...-this-for-real

http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php...-wleder-cutter
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
Ironworker709 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 06-30-2014, 02:15 PM   #15
Ironworker709
Moderator
 
Ironworker709's Avatar
1995 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Millen Area,Georgia
Posts: 3,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by steiny93 View Post
so we still don't have anyone that has used one? I'd really like to hear from someone who has played with one.

I'm very intrigued by the cutting of non conductive's feature as well as the ability to weld when not at the shop. The consumables are available at your local welding supply stores (I called multiplaz and got the part numbers). My local shop didn't know anything about the multiplaz but they had the rods. I think I'm going to pick one up and give it a try; they have a money back deal so I'll just play with it right away to make sure I'll be happy with it.

I have way more into my other welders so wants another $2k
If you do buy it..start a thread on the review and actual welding of it here,i'd like to see actual real reviews of it in operation and true final results that can't be found anywhere on the net..myself and others have tried and can't find any...
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
Ironworker709 is offline   Reply With Quote




Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.