Entry Welder

Pipedrummer · 01-26-2007, 12:59 PM

I'm looking to start to learn to weld, and I'm looking for a cheap entry level welder...I think I wanna start with an Arc welder, but the drawback is that I need a 110v b/c I don't have 220. I bought the Haynes Welding Manual and it's great....I was wondering what poeple thought about this welder for a 110v

http://cgi.ebay.com/ARC-120-WELDER-MACHINE-15AMPS-110V-WITH-WELDING-MASK_W0QQitemZ330078186866QQihZ014QQcategoryZ11374 3QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotoho sting

says it goes up to 120amps and has a decent duty cycle i guess... seems a little too inexpensive though....any thoughts or suggestions on a different one?

thanks

bluehdmc · 01-26-2007, 01:09 PM

I'd suggest going to a tech school and taking a beginners welders course. That's what I did many years ago, (night school at the vo-tech). The course cost is reasonable and you have someone to critique your technique.

That being said, you're probably better off getting a 110v mig welder, mig is a lot easier to do than arc, 110/120v machines are more plentiful and it's a lot easier to manipulate mig on thin stock than arc/stick welding.

To weld decently with stick you'd need at least a 200 amp unit, (that would give you a near 100% duty cycle for 1/8 rod and welding plate steel) they're all 220 volts. Although most homes have 220 volt service, (electric stoves/dryers, etc).

Rivi · 01-26-2007, 01:17 PM

don't buy that,1st of all its a AC only welder.You need a DC current welder at the very least.look for a basic AC-DC stick welder. look here http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Category.taf?CategoryID=292&pricetype

**Bigbob** · 01-26-2007, 01:41 PM

The EBAY unit looks like junk to me. Check and see what it would run you to install a 220V 50 amp line to where you plan to weld. The Lincoln AC/DC 225 and Millermatic Thunderbolt welders are very good. The AC/DC feature costs a little more, but it's worth it. I currently have a Lincoln 140 AMP 110 V MIG and I don't much care for it. It does a great job on thin stuff but I don't trust it on 1/4" and above. I plan on going 220/50 amp soon and getting a Miller or Lincoln stick machine again.

You can teach yourself to weld O-K. I advise a class, but you can read and practice on your own just fine. The internet has a lot of valuable resourses. But, talking with guys who do a lot of welding is just as valuable. Don't try welding something you may need to risk your safety with like suspension parts until you get good at it. Regardless of what welder you end up with get the best quality safety stuff you can afford. Get the auto-dimming helmet. I welded without one for 35 years and now feel stupid for not getting one years ago. The auto dimming hood is the best invention since Astro-Glide. Get good gloves. Get a good pair of clear safety glasses and just leave them on all the time while you are working. Safety is job #1 when you are welding. Get all that flammable stuff away from the area. Only weld in a dry area. Make sure no rugrats are watching you weld as they'll burn the eyes for sure.

Hunter9 · 01-26-2007, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigbob

The EBAY unit looks like junk to me. Check and see what it would run you to install a 220V 50 amp line to where you plan to weld. The Lincoln AC/DC 225 and Millermatic Thunderbolt welders are very good. The AC/DC feature costs a little more, but it's worth it. I currently have a Lincoln 140 AMP 110 V MIG and I don't much care for it. It does a great job on thin stuff but I don't trust it on 1/4" and above. I plan on going 220/50 amp soon and getting a Miller or Lincoln stick machine again.

You can teach yourself to weld O-K. I advise a class, but you can read and practice on your own just fine. The internet has a lot of valuable resourses. But, talking with guys who do a lot of welding is just as valuable. Don't try welding something you may need to risk your safety with like suspension parts until you get good at it. Regardless of what welder you end up with get the best quality safety stuff you can afford. Get the auto-dimming helmet. I welded without one for 35 years and now feel stupid for not getting one years ago. The auto dimming hood is the best invention since Astro-Glide. Get good gloves. Get a good pair of clear safety glasses and just leave them on all the time while you are working. Safety is job #1 when you are welding. Get all that flammable stuff away from the area. Only weld in a dry area. Make sure no rugrats are watching you weld as they'll burn the eyes for sure.

Great info for someone looking to learn.

BlueFlame · 01-26-2007, 01:50 PM

Back when I was looking to buy, the welders I talked with told me that those "inexpensive" little migs are a pain for the experienced, and will frustrate a beginner.
On good advice I ended up with a Clarke 180 w/ gas regulator. Very nice machine, and at a great price. My welder buddy (lifelong welding fabricator) likes it better than his comparable Lincoln, which cost much much more.
You might look at these:
http://store.weldingdepot.com/cgi/weldingdepot/scan/fi=products/st=db/sp=results/co=1/sf=category/se=Mig%20Welders%20220%20Volt/op=eq/nu=0/bs=1/ml=15/tf=description/to=x/se=1/sf=inactive/op=ne/sf=tax_category/se=1/op=eq/va=banner_text=/va=banner_image=.html

http://store.weldingdepot.com/cgi/weldingdepot/scan/fi=products/st=db/sp=results/co=1/sf=category/se=Mig%20Welders%20110%20Volt/op=eq/nu=0/bs=1/ml=15/tf=description/to=x/se=1/sf=inactive/op=ne/sf=tax_category/se=1/op=eq/va=banner_text=/va=banner_image=.html

**Jerry Bransford** · 01-26-2007, 01:52 PM

I moved this to the Fabrication forum since more welders hang out there. Personally, I bought a 110v Hobart 135 MIG welder and learned to use it by practicing on a whole bunch of scrap steel I bought for that purpose. I learned well enough that I'm doing well enough by now to have started doing my own welding on my TJ without embarassing myself... too badly anyway.

Pipedrummer · 01-26-2007, 02:30 PM

Thanks for the posts...

BlueFlame's links led me to a clark 130 amp 110v gasless MIG with a gas option....for a very good price of $268

I'm not going to buy it just yet, but I'm thinking MIG is the way to go, and 110 so I don't need to rewire...I also like that I can weld up to 3/16", (once i learn to use it)

what does everyone think
http://store.weldingdepot.com/cgi/weldingdepot/WE6523.html

RussoGuitar · 01-26-2007, 02:53 PM

Id deffinently say MIG is the way to go. Unless youre gonna be doing really thick stuff, MIG is very versitile, easy to learn on, and cheap.

hdble · 01-26-2007, 02:55 PM

Most of the 110 welders are great for thin sheet metal up to and including 1/4 inch. The gentleman who said let a certified welder do any frame welding is correct ther is a technic for frame welding to hold torsional stress. Several manufacturers have compact 220 mig units, woiuld be a better choice, just for penetration and burn in. Ok enough on the tech soap box, I'm a certified welder, and been building jeeps for30 years. I just bought my first TJ, a 97,2.5 4" lift,33's,and just ordered the oro sway loc, the thing handles like crap.

**Jerry Bransford** · 01-26-2007, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdble

Most of the 110 welders are great for thin sheet metal up to and including 1/4 inch.

I've yet to hear of/read of/see a 110v MIG welder capable of doing 1/4" well enough to say 1/4" is within its abilities. My 110v Hobart 135 MIG welder is barely adequate at 3/16" so I wouldn't even attempt to weld 1/4". Sure, some offbrand 110v welders may advertise they can do 1/4" but not many welders would agree a 110v MIG welder has the nuts to really do 1/4". A 110v MIG welder would certainly not be "great" at welding 1/4".

**Bigbob** · 01-26-2007, 07:14 PM

Ditto what Jerry said.
I have a Lincoln 140 amp 110 Volt Mig and I am not real confidant in welding 1/4" stuff. I've done a bunch of 1/4" welding using the flux gasless welds, but I'd not be comfortable welding something that is under a lot of stress. With my old Lincoln 225 A/C-D/C 220 volt stick welder I always felt great confidence in my welds on 1/4" and even 3/8" stuff.

I regret not installing a 220 volt 50 amp breaker. It's gonna be a pain as my box is full, but I'm gonna do it one day and get a good old Buzz Box stick welder again. Bob

Pipedrummer · 01-28-2007, 08:59 PM

well i don't think i'll be welding too thick stuff right off the bat...theres a few things here on the property i live and work on which can benefit from a welder, and so can my jeep in the process....I think for ~270 its worth it to go ahead and get the Clarke 130amp Mig to learn in addition to a class....

it'd be nice to one day be able to make a trailer like they show in the last chaper of the haynes welding book

bryans98tj · 01-28-2007, 09:12 PM

Most of my welding has been either 1/8" or 3/16" and that is it's max. Even then I do a bevel and depending in the weld placemment will make a second pass. That is with a Lincoln 135 too.

Rivi · 01-28-2007, 09:23 PM

i bought millers best 110 volt mig welder,couldn't weld 1/4 inch. Even 3/16 was cold.For exhaust and sheet metal it was great.I did a few frame repairs with it on unibody cars and it worked well.I agree you need to go 220 volt mig for a all around machine.

01-26-2007, 01:09 PM	#2
bluehdmc Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: north NJ Posts: 420 Profile Gallery Classifieds My Jeeps	I'd suggest going to a tech school and taking a beginners welders course. That's what I did many years ago, (night school at the vo-tech). The course cost is reasonable and you have someone to critique your technique. That being said, you're probably better off getting a 110v mig welder, mig is a lot easier to do than arc, 110/120v machines are more plentiful and it's a lot easier to manipulate mig on thin stock than arc/stick welding. To weld decently with stick you'd need at least a 200 amp unit, (that would give you a near 100% duty cycle for 1/8 rod and welding plate steel) they're all 220 volts. Although most homes have 220 volt service, (electric stoves/dryers, etc). __________________ bluehdmc North NJ 2005 Stone White Rubicon Unlimited White Jeep Club #53 1999 Harley Road King 2006 BMW R1200RT

01-26-2007, 01:41 PM	#4
Bigbob Web Wheeler Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Bakersfield Posts: 3,195 Profile Gallery Classifieds My Jeeps	The EBAY unit looks like junk to me. Check and see what it would run you to install a 220V 50 amp line to where you plan to weld. The Lincoln AC/DC 225 and Millermatic Thunderbolt welders are very good. The AC/DC feature costs a little more, but it's worth it. I currently have a Lincoln 140 AMP 110 V MIG and I don't much care for it. It does a great job on thin stuff but I don't trust it on 1/4" and above. I plan on going 220/50 amp soon and getting a Miller or Lincoln stick machine again. You can teach yourself to weld O-K. I advise a class, but you can read and practice on your own just fine. The internet has a lot of valuable resourses. But, talking with guys who do a lot of welding is just as valuable. Don't try welding something you may need to risk your safety with like suspension parts until you get good at it. Regardless of what welder you end up with get the best quality safety stuff you can afford. Get the auto-dimming helmet. I welded without one for 35 years and now feel stupid for not getting one years ago. The auto dimming hood is the best invention since Astro-Glide. Get good gloves. Get a good pair of clear safety glasses and just leave them on all the time while you are working. Safety is job #1 when you are welding. Get all that flammable stuff away from the area. Only weld in a dry area. Make sure no rugrats are watching you weld as they'll burn the eyes for sure. __________________ 2006 Solar Yellow Rubicon Unlimited Jeep Club Member #1340 6 Speed, Hardtop Mods done: Hurst tee handle, cheap hand throttle, Rokmen Merc front bumper, Warn 9.5 TI winch with 3/8" X 100 worth of Viking yellow rope, DPG OME Ultimate with JKS ACOS up front, Kilby Gas Tank Skid, Kilby Steering Box Skid, Jeep Medic Belly Up, Skidrow Engine Skid, Rockcrusher Diff Skid in the rear, Warn Diff cover in front, , AR Outlaw II's and MTR 12:50/15's, Homemade rear Bumper, Cheap Cobra CB, Puma OBA, Sirius Radio, Locker Defeat, Rockhard cage, Rockmen short corners, homemade tire swing/tailgate hinge affair, Airlift air bags on the rear- - - - - - and more to come!

01-26-2007, 07:14 PM	#12
Bigbob Web Wheeler Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Bakersfield Posts: 3,195 Profile Gallery Classifieds My Jeeps	Ditto what Jerry said. I have a Lincoln 140 amp 110 Volt Mig and I am not real confidant in welding 1/4" stuff. I've done a bunch of 1/4" welding using the flux gasless welds, but I'd not be comfortable welding something that is under a lot of stress. With my old Lincoln 225 A/C-D/C 220 volt stick welder I always felt great confidence in my welds on 1/4" and even 3/8" stuff. I regret not installing a 220 volt 50 amp breaker. It's gonna be a pain as my box is full, but I'm gonna do it one day and get a good old Buzz Box stick welder again. Bob __________________ 2006 Solar Yellow Rubicon Unlimited Jeep Club Member #1340 6 Speed, Hardtop Mods done: Hurst tee handle, cheap hand throttle, Rokmen Merc front bumper, Warn 9.5 TI winch with 3/8" X 100 worth of Viking yellow rope, DPG OME Ultimate with JKS ACOS up front, Kilby Gas Tank Skid, Kilby Steering Box Skid, Jeep Medic Belly Up, Skidrow Engine Skid, Rockcrusher Diff Skid in the rear, Warn Diff cover in front, , AR Outlaw II's and MTR 12:50/15's, Homemade rear Bumper, Cheap Cobra CB, Puma OBA, Sirius Radio, Locker Defeat, Rockhard cage, Rockmen short corners, homemade tire swing/tailgate hinge affair, Airlift air bags on the rear- - - - - - and more to come!

01-26-2007, 01:17 PM	#3
Rivi Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pa Posts: 316 Profile Gallery Classifieds My Jeeps	don't buy that,1st of all its a AC only welder.You need a DC current welder at the very least.look for a basic AC-DC stick welder. look here http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Category.taf?CategoryID=292&pricetype

01-28-2007, 09:23 PM	#15
Rivi Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pa Posts: 316 Profile Gallery Classifieds My Jeeps	i bought millers best 110 volt mig welder,couldn't weld 1/4 inch. Even 3/16 was cold.For exhaust and sheet metal it was great.I did a few frame repairs with it on unibody cars and it worked well.I agree you need to go 220 volt mig for a all around machine.