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Unread 08-15-2013, 03:17 PM   #16
KMD
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I would just really like to see cage that has been ARC Welded? Anyone post one up?

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Unread 08-15-2013, 04:07 PM   #17
BESRK
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While I don't have pics, a few years ago a buddy of mine stick welded a cage in his stretched TJ. I was totally blown away when he told me he used an Arc Welder... the welds sort of reminded me of the "stack of tacks" that some people do with a MIG. IIRC he used a 7018 Rod and was amazingly consistent with it.


He now runs his own shop "Full Awn Fabrication" up in Northern Virginia.. he's a very talented fabricator.
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Unread 08-15-2013, 04:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BESRK View Post
While I don't have pics, a few years ago a buddy of mine stick welded a cage in his stretched TJ. I was totally blown away when he told me he used an Arc Welder... the welds sort of reminded me of the "stack of tacks" that some people do with a MIG. IIRC he used a 7018 Rod and was amazingly consistent with it.


He now runs his own shop "Full Awn Fabrication" up in Northern Virginia.. he's a very talented fabricator.
Sweet. I searched google and did not really find any.
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Unread 08-15-2013, 06:19 PM   #19
andrewmacc
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I believe vetteboy on PBB did all the first stages of his build with an arc welder. I'm not positive if he actually did the cage with SMAW though.
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Unread 08-15-2013, 08:26 PM   #20
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All these experts... it's incredible

A brief glossary:

Arc welding - Welding with the use of an electrical arc producing the heat required to melt two parent metals together with or without filler metal - includes gas metal arc welding (mig, gmaw), shielded metal arc welding (stick, smaw), and gas tungsten arc welding (tig, gtaw).... and many more.

Heliarc - Tig welding using high frequency alternating current (achf)

ALL WELDING requires clean metal to produce a sound weld, though some will show it more immediately and more visibly. Don't believe me go stick weld a groove over some grease, sand or paint and put it in a bender.

Can you weld a roll cage with stick? yea. If I had to I'd probably tack it in position, brace it, pull it out, and roll it so all the welds could be done flat for best visual appearance and penetration. I'd prefer mig though.
Since we're gettin all "Expertee" and "Techy".....lol

TIG is technicaly GTAW..Gas Tungsten Arc Welding

Heliarc is just an old knickname for GTAW using helium as the sheilding gas instead of argon or other common used sheilding gasses..

High frequency is used with AC current on TIG...frequency is how many times the AC cycles back and forth per second.......
Alternating Current is on AC,,,,,,not DC

So welding a ferrous common steel like roll cages you would be running DC..no high frequncy..and no Alternating Current......

"Arc Welding" is just another old well known knickname for stick welding (SMAW..Sheilded Metal Arc Welding)

People still use that as the knickname for SMAW...i generaly just call it stick welding...
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Unread 08-15-2013, 08:45 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BESRK View Post
While I don't have pics, a few years ago a buddy of mine stick welded a cage in his stretched TJ. I was totally blown away when he told me he used an Arc Welder... the welds sort of reminded me of the "stack of tacks" that some people do with a MIG. IIRC he used a 7018 Rod and was amazingly consistent with it.


He now runs his own shop "Full Awn Fabrication" up in Northern Virginia.. he's a very talented fabricator.
I looked in some old pics and couldn't find any closeups of it,but stick welded both my bumpers made of a schedule 40 2" pipe with 3/32" 7018 before i upgraded from my old Lincoln 135 110v to the Lincoln 180 220v here at home...

As far as stick welding cages and such,it was the common process to use for drag racing and NASCAR among other motorsports before all these new wirefeed machines and good filler wires came out...Scratch TIG was also used if you had the money to invest in it back then...
My father and his best freind used to build and race dirt track cars in Smyrna Delaware and all the chassis and roll cages were stick welded and certified before they were allowed ro run.

I LOVE to stick weld anything..especialy pipe/tube.it was always a challenge and sort of an art ,in the early 80's i worked in a shop in Pa that built vessels and pipe work for DuPonts and i learned pipe welding there,the old guy i worked under always said"it's all in the twist of the wrist boy".

I beleive stick welding is much harder to master than TIG,always hear people say how hard TIG is,TIG is much slower and controlable..with stick you have to be able to hold a correct arc length and feed it,,angle of the rod,,watch the puddle and speed all at the same time
Stick takes a heck of a lot longer to learn than any other process to be even "acceptacle" at it...

Even though i live to stick weld..if i have a choice between a wirefeed for cages and automotive type work...wirefeed wins everytime
bumper7-008.jpg

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Unread 08-16-2013, 12:11 AM   #22
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thats interesting, I find stick welding MUCH easier than tig. i think it might just be the difference in pace, though. i started welding SMAW, only just recently (past couple of weeks) started tig. unfortunately my job doesnt require much welding, almost no tig. i dont even know why im being paid to learn it right now haha.

i think when i get back to the shop ill practice my pipe welds, and take it from there. good looking bumper!
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Unread 08-16-2013, 08:32 AM   #23
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Nice bumper. I agree Stick welding seems harder then TIG to me. I can stick weld and get stuff to stick together but it is not pretty and would probably never pass an inspection.

TIG I can do quite well with as well as MIG.

How about some torch welded tube work? Not brazed but actually welded. I was practicing that before I got a TIG machine,no pics though.
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Unread 08-16-2013, 05:27 PM   #24
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I've got a roll of .035 NR-211 flux core wire that came with my Lincoln welder, is it worth trying other types of flux core wires, like the 233 mentioned on the first page?
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Unread 08-16-2013, 11:53 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielbuck View Post
I've got a roll of .035 NR-211 flux core wire that came with my Lincoln welder, is it worth trying other types of flux core wires, like the 233 mentioned on the first page?
NR-211 is more than fine

The NR-233 is designed for infrastructure in the USA now because of all the earthquakes and tornado's and hurricanes...

I never priced it myself.only ran it on jobs..i would imagine its high dollar wire and unnecesary and total overkill for anything we do at home or on vehicles
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Unread 08-17-2013, 12:48 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709 View Post
NR-211 is more than fine

The NR-233 is designed for infrastructure in the USA now because of all the earthquakes and tornado's and hurricanes...

I never priced it myself.only ran it on jobs..i would imagine its high dollar wire and unnecesary and total overkill for anything we do at home or on vehicles
I've not compared prices yet, but if the 211 and 233 are comparable for the home redneck, that's fine with me! I'll stick to the cheaper one

I've been having a bit of trouble though. My 211 flux core welds usually seem to look "ok" (no buggers, but not as good as my MIG welds with gas). When I use the flux core wire, I get alot of weld that have no slag on top of it to chip off. I assume this means I'm either not traveling at the right speed, or the wire feed and power isn't set right? I've tried on very clean metal, and somewhat dirty metal as well, with a bit of mill scale on it. The sound seems good to me, it's a hissing burning sound, quite a bit hotter sounding than the mig wire + gas "bacon" sound. Any ideas?

Any tips for getting better welds with the flux core wire? I assume that since I'm not getting much slag coating on top, it's mixed in with the weld, haha!
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Unread 08-17-2013, 02:50 PM   #27
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I know this has prob been said but being a welder by trade when people call stick or smaw welding "arc" welding that is my pet pev. Almost every type of welding is arc welding. Unless we are talking about braze welding or explostion welding or plastic welding.
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Unread 08-17-2013, 02:58 PM   #28
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I've used HTP's e71t-gs with good results and its only $78 for two 10lb rolls.

When you're using flux core wire you always want to be pulling the puddle along in a drag motion. Not sure if thats what you've been doing or not.
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Unread 08-17-2013, 06:50 PM   #29
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How about some thermite welds?? Fun to watch..
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Unread 08-17-2013, 07:53 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by AtTheHelm View Post
When you're using flux core wire you always want to be pulling the puddle along in a drag motion. Not sure if thats what you've been doing or not.
I did try it both ways, I didn't notice a whole lot of difference, but I did pull instead of push most of the time. With mig I usually push.
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