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Unread 10-27-2012, 12:47 AM   #1
9703tj
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HO72 vs. 14 bolt.

I'm trying to figure out what rear axle to use, I'm tossed up between the HO72, and the 14 bolt rear axles.

On the one hand there are lots of cool things about the HO72 that make them drool worthy, but on the other hand parts for them aren't exactly easy to find as they've been discontinued since 1972ish...

The 14 bolt is plentiful, but it's a little larger, and has a cast center section.

How close can a 14 bolt be shaved? Can it give the same clearance as a shaved HO72?

A bunch of the guys I wheel with all swear by the HO72, but I've always liked the 14 bolt. As you can imagine they are hyping the HO72 up as the end all be all rear axle and downplaying the 14 bolt. I'd like to see what some of the other folks in other areas think about the two axles, or if there's a 3rd axle of comparable size and strength that might be even better?

Thanks in advance for the help!

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Unread 10-27-2012, 08:51 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9703tj View Post
I'm trying to figure out what rear axle to use, I'm tossed up between the HO72, and the 14 bolt rear axles.

On the one hand there are lots of cool things about the HO72 that make them drool worthy, but on the other hand parts for them aren't exactly easy to find as they've been discontinued since 1972ish...

The 14 bolt is plentiful, but it's a little larger, and has a cast center section.

How close can a 14 bolt be shaved? Can it give the same clearance as a shaved HO72?

A bunch of the guys I wheel with all swear by the HO72, but I've always liked the 14 bolt. As you can imagine they are hyping the HO72 up as the end all be all rear axle and downplaying the 14 bolt. I'd like to see what some of the other folks in other areas think about the two axles, or if there's a 3rd axle of comparable size and strength that might be even better?

Thanks in advance for the help!
Wow now your talking about a great couple of axle's. Me I'm a big HO 72 guy, more clearance, steel housing factory 5.14 gears ( if you can find them, ive got 3 ) Detroit lockers factory ( again if you can find them, I have two ) 3rd pinion support but the biggest part that seperates them from any other OEM or factory axle is the load bolt or the ring deflection bolt.

Ive built this steering axle, out of a HO rear.


Ive made a custom 35 splool for it to except Chevy 60 shafts, installed the proper seal steps for the 1.5" axle's.

So that others know what we're talking about here is wht they look like.





They look like giant 9" axle's, infact in 50's Ford bought the rights to the HO from GM and then based the 9" off the HO axle's.

There two different HO axle's found under trucks, there the HO 52 and the 72, the only differnece between the two is the 52 has no load bolt. In that first Pic of that shows the 3rd you can see the load bolt sticking out the side, kinda looks like and adjusting nut, it is.

Now to compare them to a 14 bolt well thats a tuff one, the Eaton ( HO ) use's a 10.125" ring the 14 bolt use's a 10.5" ring. The pinion on a Eaton is massive and drarfs the 14 B.
Shafts the eaton use's a 17 spline course cut shaft buy most belive that there of a chrom molly steel, as they have the numbers on the end of the shaft.
14 bolt shafts can fit in the Eaton with very little mods, the lockers and spiders are the same size, differnet cut on the splines but fit.

Really the only bad thing about a Eaton is the fact there very getting very hard to find and theres no after market gears for them. Plus the last one's made where back in 1971-72 when the 14 bolt pahsed in.

I really feel and I stated this in the Pirate thread many times that if the eaton had any after market support the new drop out 14 bolts 3rds would have been based off the HO rather than the 14 bolt. Great axle I would not for minute not run one and to chose it over a 14 bolt.

Yes for years Ive stated that 14 bolt is the best rear axle god every gave us, then I looked a little deeper and found the Eaton, I was worng........

Jason.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 08:53 AM   #3
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Oh to add to the last question in your post, the only next best axle to eather is the dana 80, but thats another hole can of worms.

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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Unread 10-27-2012, 11:13 AM   #4
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Thanks Jason! A friend of mine says there were a few different variables over the years as far as the gear sets and center sections go, and he was suggesting that instead of piecing an HO72 together out of parts from multiple sources that it's better to get a 3rd member that already has the gear ratio that I want. I found the 5.13 gears online as new old stock for $400, and I've been able to find complete overhaul/master install kits with all new bearings and seals for around $600-$700.I've seen 4:11 and 4:56 HO72's online for between $200-$400.

My buddie says it's not worth buying the overhaul kit, and to just take the axle apart and clean everything really good and put it back together.

I never see the 5.13 gear and 3rd members offered up for sale together, I always see the gears being sold sepperately. What do I need to look for to make sure that the gear set I think about buying will work with the 3rd member, etc... how do I know all the parts will play nice together before I order them all?
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Unread 10-27-2012, 03:25 PM   #5
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Ive never seen any new parts other than bearings. Your friend is correct about gears and how they interchange, theres two types of bearing used on these axle's they taper and then the roller bearing.
The tapers are better for what we are doing but a roller wont let you down. Now where theres a differecne in the two gear sets are is what bearing used, theres a difference in depth.
But you can swap gears into different 3rds you just need to use the same bearing that matchs the pinion. All the 3rds are the same except for the difference in the in the load bolt.

If the axle is in good shape I would not buy or spend the money on any type of overhall kit. Really the best thing is to buy the 3rd complete and all of us roaders are looking for the 5.14's.

I find alot of the eaton axle's in older junkyards or in farmers fields and like I said alot of them are going to be 5.14's and with detroits.
Parts playing nice together as you put it is just make sure they all match, pinion matches gears, and bearing matchs pinion.

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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Unread 10-27-2012, 05:09 PM   #6
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I don't know how truthfull these are:

http://www.cmperformancemachine.com/...nd-Pinion.html

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/wante...l#post14020296

EDIT: I didn't see at first but the first link is for used gearsets.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 07:04 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9703tj View Post
I don't know how truthfull these are:

http://www.cmperformancemachine.com/...nd-Pinion.html

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/wante...l#post14020296

EDIT: I didn't see at first but the first link is for used gearsets.
I would trust the Pirate guys first. Ive posted alot of info in that Eaton thread ( 420willys is my user name there ). I know Oden did have a set for sale but they may be for the roller bearing gears sets. Nothing wrong with them you just need to know so you can run the right bearing on the pinion.

That second link before I would buy a set of gears I would ask for a Pic of them, casue what they have there posted is buy far not a set of HO gears. Not saying they dont have them but those posted in that pic are not HO geras no pinion snub, to small of a pinion and the the pinion use's a course cut spline for the yoke.

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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Unread 11-04-2012, 07:53 AM   #8
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Sorry to hijack this thread, but does anyone need a HO72 3rd member?
Shoot me a PM, if you are interested.

Thank you
img_0118.jpg  
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Unread 11-04-2012, 11:42 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idiot magnet View Post
Sorry to hijack this thread, but does anyone need a HO72 3rd member?
Shoot me a PM, if you are interested.

Thank you
Not a hijack, any and all HO72 info parts and pieces are more than welcome here!

What's the gear ratio?
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Unread 11-04-2012, 12:25 PM   #10
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If the OP pass's shoot me a PM on the shipping I will take it no matter what the ratio, well unless shipping is way to much which it normally is.

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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Unread 11-04-2012, 12:28 PM   #11
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If the OP pass's shoot me a PM on the shipping I will take it no matter what the ratio, well unless shipping is way to much which it normally is.

Jason.
I'm gonna pass for now Jason, it's all you.
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Unread 11-04-2012, 12:38 PM   #12
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Okay, I don't want to snake anything out from under you. I would hate to see it be a 5.14 3rd, but judging from the thickness of the gears it looks like a 4.10 or 4.57.
A 5.14 gear set will be 7-36, 7 teeth on the pinion and 36 on the ring. If its a 5.14 then I dont care what the shipping will be I will take it.
I will say its a open carrier as you can see the side gears, a Detroit will be a smooth on the insdie in that little window.

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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Unread 11-05-2012, 09:16 PM   #13
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4.56 and it's open.
Shipping should run approx $100 as long as I can ship it to a business that can take skids because I'll have to ship it using a freight co. I have a small skid that I can use.
These suckers are heavy.

PM me if you are interested.
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Unread 11-06-2012, 09:45 AM   #14
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He asked for info so not hijacking just hopefully helping....
Is it correct that 14b ff axles and side hears can swap into this ho72? Read that somewhere in all the internet's infinite knowledge.. Maybe you can shed light since you flopped 35sp 60 shafts in? (must have overlooked that sentence in your post Jason)

Seems it had better clearances than a 14b. The extra couple inches seems it could be worth while if the correct ratio was found in these axles vs a shaved 14?
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Unread 11-06-2012, 12:42 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ltrail View Post
He asked for info so not hijacking just hopefully helping....
Is it correct that 14b ff axles and side hears can swap into this ho72? Read that somewhere in all the internet's infinite knowledge.. Maybe you can shed light since you flopped 35sp 60 shafts in? (must have overlooked that sentence in your post Jason)

Seems it had better clearances than a 14b. The extra couple inches seems it could be worth while if the correct ratio was found in these axles vs a shaved 14?
The shafts do swap over from axle to axle, the factory no soin Detroit locker swap also but that about where the stop. Yes I made a custom 35 spline spool for the steering axle.

I used 35 spline side gears from 60 to make the spool, but i'm exploring the idea of a custom 35 spline locker with the help from a Pirate vender.

They are big, but are easyer to shave down, alot of them can be found with 4.56s and even 5.14s. the axle was used from 47-72 and this was in the time were trucks were made to pull large over sized loads, so agian 5.14s are commen ( unlike 14 bolts ) to find in junkyard trucks.
And since 4 wheel drive truck were not the norm for while the only way to get more traction was a no spin locker or Detroit.

I started researching these axle's around 4 years ago and been nothing but impressed with them. Really the only down side is the lack of after market support like gears and parts like bearings. But hteres still plenty of good used 3rds and one good thing is all the parts for the most part swap.

I'm building a 4.10 geared axle with locker and disc brakes for my 78 F-250, yes even my ford will get a Eaton axle

Jason.
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1993 YJ 4.0 60 Front, Rear steer 60, bolth spooled, 5.38's, 700r/241 39.5 iroks and beating it like it owes me money.

And on the 8th day, God created the 14 bolt....
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