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Unread 11-13-2012, 08:19 PM   #16
cycleguy04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benderff View Post
The D44 in the TJ's is a weak version.

My D44 couldn't handle 35s and a locker. Along with this treat, my housing was bent backwards from crawling.



One tons are in the future.
Are those chromoly gears? Holy crap!

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Unread 11-13-2012, 08:28 PM   #17
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Wouldn't be to hard to hack off the knuckles at the tube, trim the tubes to your desired width, and weld on some beefy aftermarket knuckles. In theory. Maybe somebody with some experience should chime in.
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Unread 11-13-2012, 09:06 PM   #18
Mase90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundowner View Post
With 37's you're on borrowed time even in simple street driving. The 30 may grenade on you but the more likely situation is that the continual stress of the large tires will bend, warp and twist the suspension and steering until something seems to give way, suddenly.

With that said, I think you're at the point of going to a 60, or a 14 bolt, or something of that nature. As you well know, the differentials on those units are freakin' huge...but you're offsetting the clearance loss on the differential by having an adequately-sized tire. You'd have to do a lot of work to beef some 44's up enough for your 37" tires - see Redlyner's build for details on that route - but if you want lightness and clearance, the built-44 route is the way to go.

There are a lot of other good axles out there, as well...so don't get locked into the normal choices.
Yeah thats been a constant concern for me the past several months so I have been keeping an eye on it. But I only drive it a few miles a day so it doesn't get too much use at the moment. I have been limiting my driving on it since I know it has a very limited life span with the 30.
I wanted to stick with either a dana 44 or 60 just for the reason that finding parts for them would be easy. But as far as research on the 60 and other options I am kinda lacking. I had been planning putting an arb with 5.13 in the 44 upgrading the knuckles and putting the chromolly shafts in it to deal with the larger tires but I know that it would be on the limits of a d44. If I do go with a d60 though what other things would I have to change out? I had been hoping to stick with a 5 or 6 lug patter, but if I can build something better for around the same price I'd be completely game to go that route. Also I had either wanted to do high steer or crossover. I should also admit that this is my first jeep build so I am still in the middle of a big learning curve.
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Unread 11-13-2012, 09:35 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdkask View Post
Of course driving habits and terrain count, but the D60 is stronger than the D44... hard to break. But I think you have as much clearance with a D44 and 35's as D60 and 37's, maybe more. Someone will roger up that info in a moment, I think. Will you be maybe going larger than 37's later?

As for brakes, what will you be doing for rear lug pattern? A mismatched set would be unfortunate, as you'd need multiple spares. If your rear is stock (5x4.5), maybe you can have fronts re-drilled to match? If you wanted to keep the lug pattern for the Ford stuff (and some older Jeeps) of 5x5.5 you can build it to use high steer, FSJ/Chevy brakes, ford hubs/rotors. I can point you in that direction, if you go that route, as can plenty of other guys here, but there is a "formula" to do it on the cheap (junkyard parts), as conversion "kits" can get costly fast.

Please note that a Ford 8.8 is only a slight upgrade (if any) from your D44 rear, and a Ford 9" is only a slight upgrade from there, depending on donor vehicle. You'd be great with D6/D60s, but it will cost you a arm, leg, and an organ or two, especially after all the brackets, etc. Depends on your budget.

My D44 project (and the reason I had to learn so much) is getting a HP D44 (all of them are driver's side drop) into a CJ7 with D300 (passenger side drop). I had to remove tubes and flip driver's/passenger's sides. No picnic. I actually used pieces of two HP D44s, one from a F250 and one from a Bronco like you have. Lots of carnage and one whole axle's worth as scrap metal. I got it cheap, though, and was a housing like that one that was destroyed.
I had been hoping to stick with the 5x5.5 bolt patter that way I could possibly use the disk brakes that I got with the axle. I have been wondering if it would be possible to have my rears redrilled to that pattern? And yeah I had really wanted to do a high steer set up that way I can eliminate one more weak point. But whats this "formula?" What kinda donor vehicles would I have to track down?
I keep coming back to the idea of changing to 60's front and rear but I don't have tons of money to drop at the moment. But I would like to do this right the first time. I also haven't done any research yet as to what vehicles I would be able to snag one out of. I had been hoping to be able to change the front first and then the rear a little down the road.
As far as your project did you do a right up on it? Cause I haven't ever done any drive train work but I'm pretty mechanically inclined. I found a guy that said he would retube it for $450 including materials. But I keep hearing from guys that this isn't worth it. Did you use the housing from the bronco 44? I think I could probably figure out how to pull the tubes. And I have a friend that said he could help me install the new tubes and set up the correct angles on the knuckles, but I'm not really sure if this is going to worth it or if I should just start over now and switch to the 60? I would really like to use this 44 since its the HP reverse cut, but its starting to sound like it going to be a real challenge.
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Unread 11-13-2012, 09:38 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cycleguy04 View Post
Wouldn't be to hard to hack off the knuckles at the tube, trim the tubes to your desired width, and weld on some beefy aftermarket knuckles. In theory. Maybe somebody with some experience should chime in.
That is what I had planned on but then I found out that the radius arm mounts were cast not welded on. As far as I know there would be no way of cutting them off without compromising the integrity of the tube. Unless I am mistaken? Which is entirely possible. This is my first jeep build.
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Unread 11-13-2012, 09:40 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benderff View Post
The D44 in the TJ's is a weak version.

My D44 couldn't handle 35s and a locker. Along with this treat, my housing was bent backwards from crawling.



One tons are in the future.
Holy #$@*! Thats crazy. That was with 35's?
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Unread 11-13-2012, 10:45 PM   #22
cycleguy04
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Originally Posted by Mase90 View Post
That is what I had planned on but then I found out that the radius arm mounts were cast not welded on. As far as I know there would be no way of cutting them off without compromising the integrity of the tube. Unless I am mistaken? Which is entirely possible. This is my first jeep build.
Cast brackets? Ditch it. Pick up another one. I would question the integrity as well. I hope I don't run into that issue when I get mine.
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Unread 11-13-2012, 11:02 PM   #23
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Seeing how I just put a narrowed 44 in the front of my rig this summer I figured I'd chime in. I chose a 44 over a 60 for a few reasons. A 60 housing is huge and trying to fit everything would have been a pain. It would have cost me quite a bit more to build it over my 44. I don't plan on going any bigger than 35's while this thing is still driven on the road and I don't see that happening for quite a few years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mase90 View Post
I had been hoping to stick with the 5x5.5 bolt patter that way I could possibly use the disk brakes that I got with the axle. I have been wondering if it would be possible to have my rears redrilled to that pattern? And yeah I had really wanted to do a high steer set up that way I can eliminate one more weak point. But whats this "formula?" What kinda donor vehicles would I have to track down?
I keep coming back to the idea of changing to 60's front and rear but I don't have tons of money to drop at the moment. But I would like to do this right the first time. I also haven't done any research yet as to what vehicles I would be able to snag one out of. I had been hoping to be able to change the front first and then the rear a little down the road.
As far as your project did you do a right up on it? Cause I haven't ever done any drive train work but I'm pretty mechanically inclined. I found a guy that said he would retube it for $450 including materials. But I keep hearing from guys that this isn't worth it. Did you use the housing from the bronco 44? I think I could probably figure out how to pull the tubes. And I have a friend that said he could help me install the new tubes and set up the correct angles on the knuckles, but I'm not really sure if this is going to worth it or if I should just start over now and switch to the 60? I would really like to use this 44 since its the HP reverse cut, but its starting to sound like it going to be a real challenge.
There are a few write-ups that can be found on various forums. Start searching. When you think you're ready. Search some more.

High steer information for a 44 can be found doing a few Google searches. Look up Mr N.

You're wasting time on that housing. I have one just like it sitting in my driveway. At this point I'd be willing to give it away. There is no solid tube under the radius arm mounts and unless you got creative with the drivers side inner C I don't foresee it being pressed onto a new tube. I'm not sure what prices on axles are in your area but out by me you can find a HP44 and a rear 60 out of a 78 F250 for much less than what you got quoted for retubing.

At least for me, this was not an easy or quick project. I researched for a couple years and learned as much as I could, snagging deals on parts along the way. I can't even begin to make an estimate as to how much time I spent on it. It's still not even done in my eyes. 3 linking the front was also part of the project as I couldn't see why anyone would do all of the work of narrowing an axle and fabbing up new steering just to weld stock mounts back on.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 06:06 AM   #24
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I am in the middle of a one ton swap right now. I decided on 60's front and rear. I came up with that after being in the same dilema as you are in now. Building for a 37" tire is a bear. Not even the Dyantrac or Currie built 44's are advertised to run larger than a 35" tire.

The JK Rubicon 44 is nothing to right home about, but can be done with work (truss, knuckles, shafts, etc...). There are TJ front 44's out there as well. Also, what spline in your rear? I assume it is a TJ 44. Is it still the 30 spline? Even with chromos you are at the limits of that axle as well. JK rear 44's came 35 spline I believe.

You can step up and go with a Rock Jock or Pro Rock 60 and have awesome clearance with a 37. Dynatrac claims their Pro Rock 60 has better clearance than a 44! Problem is a front Pro Rock is 8 grand (just got an estimate last week). You will retain the bolt pattern you want, they come/are built for you, not a bad choice if you have that kind of money.

Currie has the Fab9. Great housing and great clearance. The problem is their third member is an 8.8" ring gear. You can always get a third member from someone else (true hi nine). Spydertrax is another 9 inch option. Currie also builds non fab 9's, but again price...

Full width Dana 60's can be found all over if you check the right classifieds and forums. Google the Dana 60 Bilbe. It will give you all kinds of info. Ford 9"s are also though highly of. Then there is the 14 bolt. The OEM full widths will give you clearance issues on 37's. So I gave up on 37's.

When I started this endeavor I knew it would not be cheap or easy. I am looking to land on 40's so I knew I had some work ahead of me.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 07:12 AM   #25
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No matter which route you take, you will spend nearly the same amount getting axles that are reliable with 37's.
You either throw every upgrade part you can at 3/4 ton axles, or accept the inevitable and throw some brackets on stock one tons.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 09:39 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdkask

Please note that a Ford 8.8 is only a slight upgrade (if any) from your D44 rear, and a Ford 9" is only a slight upgrade from there, depending on donor vehicle.
This is sooo wrong..... Both of these axles (31 spline) will support 37's as a rear axle and are available in the junkyard.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 10:00 AM   #27
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This is sooo wrong..... Both of these axles (31 spline) will support 37's as a rear axle and are available in the junkyard.
There are three potential methods to doing anything: cheap, fast and right. Pick two.

With that said, I'd put 35's on the 8.8 and probably wouldn't feel too bad about 37's on a 9; the Ford 9 is a pretty strong setup by my reckoning. Any way you cut it, however, 37's cannot be done easily; they're going to take some effort in more ways than just axle strength.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 11:36 AM   #28
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Lots of rigs out there on a 9inch running 37's..... IMO its just as safe as the Dana 44 on 35's. And the 9 inch can be built up easily. Rear axle is relativley easy for 37's, the front is where it gets to be an issue.... Dana 44 with RCV's or chroms is the minimum.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 11:47 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by CJ7dreamer
Lots of rigs out there on a 9inch running 37's..... IMO its just as safe as the Dana 44 on 35's. And the 9 inch can be built up easily. Rear axle is relativley easy for 37's, the front is where it gets to be an issue.... Dana 44 with RCV's or chroms is the minimum.
RCV's can also limit your brake options, so be careful there. I'd go for the best conventional shafts you can get, truss/sleeve/gusset the front, and swap the rear. Then I'd worry about everything else you need for 37's.
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Unread 11-14-2012, 12:14 PM   #30
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I know it has been said a bunch before.... 37's are a bastard tire size... The problem is with the front axle they are bit of a compromise in strength for the 44 outers and ring and pinion and a bit too small for the 60 housing.... So it is not a simple bolt in fix for either... And then there is brakes and steering.......
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