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WJ + XJ Rotella T5 10w-30 vs. Mobil 1 high mileage vs. Castrol high mileage.

53K views 117 replies 28 participants last post by  Jeepsmsc2 
#1 ·
02 grand 4.0l
99 xj 4.0l

beside the oil question are both these engines the same or do they have different heads or other different parts? the only noticable thing i see is one has a manaul belt tensioner and one is automatic.

it looks like mobil 1 and Rotella seem to have the most zinc that we look for according to what i have been reading but does the Rotella T5 synthetic "blend" (not full) have more or less than the regular T or T3 and does the mobil 1 high mileage have more or less than both of those?? all in 10w-30. I use to use the Mobil 1 high mileage and switched to the castrol high mileage. I use a wix filter also . when i bought this about 2 years ago I had the flappy, ticking slappy noise that was on start up and was trying a few didnt brands to see if it changed it . the castrol high mileage i rarely hear it now with the cold weather or cold start ups. this rotella id like to try. what do you guys know about the zinc levels and have you had any experience with the Rotella vs the mobil 1 HM even the castrol HM????????? thanks
 
#2 ·
The Castrol High Mileage is really low zinc (640ppm). I would never run it in a 4.0. The additive package is "weak" at best. Low zinc, low phosphorus.

The Mobil 1 High Mileage is what I run, it is over 1000ppm zinc. The UOAs on both my old 4.0 and my current 4.7HO are very good with this oil at 6000 mile drain intervals. I use Wix or Napa Gold filters both for air and oil, although I prefer the Wix-branded air filters; they use a different element than the Wix-manufactured Napa Gold.

Rotella (both T and T5) 10W30 has an extremely stout add pack. Twice the calcium of the Mobil 1 and 1200ppm zinc. It also has a high TBN, good for extended drain intervals. I haven't seen it on the shelf in 10W-30 though, usually I see 5W40 or 15W40 so I haven't run it.

Either the Mobil1 HM or Rotella will suit your needs very well. Use whichever is the cheapest and most readily-available. I would start with 5000 mile change intervals and have the oil analyzed by Blackstone Labs ($25). They will tell you if your engine wear is looking good (for instance, is that rattle you hear lifters or piston slap? A high concentration of aluminum in your oil sample will tell) and if you can comfortably extend your oil change intervals.
 
#5 ·
I'll have to check that out then. I've been getting my M1HM from WalMart since it is so cheap... but that's the only reason I ever go to WalMart. There isn't one close, I have to drive 20-25 miles to get to one that reliably keeps their oils fully-stocked. The one that is slightly closer is always out of stock on M1HM. I'll keep an eye out for Rotella and maybe give it a shot. I need to get my next 2 UOAs back first and then make a decision.
 
#4 ·
I run the Rotella. Why because I like it. When you comparing the Mobil HM and Shell Rotella T5 the difference is negligible. Both are very good for our app's.
Try to stay away from the Castrol HM for the reason's stated above. These are older "style" engines and the valvetrain is going to need the zinc offered in the Rotella T5-6 and Mobil 1 HM. Can't go wrong with either Rotella or Mobil 1 HM. If your going to use Mobil 1 just make sure it is the HM.
 
#6 ·
Rotella would be a prime choice, it has more zinc/phosphorus than the Mobil 1, and more additives, but a lower grade of base stock. The Rotella T5 10w30 is readily available at most Walmarts, the conventional Rotella 10w30 can be had on sale every few months at Advance AP for even less (right now I think). There is no difference between the two except the base stocks, add packs are identical and both will serve you very well. The T5 being a synblend has better cold flow, the fact that it's available anytime you want at Wally's for a good price is a bonus too.

The Mobil 1 High mileage mentioned previously is probably the best synthetic match for the 4.0, I'm not a fan of Mobil in the 4.0 but the HM version does well according to others. You'd be better off with the 5w30 and a booster quart of 10w40 though, you'll get better base stock, higher VI (cold flow) and still get 10w30 thickness and performance in the heat doing so. Valvoline Maxlife full synthetic supposedly exists and would be a great choice also but good luck finding it at a reasonable price.

Everybody has their opinions on oil, that's what makes discussion fun, and I disagree with the idea Castrol HM is not a good choice for the 4.0. I don't believe the zinc number posted is accurate, but it will certainly have less than Rotella or Mobil HM, it is however very thick for grade with a high viscosity range. Your own experience with it as well as mine has been positive, and I've seen a number of used oil analysis on it in the 4.0 that indicate the 4.0 does very well on it. Valvoline Maxlife (the common red bottle syn blend) is somewhat similar but thinner, it also does very well in the 4.0.

Pretty hard to make a "bad" oil choice these days. My 4.0 actually runs quietest on plain old Pennzoil, several other Jeepers have experienced the same thing, lots of good options out there and you don't have to spend 5+ bucks a quart for many of them.
 
#7 ·
You'd be better off with the 5w30 and a booster quart of 10w40 though, you'll get better base stock, higher VI (cold flow) and still get 10w30 thickness and performance in the heat doing so.
Oddly enough, the 10W30 M1HM has a slightly lower pour point than the 5W30 of the same oil, although their low temperature viscosities would naturally have the 5W30 flowing better. I'd just stick with the listed weight for whatever engine you're working work.

I disagree with the idea Castrol HM is not a good choice for the 4.0. I don't believe the zinc number posted is accurate, but it will certainly have less than Rotella or Mobil HM
The number I posted above I obtained from the following source: a Blackstone VOA of Castrol GTX High Mileage 10W-30. The thread echoes my comments about it being a fairly unremarkable oil.

Of course there is more to oil these days than what can be detected with spectroscopic analysis, but good add packs are still good add packs. Older engines like the 4.0 respond well to traditional oil formulations, SL-rated and earlier.
 
#8 ·
The Mobil site has 5w30 HM listed at a -39 pour point and the 10w30 HM at -37, but pour points are not much use anyway. The real kicker is viscosity, the 5w30 is 69 at 40C whereas the 10w30 is 78. The most important way of determining thickness though, which many don't understand, is the HTHSV - the 5w30's is 3.3 whereas the 10w30's is 3.5. That means the 5w30 is thinner at all temperatures than the 10w30, and therefore will flow better. The 5w30's VI is much higher too, again promoting flow, 165 for the 5w30 versus 149 for the 10w30. The 5w30 is a much superior oil at the same price, you might as well get what you're paying for, since our Jeeps need an extra quart it can be boosted a bit with a quart of 10w40 if something even thicker is desired without having much negative impact on the VI, the 10w40 although thicker has high VI as well unlike 10w30 which is a small jump over a straight grade oil.

All that and I don't even care for Mobil.:laugh:

I had seen that UOA you mentioned but unfortunately its Blackstone who consistently produce some strange numbers, when it comes to Blackstone if it doesn't look right it probably isn't. When the PQIA independently tested regular Castrol GTX in 2011 it had nearly 800 ppm zinc, the HM version is certain to have at least that and most likely has more. Bottom line though is it works.

To each his own though, like I said earlier very hard to make a "bad" choice.
 
#9 ·
i myself believe the Rotella is best for this application. i just got my current WJ (7th jeep) and i just changed oil with cheapo oil and delco filter (work for gm) will run it about another 500 miles to give 1000 miles and then seafoam oil, drain, refill with oil and run for more and drain and change to Rotella and Wix likely. engine is noisey and hoping to quiet down this top end.

i personally wrote off Mobil. Overpriced for what you get. I have found Other oils/synthetic oil surpasses what they claim.
 
#11 ·
Rotella is a tremendous bang for the buck, I'll likely be putting some in mine today and will run it all summer. All of the HDEO diesel oils are generally a tremendous value, very often on sale too, but Rotella is about the only one you can actually find in 10w30 short of special ordering a five gallon pail.
 
#13 ·
T5 in 10w-30 which can be found at wally world or tractor supply. Its semi synthetic and has nearly the same specs as T6. T6 is very hard to find in 10w-30 so I used 5-40 instead briefly. Honestly id throw the T5 in there and let er rip for 5,000 miles.
 
#14 ·
I stopped caring so much about add packs, but I know this: I used Rotella T5 10w30 in my freshly rebuild 4.0 with a Melling HV pump, at the recommendation of members of this forum who'd had good results. I get great Oil Pressure, and zero tapping. AFAIC, that's good enough for me.
 
#18 ·
not happy with the oil on both jeeps maybe its the syynthetic part but both engines are much louder. you hear it i guess in the top end. the lifters the rockers valves whatever. the high mileage oil seems do the noticeably better job with keeping the engine quieter. if the only better thing about the oil is that it has higher amounts of zinc and the engine doesnt run any better now what ????????????? hmmmmm the cheaper high mileage castrol gtx is looking nice again
 
#19 ·
I just ran Rotella T5 10W-30 for 3500 miles in my 4.0. It was definitely noisier than other oils. I'm going to put Rotella T 15W-40 back in for the summer and then probably go to a 5W-40 or 10W-40 for winter.
 
#20 ·
After putting in a new camshaft and lifters, I started with Rotella T Triple Protection for an oil change or two then stepped it up to the T5. I use 10W-30. I haven't noticed any issues with noise - no lifter tick or anything like that. Perhaps having new lifters quiets down the top end chatter... Just throwing in my .02 for added reviews.
 
#21 ·
Rotella is thick stuff, top end noise often tends to quiet down on thinner, not thicker oils. The Castrol HM is really thick too, but it's an entirely different add pack which also makes a difference in noise.

If you want quiet you might try plain old Pennzoil 10w30 SN (the new stuff) tons of moly makes the 4.0 really quiet.

I like an engine to be quiet as possible too, but from a review of UOA's noise is not an accurate reflection of engine wear. Valvoline for example consistently produces very low wear numbers in the 4.0 but it's not very quiet on it.
 
#22 ·
im sure the head on the grand can use alittle rebuild since ive always had a noise. ive seen the pics where people pull the lifters out and worn to crap. the 99 not until i put in this .. what i remember now is when i used the mobil 1 high mileage 10w-30 it is doing the same as the rotella t5 10w-30 . which is the larger over all engine noises . castrol GTX HM 10w-30 has made both of them just run at normal engine noise level. the 99 is newer i never got to put mobil 1 in so the a couple oil changes i did were the castrol gtx hm now with the t5 much louder. :(
 
#23 ·
Last oil change I put T5 10-30 in and its noisier than when I had the T6 5-40 in, so next change im going to try T5 10-40 (Found at TSC or Napa although they must order it) and see how the 4.0 likes it. One things for sure, those lifters are noisy with the 10-30 in there. I have 3 gallons of CAT syn deo in my garage but I havent used it because being a dedicated DEO I know its not safe for catalytic converters.
 
#26 ·
I really wanted the same thing too, but my skirt bit the dust at 244,000. If it wasn't for that im sure it would've kept going right on to 300,000 no problem. But now it'll make it to 500,000 and beyond no problem. I'm glad I put new lifters in though, I've never heard my 4.0 idle so quietly. FWIW before it died I ran rotella T5/6 in 10-30/5-40 flavors and my lifter noise never went away but the engine seemed to like it. Current break in oil is regular Valvoline 10-30 with GM's EOS for the added zinc for 1000 miles. Afterwards its back to Rotella T5 in 10-30 at 5,000 intervals.

I wouldnt worry about the rods in these engines, the 544,691 castings are pretty beefy and arent the weak link in this engine. The pistons are for sure and are garbage compared to what I replaced them with. Jeep KNEW about this issue and still built these engines with the same pistons up until production ended. Also, the factory pistons have to have the absolute thinnest compression rings ive ever seen. If you start hearing abnormal noise (lifter noise is normal, see now I sound like a dealership tech!) then you can pretty much expect thats what it is. Catch it early like I did and youll luck out.
 
#27 ·
time for an oil change again. 2 wix filters and .................... im really thinking of going back to the castrol high mileage 10w-30 before i switched over to the t5 because it made everything quiet. so you'd think that would be doing the better oiling job over the t5 right? no noise means you found the right balance of the oil not being to thick or thin is what im thinking????? thats my commonsense :)
 
#35 ·
Rotella would work but it's just not a great match for the 4.7. Something like Maxlife in 5w30 would be a much better pick for that engine.

For fighting ticks, thinner not thicker is your friend. The Maxlife flows better and is thinner than most other high mileage oils, and has a great add pack plus a history of producing very low wear in engines.
 
#29 ·
Curious myself as to which one will work better. I've been using Castrol GTX HM 10w-30 for the past three oil changes with a mopar filter.

Since it's been getting below 40 degress lately, I've noticed a slight ticking
on cold startup. Goes away after a minute or so.

I might try the Rotella this time around. The engine has around 100K on it,
so it's well broken in :)

Steve
 
#34 ·
Castrol HM is the thickest HM oil available that I know of. The 10w30 is identical to the Rotella in actual "thickness". Now that it's getting cold I'd suggest the Castrol HM in 5w30. It is actually thicker than most generic 10w30's but it has a higher Viscosity Index so it flows better, and of course it's a bit thinner than the Castrol HM 10w30.

I've been running the Castrol GTX HM in 5w30 since late July, it's been really quiet and it also seems to clean well. I'm actually going to run a blend of Castrol HM 5w20/5w30 over the winter (it will still be as thick as normal 5w30's) then switch back to the straight 5w30 in the spring. The Castrol has been as quiet as the Pennzoil has been for me, and I've tried a lot of oils.

I'll be doing UOA's on it also, Chris please be sure to post yours!:thumbsup:
 
#30 ·
I'm changing my oil this weekend (Rotella T5). I really pushed the OCI on this one - partially to see how it turns out, partially because I've been so busy lately. I'm going to send it to Blackstone Labs for an oil analysis. I'm hoping to be pleasantly surprised. I'll let you know how over running the T5 turns out.
 
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