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WJ Quadradrive left turn grind - Rage quit is possible

7K views 28 replies 11 participants last post by  gavd48 
#1 ·
2002 WJ Limited 4.7L HO QUADRADRIVE VARI-LOK

I'm sure these threads are obnoxious because I see them so much, but I've read too much and now I'm lost.

Symptoms: Turning sharp left and even not that sharp left, grinding noise is heard. No idea where it's from. The problem seems to happen less often when it's warm weather (70 or above) and almost always when it's cold. Also, when at full lock, my back wheels will spin freely, almost as if i had lockers on. I may be able to upload a video I took of this to YouTube, and if I do I'll put the link in later.

About 2 months ago I went to the dealer, and the drive line specialist guy there opened up both differentials, inspected them, cleaned them, put them back together with new fluid and friction modifier(vari-lok). He suggested it may be the viscous coupler, and said what he did SHOULD fix it in about a week. But of course, it didn't fix the problem, didn't even make it better.

I've seen many threads saying to check for play in the u-joints. I just did that and all is well. Checked CV axle boots and those look good too. If there's anything more I should check please tell.

If anyone fixed this problem and it's not one of the above, I beg you to please share your wisdom. I'm not sure what's more annoying, the grinding when turning left or the fact I don't know what the problem is.....
 
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#2 ·
Two things:

1) There are no viscous couplers in any WJ drivelines. There are progressive couplers, which are an entirely different thing.

2) CV axles can be shot even if the boot is in fine shape. I've snapped them more than once without damaging the boot at all. They grind on turns when they are shot.

I would jack up your front axle and turn the wheel to the left and spin the wheels to see if you can replicate the noise and locate it.
 
#3 ·
Two things:

1) There are no viscous couplers in any WJ drivelines. There are progressive couplers, which are an entirely different thing.

2) CV axles can be shot even if the boot is in fine shape. I've snapped them more than once without damaging the boot at all. They grind on turns when they are shot.

I would jack up your front axle and turn the wheel to the left and spin the wheels to see if you can replicate the noise and locate it.
Just did the CV axle test, I can't hear a noise that sounds like it. Seems normal. And that makes me wonder why the dealer told me viscous coupler.....??
 
#4 ·
gavd48 said:
Just did the CV axle test, I can't hear a noise that sounds like it. Seems normal. And that makes me wonder why the dealer told me viscous coupler.....??
This comes up somewhat frequently, the previous generation of grand Cherokee, the ZJ was available with a transfer case that had a viscous coupler that was prone to failing. A lot of mechanics make the assumption that the same thing applies to WJs, but it does not. When the VC in a 249 transfer case (ZJ) fails, it becomes stuck in 4wd and causes binding in the driveline. When the Progressive Coupler in a 247 transfer case (WJ) fails, it gets stuck in RWD and there is no binding. You won't know your coupler has failed until you need 4wd and it doesn't work (4lo will still work though). There are no symptoms to a failed PC except lack of 4wd.
 
#6 ·
gavd48 said:
I will test 4WD tomorrow, I guess I haven't really needed it this summer, seems like my drive line would be pissed off if it wasn't working since I have Quadradrive, but it's worth checking...
Quadradrive only gets "pissed off" when it's still working but has incorrect or degraded fluid in the transfer case and/or the diffs, or doesn't have the correct amount of friction modifier in the diffs. When it's not working at all, it's smooth because there is no engagement of the clutch plates that make the system function. You might be grinding on turns due to lack of friction modifier in the front diff or bad fluid in the transfer case, both of which will start engaging due to the differences in wheel speeds in a tight turn.

Another thing you might check is your front drive shaft. Try removing it and see if your grinding goes away. It's less likely, but still possible.
 
#7 ·
Okay I'll try that. And maybe I'll do the t-case and differential fluid change myself, so I can assure I have the right amount of FM and the right fluid. Just to clarify, removing a driveshaft with Quadradrive won't be bad for it or damage it right?
 
#11 ·
Not lifted, and I checked my CV axles last night and they are in good condition. I wouldn't think it's pinion bearings because it was owned by someone who never took it off-road and only drove in dry paved roads for about 14 years, so there hasn't been a lot of movement down there. And I think I'd feel a constant vibration if the pinion was the problem. However thank you for the suggestion, everything helps as it really could be anything lol
 
#9 ·
gavd48 said:
Okay I'll try that. And maybe I'll do the t-case and differential fluid change myself, so I can assure I have the right amount of FM and the right fluid. Just to clarify, removing a driveshaft with Quadradrive won't be bad for it or damage it right?
Removing the front drive shaft won't do anything bad.

Removing the rear drive shaft will cause you to lose fluid and require the coupler to engage for any movement unless you put it in 4lo. If you ever do that, only do it for a short distance.
 
#10 ·
Alright thanks for the information. After further research, because I took it to the dealer for diff fluid and friction modifier, they only added the spec amount, which is 2.5oz in the front diff and 4.0oz in the rear diff. I watched some videos explaining how limited slip differentials worked, and I'm convinced adding an extra ounce or so to each diff will fix the problem. I understand that too much FM can hurt off-road performance, but I'm not going to off-road much, and I guess I'll have to sacrafice that to get rid of the grinding problem. I'll report back Saturday afternoon or maybe Sunday if it fixed the problem or not.
 
#12 ·
I have the same problem with my WJ 4.7Ho with quadradrive. Love it. It works awesome off road and even better on wet roads. "bring it on 2wd pickup truck in the rain. ha ha" However, when making right and sometimes left turns I get a grinding/wurring sound. It is from the diff's. I have to do the service on mine again because I continually drive through deep muddy water. It happens. But yes, do the diff service, don't for get the additive, and try it out. Mine doesn't make noise until I go in the deep muddy water.
 

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#15 ·
He's pushing that bow wave forward nicely so will be fine.....I've had water briefly level with side windows (not planned ....water was deeper than usual!!) but because I had good traction I could keep moving and pushing that wave which causes that "dip in the water just in front of you which allows air into the engine. I had a few drops of water (perhaps an egg cup full) in my airbox but no more....and my door speakers where trash after!! Whatever happens don't stop!!.....and if you do kill the motor and get pulled out. At least on my diesel there is rather less in the way of sensors and ignition parts to worry about!

We regularly do one very similar to this but a touch deeper in the winter. Only one of us has a snorkel (a V8) and he's the only one who wont go through it lol....his WJ is "too pretty" to risk!! LOL. IMO this guy should be going a little faster to get a better wave....but he made it so its all good.



.............and here's how not to do it!!! Haa haa!



:D:D:D
 
#16 ·
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#17 ·
torchd said:
I have the same noise up front. I just had my front pinion bearings changes in July with new gear oil; Severe Gear 75w140 and 2.5 oz of friction modifiier from Mopar. my front axle boots are fine, no rips or tears. So it has to be the progressive couple. Here is my thread: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f310/viscous-coupler-bad-my-nv247-3894794/
You have quadra-trac 2, not quadradrive, so you don't have any coupler in the front diff. There are many other things to rule out before you get to the coupler in your transfer case, which would not grind if it failed anyway, it would just slip and your 4wd wouldn't work except in 4lo. Your cv joints can still be bad even with the boot intact. You've also got hub bearings, carrier bearings, drive shaft joints, brake components. Your axle housing could even be bent. All of those things are more likely to cause grinding noises than the coupler in your transfer case failing. That doesn't rule out the transfer case itself, just the coupler. You could still possibly have some grinding going on in the case if something else is messed up, like the chain. You'd still hear that in 4lo, and being in 4lo eliminates the coupler in the TC from the equation.
 
#18 ·
Umm I have a Quadra-Drive TC; NV247. I have a 4.7 HO Jeep with Vari-Loc. Marked all over my Jeep says Quadr-Drive on the rear hatch and the shift bezel on the inside. Plus with my VIN, it too states from Chrysler that I have Quadra-Drive I do not have a Quadra-Trac TC which is aslo a 247. So really I see no difference. All of what you mentioned have been checked out. My Jeep is stock and has never been off pavement.
 
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#19 ·
torchd said:
Umm I have a Quadra-Drive TC; NV247. I have a 4.7 HO Jeep with Vari-Loc. Marked all over my Jeep says Quadr-Drive on the rear hatch and the shift bezel on the inside. Plus with my VIN, it too states from Chrysler that I have Quadra-Drive I do not have a Quadra-Trac TC which is aslo a 247. So really I see no difference. All of what you mentioned have been checked out. My Jeep is stock and has never been off pavement.
You're right, I apologize, I totally confused you with the other guy posting in your thread. There's been too many of this same thread lately.

That said. When progressive couplers go bad they stop engaging, so they won't grind. If it's grinding, it's still engaging, so it still functions. Your grinding is still unlikely to be a bad PC.
 
#20 ·
No worries. And I had a specialty drive line shop look at my Jeep. They specifically deal with Jeeps and all their support 4wd components. I trust the shop that I brought my Jeep too. I still think it is in my TC.
 
#22 ·
If that shop says you have a problem with your nonexistent VC, ask them what is the difference between a VC and the PC you have been told is in your NV247. If they tell you that they are the same, then your confidence in them is badly misplaced.
Right, I've just taken it to another shop because I screwed up on replacing my tie rods and I'm getting misfires codes now, but I'm having them take a look so we'll see what happens.
 
#29 ·
Yeah, I haven't done the fluid yet because I want my vari-loks to work at their best. So here's the story. The grinding won't cause any damage or extra wear, it's something that is supposed to happen, but because the vehicle is old, it happens. Quadradrive has limited slip differentials with a clutch plate locker system. The grinding is due to an unnecessary activation of the lockers when on pavement.
Depending on how you drive will determine if you do this service or not. If you drive off-road often and want the best off-road capability, make sure the spec amount of differential fluid and friction modifier are in both axles. If you only drive on the pavement all the time, and the grinding bothers you, try adding a little more than spec amounts of friction modifier, and it most likely will stop the grinding. I haven't done this yet after I found out the grinding won't damage anything. Hopefully this makes sense lol, let me know if you need clarification.

Also if anyone has done this, let's hear your conclusion, I'd hate to leave an inconclusive thread on such a common problem.
 
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