Trac bar/ death wobble - Page 4 - JeepForum.com

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post #46 of 64 Old 05-31-2014, 07:41 PM
skain8
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No offense, but how do you have heavily modified jeeps and not know this?


'02 WJ: 4.7L, 5", HP44/9", 231HD, tall & skinny KM2's
Half-Ton axle swap guide
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post #47 of 64 Old 05-31-2014, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by skain8 View Post
No offense, but how do you have heavily modified jeeps and not know this?
Here you go again, clouding a thread with meaningless unhelpful comments that leave the rest of us wondering what in the he11 you're talking about.

As I said before, out of all the Jeeps I've built, I've never run into death wobble before. Ever. Brand new JKUs, YJs and ZJs with over 100,000 on the clock...never ran into this before.

So to be more specific, forget the usual alignment specs that people and shops use. Are there any specific numbers to aim for to fight the death wobble on these WJs? They are set up quite a bit differently than all Jeeps before them and I'm assuming it's going to take a different toe and caster setting to dial it in.

'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #48 of 64 Old 05-31-2014, 08:37 PM
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Did you make sure to watch the upper arms too while performing the dry steer test?
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post #49 of 64 Old 05-31-2014, 08:46 PM
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Yes but couldn't see play. Doesn't mean they are perfect but everything looks tight and solid. Which is weird because the death wobble is really bad. So not being able to see anything loose really surprises me.

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'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #50 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 06:30 AM
skain8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WXman View Post
Here you go again, clouding a thread with meaningless unhelpful comments that leave the rest of us wondering what in the he11 you're talking about.

As I said before, out of all the Jeeps I've built, I've never run into death wobble before. Ever. Brand new JKUs, YJs and ZJs with over 100,000 on the clock...never ran into this before.

So to be more specific, forget the usual alignment specs that people and shops use. Are there any specific numbers to aim for to fight the death wobble on these WJs? They are set up quite a bit differently than all Jeeps before them and I'm assuming it's going to take a different toe and caster setting to dial it in.
I think most understood my point.

To answer your question, no, the WJ is not unique to toe and caster settings, and the WJ is not "set up quite a bit differently than all Jeeps before them". But again, I would think someone as knowledgeable as you in building heavily modded jeeps would know that. Or at least know what a dry steering test was.

'02 WJ: 4.7L, 5", HP44/9", 231HD, tall & skinny KM2's
Half-Ton axle swap guide
231HD build info

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post #51 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 08:09 AM
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What about a wet steering test?
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post #52 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 08:37 AM
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What about a wet steering test?
Dream on.
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post #53 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 08:46 AM
WXman
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Originally Posted by skain8 View Post
I think most understood my point.

To answer your question, no, the WJ is not unique to toe and caster settings, and the WJ is not "set up quite a bit differently than all Jeeps before them". But again, I would think someone as knowledgeable as you in building heavily modded jeeps would know that. Or at least know what a dry steering test was.
If you can't look under a WJ and see the differences from other models, you need to just give up the hobby and move on. The WJ is unique from every other Jeep ever built. Do you really even own a Jeep? Or do you just troll this forum looking for opportunities to be a d**k?



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'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #54 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by WXman View Post
If you can't look under a WJ and see the differences from other models, you need to just give up the hobby and move on.

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Of course different models have different track widths. That aside....In the front if you looked at a side view on a drawing of the suspension it would be nearly indistinguishable from other SFA coil sprung models. The lengths, angles and offsets are unbelievably close. The only difference that counts is in the length of WJ UCAs and it is not something you can see. So don't go off the deep end on this, the difference are mainly cosmetic.
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post #55 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 09:43 AM
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Negative. The steering is different, both drag link and tie rod. The rear is different with no track bar. The ratios are different in the steering. Its all unique to WJ.

I guess I'll just play with settings and figure it out since nobody has an answer.

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'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #56 of 64 Old 06-01-2014, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WXman View Post
If you can't look under a WJ and see the differences from other models, you need to just give up the hobby and move on. The WJ is unique from every other Jeep ever built. Do you really even own a Jeep? Or do you just troll this forum looking for opportunities to be a d**k?



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Obviously the steering designs are different from an XJ to a TJ to a WJ, i.e. inverted Y, inverted T, straight knuckle-to-knuckle, but again, toe and caster settings are substantively not.

Where is your shop where you built all these heavily modded jeeps? I'd love to visit. When you're not knee-deep in your next build, perhaps you could brush up on some reading comprehension as well.

'02 WJ: 4.7L, 5", HP44/9", 231HD, tall & skinny KM2's
Half-Ton axle swap guide
231HD build info

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post #57 of 64 Old 06-06-2014, 09:02 AM
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So I got the JKS bar on last night. (It's eye candy. I really love it.) Torqued bolts to 75 ft/lbs per instructions.

Took Jeep to alignment shop this morning. They rebalanced all tires and set the alignment to these specs:

Toe: 0.09 both sides
Caster is at 4.5° both sides
Camber is at -0.5° both sides which is in factory spec

Left the shop and on my way to work at 30 MPH I hit a manhole cover with the passenger front wheel and it went into death wobble. ^%$#@!

There is no visible play in tie rods, drag link, sway links, track bar, etc. Alignment looks good. Tires look good. This thing is breaking my checking account up really bad.

I guess the only things left that it could possibly be are control arm bushings (which don't move during steering test, but who knows) or ball joints or the steering box itself. All of which are expensive items.

'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #58 of 64 Old 06-06-2014, 10:30 AM
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Its probably the control arm bushings.
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post #59 of 64 Old 06-06-2014, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Wheelin98TJ View Post
Its probably the control arm bushings.
Yeah I guess I'll attack those next. What do guys here usually do on these WJs? Buy new control arms for $40 or just the bushings and re-use the existing arms for $15? The new arms come with the bushings pre-installed I think so that would just be a time saver right? I may just press new bushings in and give that a whirl.

'92 YJ - heavily modded
'96 ZJ - heavily modded
'05 KJ CRD Limited - 370 lb./ft. from a 4-cylinder and trail ready. Pure awesomeness.
'11 Mango Tango JKU Sport - Mods
'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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post #60 of 64 Old 06-06-2014, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by WXman View Post

Yeah I guess I'll attack those next. What do guys here usually do on these WJs? Buy new control arms for $40 or just the bushings and re-use the existing arms for $15? The new arms come with the bushings pre-installed I think so that would just be a time saver right? I may just press new bushings in and give that a whirl.

Once you do the axle bushings you realize you don't want to press bushings out and in anymore. I say go for new arms... Of course being as frugal as I am I'll probably end up just replacing the bushings. I guess it's your call! There's positives in doing it either way.
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