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Unread 09-09-2013, 03:20 PM   #1
Josh414
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IRO A Arm 3'' lift ?

I have 3 inch lift with all adjustable control arms. my question is regarding the jam nut on the upper A arm i have it bottomed out on the outside of the arm closest to the piviot joint. my tire is adjusted just off center (slightly to the rear) which i really dont like. is it common to have to move the jam nut to the inside of the arm.
thanks for any insight

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Unread 09-09-2013, 03:33 PM   #2
skain8
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Sounds like the a-arm is too short for your application.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 04:17 PM   #3
Josh414
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Actually as it sits now the setup is to long unless i move the jam nut to the inside of the triangle in the bracket. just wanting to know if it is common in do this.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 04:19 PM   #4
asatxj
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If the wheel is to the rear it is being pushed back. How can the a arm be too short if the axle is back of center? It would be too far forward if it were short. Let's have a pic or two. I'd like to see your pinion angle. Are your LCA's misadjusted? Did IRO give you some data on how to set them up?
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Unread 09-09-2013, 05:50 PM   #5
Josh414
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no pics as of now perhaps i will post some when i get home. as of now my pinion angle is = with output tail shaft of TC and both measure 6*
think about it like this the upper A arm is as short as it can adjust so the only way to get the pinion angle within spec is to extend the LCA thus moving the tire to the rear. I really feel it is too far back (not centered) but have not tested this as far as clearance goes.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 06:21 PM   #6
skain8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh414 View Post
Actually as it sits now the setup is to long unless i move the jam nut to the inside of the triangle in the bracket.
That's what I meant. ;-)

It is a design flaw.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 07:26 PM   #7
Tollmtn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh414 View Post
Actually as it sits now the setup is to long unless i move the jam nut to the inside of the triangle in the bracket. just wanting to know if it is common in do this.
It is VERY common to have to move the nut to the inside. IRO needs to build the A arms body at least 1" shorter but they are in denial about this issue.

I have 4" of lift and stock LCAs. Even with the nut on the inside and the A arm adjustment totally bottomed out my pinion angle was slightly more than 4 degrees high. To correct for that with fixed LCAs I needed to be able to adjust another .757" shorter. I informed them of this issue six or seven months ago and they would rather fight than fix. The only correction I.R.O claims to have made recently is, they cut the threaded stub down so it will not contact the gusset plate like it did on mine LOL.

Check out this thread http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f310/...stall-1435789/

So IMO...You will need to move the nut to the inside and even then totally bottom out the adjustment. On the bottom to correct pinion angle with 3" of lift your LCAs should be set at 18 1/8 to 18 1/4" long. That should get your pinion angle very close and your wheels back to about the original wheelbase. All you have to do is fine tune it again using the LCAs adjustment..

On my Jeep after my I.R.O. flex joint on the A Arm failed the second time I replaced it with a Summit Machine Joint. While I was at it I cut the length of the A arm length down so I could adjust my pinion angle, plus enough to allow for the use of two lock nuts because some have had the lock nut come loose. (picture 2 below) is after shortening the A arm well over an inch.

Bottom line, the A arm body is built over length and is useless for adjusting pinion angle unless you have 5 or 6" of lift.

The first picture is the one I sent to I.R.O. last winter. Notice I even had to cut a notch in the gusset so I could totally bottom out the adjustment.

The other issue I had was.... they weld the rubber bushings on at an overcorrected angle for anything under 5 or 6" of lift so the bushings are not at a good angle. The third picture is how I cured that problem. What a difference the change made in highway driving. Now for the first time the A arm is actually a CONTROL arm.





Adapter bar and bushing style change, Tollmtn.

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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:03 PM   #8
WJChris01
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Wow after all that it would probably be cheaper and easier to just get some tube, a heim/Johnny joint and build your own. I understand why you didn't do that, since you had the arm already and the desire to prove your point.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:08 PM   #9
Josh414
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tollmtn looks like you have done a very good job correcting the issues. what is a better A arm to use
just looked at the trans yoke and it looks like adjusting the rear back as far as i have has caused a increase of about 1/4 inch or so in distance from the TC housing to the hub on the tc side of the drive shaft. how much is too much guys??
thsnks for your help im very new to this forum just joined a few hours ago glad i did already getting great help and info.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:14 PM   #10
Josh414
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on the LCA measurement is that center to center/bolt hole to hole or over all distance because right now the over all distance is just under 21.5 center to center they are about 18.75
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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:16 PM   #11
asatxj
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Hey Tollmtn, I would love a photo of your final version. I have a world class fab guy who would build such a thing for me. I've replaced everything up there and still have clunking so a newer better design is next. I'd like to see someone's four link version as a design idea. Maybe over on mallcrawlin?
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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:18 PM   #12
skain8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WJChris01 View Post
Wow after all that it would probably be cheaper and easier to just get some tube, a heim/Johnny joint and build your own. I understand why you didn't do that, since you had the arm already and the desire to prove your point.
Its hardly that simple. There are many factors of geometry at play that affect, both negatively and positively, handling.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 08:31 PM   #13
WJChris01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skain8

Its hardly that simple. There are many factors of geometry at play that affect, both negatively and positively, handling.
Maybe I should have been a bit more specific. You are right of course, building any link suspension is not just as easy as cutting a length of tube.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 11:30 PM   #14
Tollmtn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh414 View Post
on the LCA measurement is that center to center/bolt hole to hole or over all distance because right now the over all distance is just under 21.5 center to center they are about 18.75
That is bolt C/L to bolt C/L. You are just about the width of the nut to long on the LCAs. so move the lock nut to the inside, set the lowers to 18 1/8" to 18 1/4" then fine tune from there.

One other conformation you are set to long.... I notice that in the suspension sticky ArloGuthroJeep says he has his LCAs set at 18.5" with 4.5 - 5" of lift. Keep in mind that the amount you have to adjust length increases more rapidly with every degree of angle the arm swings down from horizontal with it's frame bolt pivot point. At three inches the adjustment is small, after about 4" of lift the amount you have to adjust changes more and more rapidly, that is one reason after 4" long arms are recommended.
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Unread 09-09-2013, 11:35 PM   #15
billzcat1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tollmtn View Post

Adapter bar and bushing style change, Tollmtn.

I like what you did here. Keep up the good work!
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