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FS: 2007-2013 Jeep Wrangler "HALO" Angel Eye KitROCK BOTTOM prices on LIFT KITS at Rockridge4wd!! WANT TO TeraFlex JK 2/4 Door 2.5" Lift Kit!! DEALS AT ROCKRID

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Unread 03-12-2014, 09:09 PM   #31
ECOBIX
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Do you have audio clips with no mufflers?

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Unread 03-12-2014, 09:15 PM   #32
chartx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbadbru View Post
Hey guys I just wanted to introduce myself. My name is Chris and I am diverB's contact at Banks and the guy that sends him the photos.

Cheers,
Chris
Welcome Chris to the forum. I applaud you guys' effort and time in this project. I want to ask few questions about diesel tuning if that is appropriate.

1- How does DEF in new diesel engines make a difference in tuning? Is it limiting any performance increase?
2- Do you guys achieve any mpg improvements in addition to performance?
3- Did you guys work on Porsche Cayenne diesel before? If so what was the end result? [hmm asking this in Jeep forum can be wrong , but curiosity ]

Thanks!
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Unread 03-12-2014, 09:24 PM   #33
MuSh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECOBIX
Do you have audio clips with no mufflers?
It will sound basically the same as stock. Go disconnect your y pipe and you'll see for yourself. I wasn't thrilled, but it's true. The mufflers don't really have anything to muffle. As it stands, a dpf-back exhaust will be for performance, not sound. I have a video of my exhaust with the entire section removed(y pipe and back) during my magnaflow install. I just need to upload it someday.
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Unread 03-12-2014, 11:52 PM   #34
diverb
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Here's the new reworked Y pipe to accommodate the rear end of the different models
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Unread 03-13-2014, 12:38 AM   #35
bigbadbru
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Oneblue:

In all honesty that first iteration of the exhaust was tight because of me. I was so excited to drive it that I couldn't wait for the fabricator to finish the second y-pipe he was making. That car is just plain awesome and in all honesty either a Diesel Grand or Ram will be my next vehicle. I actually was going to order the Ram and I called my Jeep lady on the Monday after their Friday release and they had sold all 8000 allocated for the initial run to customers. That means dealers have not even been able to order any stock for their lots. It sucks for me but at the same time is awesome!!

Robert:

We are literally neighbors as I live in San Dimas and will absolutely take you up on your offer!

Chartx:

If you don't mind I am going to forward your questions to one of my engineers to answer because in all honesty they are way smarter then me on all things diesel. I will post their response as soon as I have it. As for the Porsche diesel we have not had the chance to have one at the shop but I am sure if the opportunity presents itself we will definitely take a look at it!

Ecobix:

We do sound testing on all of our exhaust so once I have it I will gladly share it with you guys. My personal observation so far is it has a nice gurgle at idol and the sound changes a little when you get on it but I think Mush is correct the change in sound is not like what you get from gassers or diesels with less emissions equipment.

Sorry for replying to everyone on one post but I figured it was the easiest way to answer everyone's questions. However, if individual posts are more appropriate then I will do that next time. On a separate note one of the cool things about working at Banks is I get to drive vehicles long before they come to market. I originally drove the Diesel Grand almost 3 years ago and I knew then it was going to be freaking awesome. The same day I drove the Jeep I drove a European Lancia (Chrysler 300) with the 3.0L in it and I have to tell you it was absolutely ridiculous. As far as I know you can get it in Europe but I don't think it will make it to the states which is a travesty cause it was a rocket ship!

We are just finishing up flow bench testing on the stock system as well as ours and the preliminary results are awesome. My goal is to have a production ready version on Driveb's grand in the next two weeks and will keep you guys posted.

If you guys have any more questions please feel free to let me know. I will do my best to answer them and if I can't I will get them to the guys that can.

Chris
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Unread 03-13-2014, 07:46 AM   #36
Jackal01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbadbru View Post
Oneblue:


Sorry for replying to everyone on one post but I figured it was the easiest way to answer everyone's questions.
That is actually the preferred method to multiple replies!

Also, there is a multi-quote button on the bottom right of each post. It has quotation marks and a plus sign. You click each post you wanna quote then hit the "quote" button and bam...all your posts are in one post to reply to. Makes it super easy.
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Unread 03-13-2014, 10:45 AM   #37
MuSh
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Any timeline on the CAI?
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Unread 03-13-2014, 12:08 PM   #38
diverb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MuSh View Post
Any timeline on the CAI?
Chris from BANKS, will be able to provide you better idea on when it will be available for sale, I do know they are testing one on my vehicle now
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Unread 03-13-2014, 02:31 PM   #39
fun2drive
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Chris and diverb:
This is working out to be a smashing thread. I know once Banks is done with their work I will be looking at their products, the ones that allow me more power with better fuel mileage if possible. tuning my SuperDuty improved my fuel mileage and torque substantially with no reliability issues...
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Unread 03-13-2014, 02:33 PM   #40
NDSU_Bison
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More info on Banks and the VM diesel
http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/1...diesel_engine/

Inside The VM Motori 3.0L V6 Diesel Engine
We Get Inside The First Potential 1/2 Ton Diesel Engine
Text By David Kennedy, Photography by David Kennedy
Diesel Power, August 01, 2012


Read more: http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/1...#ixzz2vsQyrwIR
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Unread 03-13-2014, 04:21 PM   #41
bigbadbru
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1- How does DEF in new diesel engines make a difference in tuning? Is it limiting any performance increase?

Chartx here is the reply from one of my engineers on your question regarding DEF:

"DEF (Diesel Exhaust Fluid) is used as part of the SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) system, where the urea-based DEF is used to aid in the 'breaking down' of oxides of nitrogen (NOx) that are a major combustion byproduct of the diesel compression-ignition process.

High levels of NOx are generally created by high in-cylinder flame front temperatures, a side effect of high cylinder pressure which is most common under high load (high power). When we tune an engine, we're always watching NOx (as well as HC, CO, and CO2) emissions, and we often times will find that there is a finite limit to the extra power that can be created without substantially increasing the emissions. Careful handling (not shutting off, but proper calibration for higher output) of the turbocharger, EGR, and injection control systems allows us to make more power cleanly, without requiring a much higher rate of urea injection to compensate for increased emissions."

I think the gist of it is if done properly you can still get performace and mileage gains with the emissions equipment in place. It just takes more time, patience, and knowledge. I hope this answers your question.

Regards,
Chris
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Unread 03-13-2014, 04:38 PM   #42
bigbadbru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diverb View Post
Chris from BANKS, will be able to provide you better idea on when it will be available for sale, I do know they are testing one on my vehicle now
Mush:

We just finalized the exhuast today on diverb's Grand. In fact I drove it over to pick-up a 14 Raptor that we are doing the exhuast work on and in all honesty I enjoyed driving the Grand way more. The exhuast on the Grand looks awesome and the turbo response is amazingly better especially in gears 1-5. I mean you barley touch the throttle and bam that torque just comes alive. I am going to put the old man (that's what I call Gale) in it for a few days and see if he is ok with everything. If all goes well there will be a production ready exhuast on Diverb's jeep next week.

Now to finally get to your question and I apologize for the aside I am just really excited about this whole project. Next week the Jeep will head over to our race/engineering shop where the guys will digitize the engine bay. Once that is done they will design the CAI in CAD and have several design reviews etc. When everyone is happy including GB we will freeze the design and make a rapid prototype for fitment and flow bench testing. The stock one will get tested during this time as well. We will then run the protype on Diverb's and check it for sound, performace, codes etc. After everyone is happy with all of this and any changes/additions are made it will go to get tooled. Next come first articles, and if all goes well no changes to the tooling and we can start production. I am planning to do the same thing I did with the exhuast and send lots of photos to Diverb and he can post them for everyone. Along the way if anyone has questions I am always willing to do my best to answer them and if I can't I will get the question to someone that can.

Sorry for the long answer to the simple question but hopefully it was helpful.

Regards,
Chris
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Unread 03-13-2014, 04:41 PM   #43
bigbadbru
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Guys I apologize for repeatedly spelling exhaust incorrectly in that last post. That is just embarrassing.
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Unread 03-13-2014, 04:44 PM   #44
chartx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbadbru View Post
1- How does DEF in new diesel engines make a difference in tuning? Is it limiting any performance increase?

Chartx here is the reply from one of my engineers on your question regarding DEF:

"DEF (Diesel Exhaust Fluid) is used as part of the SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) system, where the urea-based DEF is used to aid in the 'breaking down' of oxides of nitrogen (NOx) that are a major combustion byproduct of the diesel compression-ignition process.

High levels of NOx are generally created by high in-cylinder flame front temperatures, a side effect of high cylinder pressure which is most common under high load (high power). When we tune an engine, we're always watching NOx (as well as HC, CO, and CO2) emissions, and we often times will find that there is a finite limit to the extra power that can be created without substantially increasing the emissions. Careful handling (not shutting off, but proper calibration for higher output) of the turbocharger, EGR, and injection control systems allows us to make more power cleanly, without requiring a much higher rate of urea injection to compensate for increased emissions."

I think the gist of it is if done properly you can still get performace and mileage gains with the emissions equipment in place. It just takes more time, patience, and knowledge. I hope this answers your question.

Regards,
Chris
Thanks for the answer ! Finding that sweat spot of performance gains etc with one more constraint shouldn't be any easy job. Mazda is delaying introduction of their diesel engine without DEF for a while already. And rumors is that they have serious issues controlling NOx emissions while providing traditional diesel gains. So I am looking forward to seeing the end result ! Especially the engine dyno graphs.
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Unread 03-13-2014, 07:06 PM   #45
ECOBIX
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So just by removing the mufflers you notice a performance increase with no tuning?

Thanks
Chris
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