[WKDiesel56]

Originally Posted by Thrumcap

The new CRD is not a Mercedes one. It is VM Motori. Hopefully they will have the proper support in place in the US. Coming from BMW, service is my biggest concern.

Yes, I know it is a VM Motori. My fear is you're still going to have dealer support issues because it's a Jeep, it's diesel, and it's someone else's engine. I'm just the voice of someone who has been burned by this before making sure that you all know what could and probably will happen when these become a limited production item again due to poor sales. I lost about $15,000 when I was forced to trade in my ticking time bomb which I had custom ordered and paid a small fortune for.

[danteg]

My sister had a Liberty diesel built by ZvM Motori and IMO it was a POS. It was in the shop getting fixed more than in her possession. The engine received a ton of praise when it was introduced, so many problems. The only good thing was resale was very good, as they gave her a lot toward trade-in. I hope Jeep uses a Fiat diesel for US market.

[rockit]

Chrysler will begin building the diesel version of the Jeep Grand Cherokee at the Jefferson North assembly plant in Detroit early in 2013. That is a long way off 11 months away
http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/

[Hockey37]

Originally Posted by WKDiesel56

.... (plus my 7/70 max care which was the most you could get on a CRD)....

This is quite troubling to me, hopefully this would not be the case with the 2013 models. I was seriously considering the diesel, but if the lifetime max care is not available, then this could be a deal breaker. Especially with a first model year car. I put a lot of miles on my car (06 Envoy, bought new in 9/06 with 200 miles on it. Just turned 174K earlier this week) so the lifetime warranty was something I was going to purchase.

It's stories and insight like those provided by WKDiesel56 that make this site an invaluable tool when looking for a new ride.

[grogie]

Originally Posted by WKDiesel56

Yes, I know it is a VM Motori. My fear is you're still going to have dealer support issues because it's a Jeep, it's diesel, and it's someone else's engine. I'm just the voice of someone who has been burned by this before making sure that you all know what could and probably will happen when these become a limited production item again due to poor sales. I lost about $15,000 when I was forced to trade in my ticking time bomb which I had custom ordered and paid a small fortune for.

Your story is what concerns me... not only having it serviced by someone that can, but being able to get it serviced in the first place. What a shame as I looked at them and wanted one.

I grew up when diesels were big in the late 70s. My dad had a Peugeot wagon that was actually a nice car, except for the POS diesel that was always having problems, and a real pain to get anyone to work on it. I remember several times that it sat at a GM car dealer in some small town waiting for parts and then for someone to figure out how to fix it while we would rent a car and come back a week or two later to pick it up. A third time it sat for a month at another shop. Then a year later at 100,000 miles it looked almost new, but dad it hauled to the junk yard. Sad, as I started to drive that car and it was rather fun. Like a little truck!

[diver110]

I have heard similar stories about Jeep diesels. There is a whole web site devoted to Jeep diesels, though I have forgotten the name. I checked there a while back when I was thinking about buying a Liberty diesel. There advice: Work on it yourself or don't buy it. I also wonder how much of a premium there will be for the diesel engine. For trucks, the mpg increase is usually not worth it unless you are hauling a lot of weight. In any event, on further reflection, no near-term diesel for me. Too much risk. If they become established, different story.

[danteg]

My guess $3,500 premium and the incentives won't apply, so today would be about $5,500 more. At that premium I think I would be out!

[WKDiesel56]

Originally Posted by danteg

My guess $3,500 premium and the incentives won't apply, so today would be about $5,500 more. At that premium I think I would be out!

Forgive me as it has been almost 5 years and I have slept a few times since then but the diesel option in the 2007 was around $4,000 and only available on the Limited and Overland. This was because when you got the diesel you got a package with Quadra Drive II, UConnect, Park Assist and a bunch of other things (I think) that were not standard features at the time. In 2008 they made the diesel available in the Laredo and reduced the cost of the option, took away standard features, etc.

[scottmacmoyle]

just signed up to this forum for this reason. I currently drive a 2007 Mercedes ML320 CDI. same engine as the Jeep from that year. The engine seems to be good. Just turned 100,000 miles. I wont be buying another Mercedes though. Its a good car but you are paying a premium for a great car. I want to find out as much as I can about the WK and the VM Motori diesel. I figure if I monitor this forum for a year I should be able to make an educated decision when the time comes.

Scott

[NDSU_Bison]

Bump. Any idea when the 2013 model year will hit the dealer lots?

[JG1025]

Is it going to be a clean diesel? I had a diesel Audi before the Jeep and I loved everything about it. I'd still be wary about buying a Jeep with a diesel engine that wasn't designed in-house.

[NDSU_Bison]

I didn't see an earlier post that said they might be shipping in early 2013. As for clean diesels, the 2007/2008 models use a particulate filter to trap soot and burn it off at very high temps every so often. They still give off too many nitrates to meet requirements in California and some of the New England states.

The new oil burners will have more horsepower and torque than the Mercedes 3.0 liter. As for me, I prefer the low end torque over the high end horsepower of the Hemi.

[padgett]

First diesel I worked on was a Mercedes 200D and it was the filthiest engine I ever saw. In counterpoint the Steyr diesel in my Vixen is very clean and has lots of torque from 2.4 liters to move my 6300 lb RV.

Yes, they take somone who understands injection pumps and interference engines but is no big as long as care is taken in setting the timing (injection and cam).

Do strongly believe the secret in longetivity, power, & mpg is running an engine a tad cooler and keeping it that way. Part of the problem with a diesel and particularly an alloy diesel is that under continuous high load conditions, temperatures, particularly EGT, will skyrocket, it is part of their nature particularly with boost. Yes, they can give enormous amounts of torque - over 400 lb-ft from a three liter, but that requires a lot of cooling as well. Secret is to use max boost for no more than a minute or two but for long term back it off to about half of peak: if it makes 14 psi of boost, long term better be below 7. If on a long grade it is better to downshift and go slower than try to push it in a higher gear.

Most of the problems with diesels that I have seen could be cured with a FBW injection timing that was limited by EGT, something only true believers bother about. If cannot fit EGT then a cyl head temp guage comes close. The normal coolant temp gauge is not good for much since long before the coolant has gotten high the head may reshape itself and that gets expensive.

Yes, to properly work on a diesel will require special tools such as a timing meter that senses injector pulses rather than spark to a plug which it does not have. Yes, doing it right is different (but not really harder) than the same on most gas engines. Sounds like an opportunity to me.

One of these is a turbo diesel.

[Thrumcap]

Originally Posted by NDSU_Bison

Bump. Any idea when the 2013 model year will hit the dealer lots?

There isn't going to be a 2013 CRD. It will be a 2014 model introduced in early 2013. It will be the first WK2 to have the mid cycle refresh including the 8 speed transmission.

[NDSU_Bison]

I doubt many jeeps run under "continuous" high load conditions. Other than climbing a very steep grade in the mountains pulling a 5,000 lb camper, I've probably never driven at more than 3/4 throttle for more than 30 seconds at a time. Wouldn't these same conditions also be harder on a gasser? I know the turbo adds complexity so I'm not saying it's as simple to maintain as a gasser.

If they don't come out until spring or summer of next year, I've got some extra time to save my money.