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Unread 04-23-2013, 07:31 AM   #46
jacko15
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I think it's been said before, but I'd like to bring it up again. The V6 steers a little lighter, and responds a little quicker to the wheel. I noticed this very much as I test drove back and forth between the V6 and V8. Maybe the word wouldn't be peppier, but more sprightly. The V6 seemed lighter on its feet, so to speak. This probably has a lot to do with replacing all that heavy iron with aluminum under the hood. Not needing the raw power of the V8, the V6 was much more to my tastes for handling in the city. My son tows a 25' Airstream, and he sold his V6 4 Runner because it wouldn't handle it on the hills, but his V8 Tundra hauls it with no problem. (My apologies to the folks at JNAP for my son's tastes in vehicles, I tried to raise him right!) But he admits the V6 was easier to drive around town. So having said that, there are reasons to like the V6 and prefer it over the V8. Of course some folks have the need to have the most powerful, or the fastest, or the biggest, and that's fine.You just need to decide what will fit your own personal needs the best. For me , it was the V6.

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Unread 04-23-2013, 07:40 AM   #47
gabbagabba
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No doubt if you do frequent heavy duty towing the hemi is the way to go, I think the point being made is that given that the GC is a mid-sized SUV, it should be somewhat of a rocket with a good 'modern' V8, and when you drive a pentastar and hemi back to back, the hemi is not much quicker at all.

The point being made with regard to 'modern' v8's is that a lot of other car companies get a lot more out of that size of an engine, europeans (a la top gear UK) like to make fun of the pedestrian numbers re: hp and torque that large displacement US V8's get. Granted these are usually in terms of sports cars not trucks.

The mpg difference is not 2 mpg

Best of both worlds would be a diesel avail in all trims as a lower cost, seperate, upgrade. Towing + mpg + probably quick
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Unread 04-23-2013, 08:55 AM   #48
WvTaco
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shekshishekki View Post
Again...how de hell are some of you getting 27mpg or even 20 in the city?!?! Are you doing your calculations right?!?! is there something wrong with your evic?
everything done by hand. 63-65 mpg highway speeds.
city i like coast down hills and drive like i dont have brakes.

thats the end of 50 mile drive from the dealership. all speed limit, on a great no traffic day.
a few tanks i forgot to log.
http://ecomodder.com/forum/em-fuel-l...vehicleid=4789
but like i said i do really well my wife dont.

but if i towed mt 16 foot trailer with my atvs more i would of got the v8, but i dont so i got the v6. hell my 09 trd sprort 4x4 tacoma was better at towing my trailer, but it would struggle to get 22 mpg and it was qiucker to 60mph than the 5.7 hemi...

i also refuse to buy a auto that get under 20 highway,when i got my wk2 hemi was rated at 19.

different need for different people.


60 hp=/= 100 hp.
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Unread 04-23-2013, 02:34 PM   #49
illflo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacko15 View Post
I think it's been said before, but I'd like to bring it up again. The V6 steers a little lighter, and responds a little quicker to the wheel. I noticed this very much as I test drove back and forth between the V6 and V8. Maybe the word wouldn't be peppier, but more sprightly. The V6 seemed lighter on its feet, so to speak. This probably has a lot to do with replacing all that heavy iron with aluminum under the hood. Not needing the raw power of the V8, the V6 was much more to my tastes for handling in the city. My son tows a 25' Airstream, and he sold his V6 4 Runner because it wouldn't handle it on the hills, but his V8 Tundra hauls it with no problem. (My apologies to the folks at JNAP for my son's tastes in vehicles, I tried to raise him right!) But he admits the V6 was easier to drive around town. So having said that, there are reasons to like the V6 and prefer it over the V8. Of course some folks have the need to have the most powerful, or the fastest, or the biggest, and that's fine.You just need to decide what will fit your own personal needs the best. For me , it was the V6.
Precisely my experience when test driving the V6 and V8.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 02:43 AM   #50
KickRocks
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Originally Posted by illflo View Post
Sure, 100 HP less but also less weight. The hemi felt like a dog me compared to the V8 in my pickup. For, you maybe the V8 and V6 were comparable. It's all about what you like and what your needs are. As for the price tag: On the used market there was a marginal difference in my experience.

I test-drove a WK2 hemi, my dad's WK2 V6, and of course my pickup for an entire day in normal traffic doing all the things I normally did to try and get a real world MPG reading for me. I reset the MPG on all three and got 14 on the pickup, 15 in the Hemi, 19 in the V6. So for me, the V6 was an easy choice because of city MPG and my driving style. Plus, I have a one-ton work truck so it wasn't as important to have the extra power to tow. Admittedly, some folks do really well with the V8 in terms of MPG.

My point was merely that different engines are more appropriate for different purposes and driving styles. But to say that one engine is somehow 'worse' than another is a purely subjective analysis (and I saw this claim earlier in the thread). The V6 is 'better', for some people. The V8 is 'better' for others. Of course, they don't compare for towing.

To say the hemi is 'better' for off-roading or 'better' more generally is not only just an opinion, but misleading to the OP. (I had read this in an earlier post as well) What I was trying to say to him was: drive both. Think about your needs. They are both great engines. Everybody's got an opinion. I love my V6. Pulls all I need it too (single axle trailer with firewood) Lots of people love their V8. You'll drive them and instantly like one better than another. If not, do some research and think about your needs and make an informed decision.
Watched and read at least 20 different test and reviews for 2011-13 JGC Overlands...and not *1* recommended the V6 over the V8. Every single one says go for the Hemi... you would think if the V6 was that great there would be sprinkling of reviews saying to get the V6 etc. This just isn't the case. I think V6 buyers are justifying their purchase...and really, no need to. It's funny reading people saying their jeep is as "peppy" as a V8 even though they have 60-80HP less. Their "Butt-Dyno's" are a tad bit off... Bottom line, the only thing the V6 does better is MPG..and it's not enough to brag about. Next road trip on a flat road I"ll see what I can do in the Hemi, I've already seen 22 MPG on some pretty hilly road. I'm pretty confidant I can hit 24 or so. So even the best post of 27 MPG isn't that much more. If you guys were hitting 30+ i'd say that's something to raise an eyebrow at. You're not.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 02:48 AM   #51
KickRocks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacko15 View Post
I think it's been said before, but I'd like to bring it up again. The V6 steers a little lighter, and responds a little quicker to the wheel. I noticed this very much as I test drove back and forth between the V6 and V8. Maybe the word wouldn't be peppier, but more sprightly. The V6 seemed lighter on its feet, so to speak. This probably has a lot to do with replacing all that heavy iron with aluminum under the hood. Not needing the raw power of the V8, the V6 was much more to my tastes for handling in the city. My son tows a 25' Airstream, and he sold his V6 4 Runner because it wouldn't handle it on the hills, but his V8 Tundra hauls it with no problem. (My apologies to the folks at JNAP for my son's tastes in vehicles, I tried to raise him right!) But he admits the V6 was easier to drive around town. So having said that, there are reasons to like the V6 and prefer it over the V8. Of course some folks have the need to have the most powerful, or the fastest, or the biggest, and that's fine.You just need to decide what will fit your own personal needs the best. For me , it was the V6.
LOL.. "Feels" is not an accurate measurement by any means. The fact is, test prove the V8 and V6 are identical in all the things you mention accept acceleration test, climbing power, Towing etc (anything more HP will help)

The "Lighter feeling" is your imagination.. the 200lbs difference in Engine weights isn't going to be something you'd notice in an SUV. If you were racing a ricer civic in a 1/4 you might see a 1/10 of a second faster time with that weight difference.. on a 5000lb SUV impossible to notice.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 02:49 AM   #52
KickRocks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WvTaco View Post
everything done by hand. 63-65 mpg highway speeds.
city i like coast down hills and drive like i dont have brakes.

thats the end of 50 mile drive from the dealership. all speed limit, on a great no traffic day.
a few tanks i forgot to log.
http://ecomodder.com/forum/em-fuel-l...vehicleid=4789
but like i said i do really well my wife dont.

but if i towed mt 16 foot trailer with my atvs more i would of got the v8, but i dont so i got the v6. hell my 09 trd sprort 4x4 tacoma was better at towing my trailer, but it would struggle to get 22 mpg and it was qiucker to 60mph than the 5.7 hemi...

i also refuse to buy a auto that get under 20 highway,when i got my wk2 hemi was rated at 19.

different need for different people.


60 hp=/= 100 hp.
My 2013 WK has already seen 22 mpg highway going up and down a lot of hills... So, don't believe all you read.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 06:08 AM   #53
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Regardless what you V6 fans say.. numbers don't lie. It's NOT "Peppier"

2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland (V-8) 0-60 mph 6.9 Quarter Mile 15.3

2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (V-6) 0-60 mph 8.0 Quarter Mile 16.2


Even the new Diesel has more Go

2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4X4 Eco Diesel 0-60 mph 7.7
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Unread 04-24-2013, 06:12 AM   #54
jacko15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KickRocks View Post
LOL.. "Feels" is not an accurate measurement by any means. The fact is, test prove the V8 and V6 are identical in all the things you mention accept acceleration test, climbing power, Towing etc (anything more HP will help)

The "Lighter feeling" is your imagination.. the 200lbs difference in Engine weights isn't going to be something you'd notice in an SUV. If you were racing a ricer civic in a 1/4 you might see a 1/10 of a second faster time with that weight difference.. on a 5000lb SUV impossible to notice.
As much as you'd like me to feel bad about my V6, it just ain't gonna happen. If you can't live without a V8, that's fine. Enjoy your ride. Enjoy changing all those spark plugs every 30k miles, enjoy the extra initial cost, enjoy blowing civics off the road. But your bashing of the V6 isn't going to diminish my enjoyment of my vehicle. If I "feel" like my V6 is a "peppy', fun way to get around, that is how I'll "feel". Bash away, drive, and enjoy your V8, I'll be enjoying my V6 no matter what kind of numbers you throw at me. The thread is about "how good an engine is the V6". It's a damn good engine that many folks have bought and are enjoying. Why don't you live and let live. I don't really understand your uber negative attitude. By the way "Feels" is a very accurate measurement of how much someone is enjoying their experience. And I'm beginning to "feel" like I'm tired of your constant negativity.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 06:16 AM   #55
KickRocks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacko15 View Post
As much as you'd like me to feel bad about my V6, it just ain't gonna happen. If you can't live without a V8, that's fine. Enjoy your ride. Enjoy changing all those spark plugs every 30k miles, enjoy the extra initial cost, enjoy blowing civics off the road. But your bashing of the V6 isn't going to diminish my enjoyment of my vehicle. If I "feel" like my V6 is a "peppy', fun way to get around, that is how I'll "feel". Bash away, drive, and enjoy your V8, I'll be enjoying my V6 no matter what kind of numbers you throw at me. The thread is about "how good an engine is the V6". It's a damn good engine that many folks have bought and are enjoying. Why don't you live and let live. I don't really understand your uber negative attitude. By the way "Feels" is a very accurate measurement of how much someone is enjoying their experience. And I'm beginning to "feel" like I'm tired of your constant negativity.
A: I never bashed the V6 .. Only defended the V8 from people giving Mis-information about the V8 (Rediculous claims at that)

B: Spark plug changes don't scare me.. I'm a man.

C: What do civics have to do with this conversation at all?

D:I paid less for my V8 overland than you did your V6 ..and got MaxCare thrown in


Live and let live? It's called a discussion.. Let me guess, you're one of those people that have a discussion until the other person makes good points then it's an argument.. Right? LOL
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Unread 04-24-2013, 06:37 AM   #56
illflo
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Originally Posted by KickRocks View Post
Watched and read at least 20 different test and reviews for 2011-13 JGC Overlands...and not *1* recommended the V6 over the V8. Every single one says go for the Hemi... you would think if the V6 was that great there would be sprinkling of reviews saying to get the V6 etc. This just isn't the case. I think V6 buyers are justifying their purchase...and really, no need to. It's funny reading people saying their jeep is as "peppy" as a V8 even though they have 60-80HP less. Their "Butt-Dyno's" are a tad bit off... Bottom line, the only thing the V6 does better is MPG..and it's not enough to brag about. Next road trip on a flat road I"ll see what I can do in the Hemi, I've already seen 22 MPG on some pretty hilly road. I'm pretty confidant I can hit 24 or so. So even the best post of 27 MPG isn't that much more. If you guys were hitting 30+ i'd say that's something to raise an eyebrow at. You're not.
Right: But the 'Butt Dyno' is all that matters. If it does what I want, gets me where I need to go, pulls what I want, and does the things I need it to, then it's a 10/10. IME, and that's the important part because everybody has a different experience, the V6 seemed more nimble. It's geared differently and I preferred it. That's the only claim I was making. But posts like yours are misleading. There is absolutely no reason to get a V8 unless you need the extra HP. You're implying the V8 is somehow superior. I understand that some folks do well in their Hemis and love them. I understand they are great engines. If you are happy then that's all that should matter to you.

But your opinion does not make the engine objectively superior. I respect your opinion, and if you are happy with the V8, then that's awesome. The engine itself is a wonderful engineering marvel. My issue is with claims by posters that suggest because they have had a good experience, the V8 or the V6 for that matter is objectively superior. There is no such thing as objective superiority in these cases. HP, MPG, etc. are all parts of the things that should be considered, but ultimately it's all about what you need, what you like, and what experience you have had.

I'm thrilled with my V6. That's just my opinion. I'm not making claims about the superiority of the engine. My experience, and that's all it was, was that the hemi was a dog of a V8 compared to the V8 in my Silverado. The V6's steering and agility was more comparable to the pickup, IMO. But it's my opinion. And you're free to disagree with it. Just acknowledge that, in doing so, you are presenting your opinion. And acknowledge that we probably aren't going to come to an agreement. There's no need to be combative. I'm not attacking the V8. I'm just attacking the assertion that the V8 is an objectively better engine. Each engine is better at some things and worse at others.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 07:11 AM   #57
gabbagabba
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Originally Posted by KickRocks View Post
Regardless what you V6 fans say.. numbers don't lie. It's NOT "Peppier"

2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland (V-8) 0-60 mph 6.9 Quarter Mile 15.3

2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (V-6) 0-60 mph 8.0 Quarter Mile 16.2


Even the new Diesel has more Go

2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4X4 Eco Diesel 0-60 mph 7.7
I'm not sure < 1 sec diff on the 1/4 mile really helps your claim

http://www.cars.com/dodge/durango/2013/expert-reviews/

The review above is what every review I have read says about the hemi. As a DD it is not much better, buy it if towing, not for fun or performance.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 07:24 AM   #58
Kev M
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KR - why do you have such a hard-on for the V6?

JEEEZZZZ

I can't speak to the V8 as we don't have one.

I test drove it, and we felt no need for it.

Our towing needs are well covered by the V6.

Our mileage is dramatically better than reported by the V8s.

Service seems to be well thought out/easier on the V6. I can change a motor as well as change spark plugs, but I have no desire to do either anytime soon. I'd rather spend my time riding our motorcycles than wrenching on our Jeep.

YMMV so test drive one and see what you want, but I have absolutely no complaints about the V6.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 08:11 PM   #59
KickRocks
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Originally Posted by illflo View Post
Right: But the 'Butt Dyno' is all that matters. If it does what I want, gets me where I need to go, pulls what I want, and does the things I need it to, then it's a 10/10. IME, and that's the important part because everybody has a different experience, the V6 seemed more nimble. It's geared differently and I preferred it. That's the only claim I was making. But posts like yours are misleading. There is absolutely no reason to get a V8 unless you need the extra HP. You're implying the V8 is somehow superior. I understand that some folks do well in their Hemis and love them. I understand they are great engines. If you are happy then that's all that should matter to you.

But your opinion does not make the engine objectively superior. I respect your opinion, and if you are happy with the V8, then that's awesome. The engine itself is a wonderful engineering marvel. My issue is with claims by posters that suggest because they have had a good experience, the V8 or the V6 for that matter is objectively superior. There is no such thing as objective superiority in these cases. HP, MPG, etc. are all parts of the things that should be considered, but ultimately it's all about what you need, what you like, and what experience you have had.

I'm thrilled with my V6. That's just my opinion. I'm not making claims about the superiority of the engine. My experience, and that's all it was, was that the hemi was a dog of a V8 compared to the V8 in my Silverado. The V6's steering and agility was more comparable to the pickup, IMO. But it's my opinion. And you're free to disagree with it. Just acknowledge that, in doing so, you are presenting your opinion. And acknowledge that we probably aren't going to come to an agreement. There's no need to be combative. I'm not attacking the V8. I'm just attacking the assertion that the V8 is an objectively better engine. Each engine is better at some things and worse at others.
My points are facts...actual numbers, not opinions. Saying something "Feels peppier" is an opinion. What makes the "V8" better? It's established, proven reliable. It's faster, it's more powerful. There's nothing "Better" about the V6 outside of MPG.. but not by much. ill be posting a vid soon for all you V6 folks bragging about MPG.
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Unread 04-24-2013, 08:12 PM   #60
KickRocks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabbagabba View Post
I'm not sure < 1 sec diff on the 1/4 mile really helps your claim

http://www.cars.com/dodge/durango/2013/expert-reviews/

The review above is what every review I have read says about the hemi. As a DD it is not much better, buy it if towing, not for fun or performance.
You're right, and their right.. because whe someone wants performance they go less horsepower. LOL

A full second difference in acceleration is a lot. Car brands spend millions for that 1 second.. and in a vehicle this heavy it takes quite a bit of power increase to get that 1 second. The fact the Hemi can cover a 1/4 in a full second faster and do it getting only a few MPG less and can tow over 2000lbs more that's pretty amazing.
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