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Unread 10-27-2012, 11:00 AM   #46
bitters
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The only reason I would get a diesel would be to save money over the gas version and I don't think the diesel can do that. At this point, the gasoline V6 Limited is at the top of my list.

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Unread 10-27-2012, 11:36 AM   #47
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Yeah, when I purchased my last diesel, diesel fuel was near a $1 less per gallon than gas and the mpg improvement over gas was near 25%. Didn't take more than 90,000 miles to cover the buy in cost. Things have changed since 2006, however. Currently Diesel in this area is 50 cents more than gas. If you don't have an issue, the diesel will run for a long long time with only relatively expensive oil changes. But, if unlucky, maintenance and repair costs is through the roof. If you were unlucky enough to have an injector leak a bit, which is too common, that could ruin a cylinder and piston before you notice. You can buy three new V6s for that repair cost. Many replace injectors as part of routine maintenance at about 100,000 miles, at roughly $200 each (rebuild).

Most of the time you may break even, so drive what you like or need. A diesel engine problem is just going to be much more painful than a gas engine problem.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 12:33 PM   #48
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Heck, my class A RV can do 600 miles and it only has a 21 gallon tank. Would not want to drive that long without a rest stop or two though.

Recall in the first fuel crisis a few mfrs installed bigger tanks and started touting range (not cost).

Do agree that small diesels in the USA are only about a decade late.
/rant


One of these is a turbo diesel.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 08:13 PM   #49
scootr29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave2002ti View Post
Maybe you need to become better informed and stop just looking at the purdy pictures. Fine and very fine particulant matter emitted by diesels causes cancer. Google is wonderful tool hoss. Sorry dont like inhaling soot
from some bubba's modified pick up that is generating massive clouds of chokingblack smoke. A ti doesnt generate blinding and cancer causing soot.

Sorry reading makes you tired but a diesel powered GC is going to take years to pay you back based on the increase in mpg.

If you dont like my posts dont read them bubba. I like both clean air and performance and right now you can have both out of a gas pwered or diesel powered vehicle. I used to run Weber carbs etc but with a modern FI system I get better performance, driveability and significantly less pollution.
If you cant afford both clean air and performance save your your money from your Wla amrt job until you can afford both. It can be done.
I wonder how much benzene and MTBE you have inhaled while driving around your little 2002ti...

The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA is currently reviewing MTBE.

The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA classifies diesel exhaust as "likely to be carcinogenic to humans."

The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA classifies benzene as a known human carcinogen.

And just to make your head explode....if you think diesel exhaust is bad...please whatever you do...DO NOT read up on Radon, especially if you are typing this from your basement.....


So in closing....on the cancer.org site 2 out of the 5 pollution carcinogens are related specifically to gasoline.
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Unread 10-28-2012, 06:24 PM   #50
Jason911
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdCase View Post
Yeah, when I purchased my last diesel, diesel fuel was near a $1 less per gallon than gas and the mpg improvement over gas was near 25%. Didn't take more than 90,000 miles to cover the buy in cost. Things have changed since 2006, however. Currently Diesel in this area is 50 cents more than gas. If you don't have an issue, the diesel will run for a long long time with only relatively expensive oil changes. But, if unlucky, maintenance and repair costs is through the roof. If you were unlucky enough to have an injector leak a bit, which is too common, that could ruin a cylinder and piston before you notice. You can buy three new V6s for that repair cost. Many replace injectors as part of routine maintenance at about 100,000 miles, at roughly $200 each (rebuild).

Most of the time you may break even, so drive what you like or need. A diesel engine problem is just going to be much more painful than a gas engine problem.
One would guess that I am asking for trouble to quote up against a moderator, but I really have to take odds with the above comments - Being a owner of a previous generation WK CRD, I pay a relatively paltry fee of $78.34 for my oil change(do it myself, change it ONCE a year) of which the price is 10 liters of oil and filter and shipping(from Germany no less). What other maintence costs are there? I've seen this same motor go for 250k in the Sprinter before problems arose. And although I would agree that fuel is higher priced - $0.53/per gallon more than 87 octane, the mileage benefit outweighs this handily. My city mileage is eqivilant to a v6 WK2 highway mileage, and it's nearly 5 years older? Speculation at this point as to the cost of the forthcoming new(to the US) 3.0 CRD engine option, but if its anything like our friends from down under (same price as the hemi option) the benefits will far outweigh the costs short and long term. Different thoughts, from a different soapbox.
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Unread 10-28-2012, 06:38 PM   #51
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Have heard the diesel option will be in the $5500 range while talking with folks about Jeeps return to producing vehicles in China. It was proposed that given the numbers that could be done out of a plant in China the diesel option here could go down significantly in the future. Speculation mostly but $1500 came up a few times.
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Unread 10-28-2012, 07:45 PM   #52
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That would be a shame for it to be built in China. Deutzland? sure. Italia? Sure. iPad factory? No. I'll just keep driving my old Cleveland/Italian JK hybrid.

I hope they don't sell out but I do recognize I would be in a minority.
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Unread 10-28-2012, 08:00 PM   #53
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Sorry I must have wrote that wrong. Jeep might open a new factory in China for overseas production. None of those jeeps will be sold here. They will be for the overseas market. Basically I was told that building Jeeps in China would allow for lower priced options/vehicles here. The whole Jeep lineup will still be produced here.
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Unread 10-28-2012, 08:55 PM   #54
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Just two points:
1) The proposed GC CRD for '14 is not the engine that is in the Sprinter, 3.0 TDs are produced by and for everyone including Jaguar these days.

2) CJF may build all models of Jeep in China but will not build all Jeeps in China. It is certainly possible that they will source engines locally but the USA has special emissions laws.

And as a side note, in Mexico the Sprinter is available with a M-B V12. That must be an interesting combination (or may be needed to haul the armor around).

ps Interesting, the $5500 over the V6 was the WAG some time ago.


One of these is a turbo diesel.
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Unread 10-29-2012, 06:25 AM   #55
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technically

Quote:
Originally Posted by boilermaker2 View Post
That would be a shame for it to be built in China. Deutzland? sure. Italia? Sure. iPad factory? No. I'll just keep driving my old Cleveland/Italian JK hybrid.

I hope they don't sell out but I do recognize I would be in a minority.
B2
technically, they already make jeeps in china, just not by Chrysler. I've actually seen the factory and the product it puts out (this was back in 1997 even)..the same factory also made Audi 100's.
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Unread 10-29-2012, 01:06 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by bitters View Post
The only reason I would get a diesel would be to save money over the gas version and I don't think the diesel can do that. At this point, the gasoline V6 Limited is at the top of my list.
That's exactly what we've got, and we love it.

That said, we tend to get about 19 mpg in mixed/around town usage and about 22-23 mpg on the highway (at 70-80 mph). We could probably squeak out 24 maybe even 25 on the highway at more moderate speeds.

That said, if the Diesel was available there's a decent chance we would have gone for it.
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Unread 10-29-2012, 06:42 PM   #57
boilermaker2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tivoboy

technically, they already make jeeps in china, just not by Chrysler. I've actually seen the factory and the product it puts out (this was back in 1997 even)..the same factory also made Audi 100's.
I appreciate what you're saying. Jeeps were even made in India during the war effort. My point was I really don't want have one of their power plants under my hood. Sure as he** am not going pay a premium to them.
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Unread 10-30-2012, 03:18 AM   #58
Robert J. yates
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Originally Posted by Kev M View Post
That's exactly what we've got, and we love it.

That said, we tend to get about 19 mpg in mixed/around town usage and about 22-23 mpg on the highway (at 70-80 mph). We could probably squeak out 24 maybe even 25 on the highway at more moderate speeds.

That said, if the Diesel was available there's a decent chance we would have gone for it.
If you never plan to tow anything, the v6 is fine.... That changes once you decide to pull a boat or a trailer and that is where the diesel excels. The diesel also excels if you rack up serious mileage.
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Unread 10-30-2012, 03:19 AM   #59
Robert J. yates
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Originally Posted by scootr29 View Post
I wonder how much benzene and MTBE you have inhaled while driving around your little 2002ti...

The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA is currently reviewing MTBE.

The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA classifies diesel exhaust as "likely to be carcinogenic to humans."

The US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) maintains the Integrated Risk Information System (IRIS), an electronic database that contains information on human health effects from exposure to various substances in the environment. The EPA classifies benzene as a known human carcinogen.

And just to make your head explode....if you think diesel exhaust is bad...please whatever you do...DO NOT read up on Radon, especially if you are typing this from your basement.....


So in closing....on the cancer.org site 2 out of the 5 pollution carcinogens are related specifically to gasoline.
That ought to wind him up LOL
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Unread 10-30-2012, 07:38 AM   #60
NDSU_Bison
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We have around 112,000 miles on our 2008 WK with the Mercedes CRD engine and will probably buy one of the new diesels next year. If I remember when I'm at home,

Edit -- the window sticker on our Jeep says the diesel option cost $1,010 on the Overland trim that came standard with the hemi.
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