[4Factor]

Ok, if you've been following my story so far about getting mis-handled by one dealership and having to go to another, wait'll ya hear the latest.

dealer #1 (the bad guy)
dealer #2 (the good guy)

I went to see the sales manager for dealer #1. I told him I'd like to cancel the deal, which he indicated he was aware of already (my file was the only one on his desk!). He asked why I want to cancel it, and I replied "because you told me you couldn't get me the vehicle you wanted". He countered with "I've never said that" (which is true) so I corrected... "Your sales representative told me you couldn't find the vehicle I wanted" and he agreed (yeah here he goes being a dick already!). So I ask for my $500 deposit back and he says "we don't give back deposits". So after a bit of low key talking, I asked him if he expected me to walk away from $500 and he said "no, I'll get you a vehicle." I asked how he would get me an '04 Liberty with my options since his sales representative said he couldn't. He indicated he's going to get me an '05 if he can't find an '04. I told him I didn't want an '05, it's totally redisigned and I'm not buying one sight-unseen. He wanted to know where I got my information that it has been re-designed and I told him it's everywhere in the media and on the internet (he indicated those aren't reliable sources). I continued by informing him it doesn't say that on the contract that I am obliged to accept an '05, and he asked me if I was quoting law to him or if I got that off the internet too (yep, he's being a real dick now). I stopped, and again asked if I could have my $500 back. He said "there is no way you are getting that $500 back" So I stood up, informed him that it doesn't appear that we can do business but maybe OMVIC can (as I pointed to his "OMVIC certified member" plaque on the wall)! As I walked away he lept out of his chair and took a few steps after me shouting "don't you come in here and threaten me.. don't you threaten me in my place of business". I kept walking didn't look back and didn't say another word, I figure his actions spoke loudly enough to the other customers in the show room!

OMVIC is an industry council that oversees disputes like this. I called them and they said the dealer has 90 days to deliver the vehicle or refund the money (it's been 27 days). If they deliver it, I'm obligated to take it. So although I've purchased a vehicle at dealer #2, I may have just bought myself two vehicles, if dealer #1 can deliver one. I asked if I was obligated to take ANYTHING else and they said no (OMVIC asked if I had put down any secondary choices like colour etc... nope). So the dealer has 63 days to come up with the exact vehicle or refund the money, but they CANNOT keep the money if they do not produce a vehicle. It favours me right now because the vehicle on the order form is not available ANYWHERE in Canada. The 3 I found in BC (and was willing to accept) had extra options and technically aren't what I ordered, so even if they bring in one of those, I'm still not obligated to take it.

So what I need now is a VIN decoder for the Liberty.
I have a feeling dealer #1 might take one of their vehicles on the lot and frakenstein it into the vehicle I wanted. If they try that, the VIN decoder should uncover this fraud.

Whew what a morning, and what a difficult time I've had with this dealer! When my lawyer gets back from vacation I might just have to pay him a visit and see if he can apply any leverage.

Story finishes over in this thread

[indypacknet]

I think it would be a good idea to publish the name of the Evil Dealer, along with a telephone number and email address, if available. All KJ owners who read this forum could send a simple email saying "We know you suck. Repay the man's deposit and we'll take you off the forum blacklist."

Seriously - I hear stories about great dealers, and real a$$ holes. We should have a sticky for the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly with dealers - who keeps comittments, who honors warranties, etc.

Jeep is driven by people who drive Jeeps. I think we would be doing all KJ owners a service by maintaining such a registry.

[4Factor]

Originally Posted by indypacknet

I think it would be a good idea to publish the name of the Evil Dealer, along with a telephone number and email address, if available. All KJ owners who read this forum could send a simple email saying "We know you suck. Repay the man's deposit and we'll take you off the forum blacklist."

Seriously - I hear stories about great dealers, and real a$$ holes. We should have a sticky for the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly with dealers - who keeps comittments, who honors warranties, etc.

Jeep is driven by people who drive Jeeps. I think we would be doing all KJ owners a service by maintaining such a registry.

I cannot afford a slander lawsuit. That's one I'd surely lose.

[sexyliberty]

That is such bull crap that they there are people out there like that. I know that those sales peeps live off of every car they sell but come on. customer service has to be the first and most important rule!!!!! I have never had that happen to me before but when I was shopping around for my jeep, I pulled into this jeep lot and before I could even put the car I was in in park, there were 3 salespeople knocking on my car window.

Well, i think that you need to post this dealership's information. That way everyone will know!!!!

[indypacknet]

Originally Posted by 4Factor

I cannot afford a slander lawsuit. That's one I'd surely lose.

State the facts, then qualify your opinion as such. Opinion's are not slander - they are Free Speech.

[4Factor]

Originally Posted by indypacknet

State the facts, then qualify your opinion as such. Opinion's are not slander - they are Free Speech.

Heh heh, yeah I guess that's true. If i state is as

"it is my opinion that dealer#1 is not very nice..."

then I guess I could without it being construed as slander. Lemme get my $500 back first and I'll post up the info! (63 days left until the 90 day term expires, then they HAVE to give me my money!) Don't worry, I won't forget to post the information. Just like I wont forget to have fun with my new Liberty after I get it (which has now been moved up from next Friday to next Thursday... 8 days 4 hrs.!)

When I get my money back, I'm going to post a little summary on Neoncanada and possibly Jeepkings. I figure, that in itself will be enough revenge for me. Maybe I can affect the choices of at least the members that are local to this dealership (which might even be 100+ people, us neon guys have a huge following in Kitchener!)

[valvestem]

1st I hope you get your money back, 2nd I hope you do not do business with this dealer again, 3rd do you have the equivalent of the Better Business Bureau? If you do not get your money back, I suggest revenge. I have followed this course in the past as a last resort, and it made feel better. I believe one of the US state flags says it best, "Don't Tread On Me"

Originally Posted by 4Factor

Heh heh, yeah I guess that's true. If i state is as

"it is my opinion that dealer#1 is not very nice..."

then I guess I could without it being construed as slander. Lemme get my $500 back first and I'll post up the info! (63 days left until the 90 day term expires, then they HAVE to give me my money!) Don't worry, I won't forget to post the information. Just like I wont forget to have fun with my new Liberty after I get it (which has now been moved up from next Friday to next Thursday... 8 days 4 hrs.!)

When I get my money back, I'm going to post a little summary on Neoncanada and possibly Jeepkings. I figure, that in itself will be enough revenge for me. Maybe I can affect the choices of at least the members that are local to this dealership (which might even be 100+ people, us neon guys have a huge following in Kitchener!)

[indypacknet]

Originally Posted by valvestem

I believe one of the US state flags says it best, "Don't Tread On Me"

That wasn't a state flag, it was a banner waved during the US Revolution.

But then, we built Jeeps, and now we tread on everything.

Give me mud, or give me -er, a Buick. Not worth dying over, I suppose.

[phreakingeek]

Sorry to hear about your delema...i've been in nearly the same situation, but i was lucky enough to get out with my deposit.

Another place you can post your "opinion" would be www.epinions.com

I use their service whenever i want to see other people's experiences on a vast array of products. Just one more avenue to reach people and let your experience be a warning...

Hopefully the owners/management will see a pattern of behavior with the sales numbers slipping and realize that the sales staff have moved from the "The customer is our business" to "The customer is a sucker" strategy.

I'm not a professional salesperson, but I can spot a business's sales strategy within 60 seconds of walking into a place. I like to think of myself as a professional consumer.

[4Factor]

Originally Posted by phreakingeek

Hopefully the owners/management will see a pattern of behavior with the sales numbers slipping and realize that the sales staff have moved from the "The customer is our business" to "The customer is a sucker" strategy.

I'm not a professional salesperson, but I can spot a business's sales strategy within 60 seconds of walking into a place. I like to think of myself as a professional consumer.

See that's the thing, my immediate family has been doing business there since the mid 80's we've purchased/leased 6 cars from them already. I expected that the long standing customer relation would get me better treatment than what I was given, but apparently not.

With hundreds of thousands of dollars in inventory on the lot, are they really that desparate that they have to keep my (comparitively small) $500? In the grand scheme of things does my money really matter that much to them? I guess they feel it does. I really hope this isn't how they pay their bills.

I sat down and pondered my options last night. The contract I signed says the dealer has 90 days to get me the vehicle that is on the order form. If at that time they don't have the vehicle, they must return ALL my money without any deductions for damages or compensation. If they do produce the vehicle as on the order form, I still have the option to not take it, at which time the dealer can bill me for any costs involved (called damages and compensation) but that cannot exceed the deposit amount. In that case, I would expect the dealer to produce an invoice for "hours spent" and it would magically be a $500 invoice.

So, here's the broad picture. If the dealer doesn't produce the vehicle, I get my money back at the end of 90 days. If they do come up with the vehicle then I have the option of turning it down and only being out $500. This would make the dealer bear the cost of bringing the vehicle in, and having it sit on the lot ($500 will not cover their costs in this case). If they frankenstein a vehicle from stuff on their lot, then they'll spend WAY more than $500 getting it done. The dealer likely realizes what is going to happen, and unless they want to lose a lot of money, their best course of action is to not get a vehicle, make me wait the 90 days, and refund my money at that time.

So we'll visit this subject again in late September (last calendar day of summer... Sept. 21/04) and we'll see if they're still being so ridiculous. I'll survive the $500, yeah I don't like it, but it isn't the end of the world. So unless something happens earlier, I'm done with posting on this issue.

---- this issue postponed until Sept 21/04 ---

[myakkajeep]

Here is a Jeep Vin Decoder..
Vin Decoder

[Dano61]

I have the VIN Code sheet from the Jeep Liberty service manual...will this help? If so, email me.