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Unread 07-13-2007, 03:14 PM   #1
LONEPINERON
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Bio Diesel

Just got back from Oregon and found a station outside of Eugean that sells 5%, 20% and 99% at the pump. Got 1/2 tank of 20% so figgured that gave me 10%. Then topped it with 4 gals of 99 before heading home. Ran like a top. A little more pricy than straight Diesel but worth it Think the 99% was 3.17 gal and straigt Diesel is 2.84.

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Unread 07-13-2007, 04:34 PM   #2
dcxman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LONEPINERON
Just got back from Oregon and found a station outside of Eugean that sells 5%, 20% and 99% at the pump. Got 1/2 tank of 20% so figgured that gave me 10%. Then topped it with 4 gals of 99 before heading home. Ran like a top. A little more pricy than straight Diesel but worth it Think the 99% was 3.17 gal and straigt Diesel is 2.84.
How would you rate the difference between 20% and whatever you ended up with
the topoff?Even better mileage?
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Unread 07-13-2007, 09:43 PM   #3
Bgeddes
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I am curious about performance too.

FYI - The first Jeep Engineer session I asked about Bio-D and the CRD. Their comment was that it is untested and no guarentee it will work. My reading on that was you warrenty might be in question if anything happens.
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Unread 07-14-2007, 06:33 AM   #4
dcxman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bgeddes
I am curious about performance too.

FYI - The first Jeep Engineer session I asked about Bio-D and the CRD. Their comment was that it is untested and no guarentee it will work. My reading on that was you warrenty might be in question if anything happens.


I am interested in levels above 20% because I have run that amount. My limited experience showed increased fuel economy, quieter engine and more pep. I understand that lubricity increases too.
Bio is for summertime use only since gelling is a considerable problem. I hope the majors figure this one out.
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Unread 07-14-2007, 06:38 AM   #5
naturist
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warranty

I can tell you with certainty borne of personal experience that running over 5% will void parts of your engine warranty if DC finds out.

That said, from talking with many folks running higher concentrations, including several using 100% for tens of thousands of miles, as long as you take care to use only good stuff, it runs just fine.

And hey, for what it is worth, I just got 30 mpg out of a tank that was about 20%.
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Unread 07-14-2007, 08:12 AM   #6
CRD4Liberty
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5% bio will soon be the requirement in Oregon at all fuel stations.
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Unread 07-14-2007, 08:31 AM   #7
CRD4Liberty
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Bio 5 will soon be the required norm here in Oregon. Many stations have already switched, and they are expanding Oregon Bio production to meet the new requirements. Willy Nelson was just here to get the expansion rolling.
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Unread 07-14-2007, 04:50 PM   #8
LONEPINERON
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I figured I was up around 35-40% at the top off. Ran great. Real smooth and quiet.
I normaly run around 10% by splash mixing my own. Atleast I can now get 5% in Bishop,CA at the pump. Right around 15 centa a gal more than Dino. But it sure seems to run better.LPR
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Unread 07-14-2007, 10:15 PM   #9
dcxman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturist
I can tell you with certainty borne of personal experience that running over 5% will void parts of your engine warranty if DC finds out.

That said, from talking with many folks running higher concentrations, including several using 100% for tens of thousands of miles, as long as you take care to use only good stuff, it runs just fine.

And hey, for what it is worth, I just got 30 mpg out of a tank that was about 20%.
Moot point. My 06 is at 42k.
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Unread 07-15-2007, 03:23 AM   #10
merlinTec
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Hi
I have had one of my KJ customers run on dio (not sure how much) but this destroyed his engine and warranty didnít pay for it. The oil just turn to jelly better explained here http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/...d.php?tid=1553
5% is all you can use.
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Unread 07-15-2007, 07:23 AM   #11
dcxman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merlinTec
Hi
I have had one of my KJ customers run on dio (not sure how much) but this destroyed his engine and warranty didnít pay for it. The oil just turn to jelly better explained here http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/...d.php?tid=1553
5% is all you can use.
Just read the article. He focused on the twin tank setup. This is usually used for unprocessed vegetable oil. This is insane in my view. The glycerin needs to be removed from the oil by use of methane and lye. The remaining oil is poured off with the gunk removed.
That does not mean that it will not gell. In fact, it should not be used when temperatures approach 40F.
20% bio is relatively harmless if everything else is normal.
Oem's are reconsidering the allowable amount of bio that can be used.
Some of our knowledgeable bio poster's have disappeared. Too bad!
One last thing, there are many who run 100% bio with no ill effect.
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Unread 07-15-2007, 08:12 AM   #12
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I live in Iowa, the dead center of soy biodiesel production. Got a plant 8.5 miles from my house.

With all the mixups on what manufacturers will allow, the lack of stations selling it, the apparant political meanderings that seem to be at the center of the bio fuels issue, I have given up on whether biodiesel is a viable option.

I have used it. I like it. But I could give a rip if another drop of it is sold. Yes, and I raise soybeans and corn. The pumps offering any real blends above 2% are so rare and inconsistent. If I drive about 90 miles away, I can get a 99% at the pump for higher price than other diesel. My coop elevator where I get most of my fuel will not provide higher than 5% because of engine manufacturer issues.

I have no dog in this hunt anymore. If people want to use it, great. If not, great. I have come to realize, being in the farming and trucking industry, that this whole biofuels issue is just a political one that redistributes money and make people feel good. If we turned EVERY LAST KERNAL OF CORN AND EVERY LAST SOYBEAN into biofuels, we would only be able to supply just under 10% of the nations fuel needs. Facts are facts. Check with farm organizations, your state university ag extension, etc. They will tell you the same.

I just look for good quality fuel at the lowest price. No more trying to have a warm fuzzy over using biofuels.
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Unread 07-15-2007, 08:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cowpie01
If we turned EVERY LAST KERNAL OF CORN AND EVERY LAST SOYBEAN into biofuels, we would only be able to supply just under 10% of the nations fuel needs. Facts are facts. Check with farm organizations, your state university ag extension, etc. They will tell you the same..

You are 100% right about the details and 100% wrong about the promise of biofuels. The reason you are wrong is that you are assuming that we MUST continue to grow soy and corn to get those fuels, and those two crops are absolutely not the crops to grow for fuel. The ONLY reason they are used today is that they are in excess, thus the cheapest sources. You can get maybe 45 gallons of soy oil per acre per year, for example. The most promising purely-for-fuel crops for oil production are algae, and the various pilot projects now in process get between 12,000 and 60,000 gallons per acre. Yes, you read that right, that's twelve to sixty THOUSAND.

Of course you wouldn't grow that algae the same way, or on the same land for that matter, that you'd use to grow soybeans. And that's the beauty of it, don't you see? Those algae need brackish water. Lots of sun. Waste water and for the 60,000 gallon operation, the exhaust of a coal-fired power plant. Iowa is not suited for that operation. Coastal Texas is better. YOU, in Iowa get to continue growing the crops you've always grown for food. Somebody else will grow the algae. Somewhere else. So don't worry about it, and don't bad mouth it.
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Unread 07-16-2007, 06:19 AM   #14
dcxman
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I'm trying to focus on the viability issue. Ethanol isn't. Bio is. Even with the present method of production bio will work and without huge subsidies.
The issue of oil imports is only a secondary but still important one. My main point is that engines run better on bio. Scarcity of stations is an issue, but with increased production supply will produce more demand which will bring more businessmen to the forefront. Stations will therefore increase.
If hydrogen even becomes viable, how long will it take to set up a national network?
When I do find a b-20 station I am delighted, because my engine runs so much better on it.Here is a link for finding stations in your area.


http://www.biodiesel.org/buyingbiodi...s/default.shtm
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Unread 07-16-2007, 07:49 PM   #15
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hydrogen is a red herring. ain't gonna happen on this planet for fundamental-laws-of-physics reasons. at best hydrogen is a method of transmitting energy, it is NOT a source of energy, and it is the latter that is needed. You can't replace a well with a pipe, and you can't replace petroleum with hydrogen, for exactly the same reason.
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