Ok, if you compare a cheap short arm to a quality long arm then yeah. If you're comparing the long arm RE lift vs the short arm one, they will flex the same with the same shocks and springs.
As Slinky said before comparing a low quality SA kit to a HQ LA kit and vice versa is not fair. This goes for flex and ride comfort.
Few things to think about here...
If you are talking 4.5" and less with a HQ kit like RE or FT then yolu probably won't notice a difference in LA vs. SA.
If we go over 4.5", the LA's will definetley make a ride difference as you are correcting the severe angle created by the high lift while using SA's.
But if you want a soft comfortable ride no matter what the terrain, the shocks are going to make the largest difference. With my various 4x4's over the years I can absolutly say the biggest difference to my ride quality was made by my Coilovers. I can hit the roughest trails and come off the steepest drop-offs and the coilover will absord the shock and transmit a nice smooth ride every time.
The taller the lift, the more you need long control arms to prevent the ride from becoming tank-like. Tall lifts, like 4" and taller, create steep control arm angles which make the Jeep ride stiffly and prevent the axles from easily lifting up over obstacles. Horizontal control arms allow the axles to flex up and down very easily, more vertical arms instead merely push up against the frame instead when the tire tries to climb over an obstacle or if it simply hits a bump in the street. Visualize it and you'll quickly get the reasons for the short vs. long control arm thing.
So, in taller lifts (4in. or more) long arms do create a better, softer ride. But, for those who don't have LAs yet, high quality shocks (not necessarily coilovers) will also create a softer ride.
I always thought your ride quality came from how stiff your springs are. So, BigJeepJay, you are saying the soft ride quality comes from the quality of shocks not springs right?
So, in taller lifts (4in. or more) long arms do create a better, softer ride. But, for those who don't have LAs yet, high quality shocks (not necessarily coilovers) will also create a softer ride.
With a tall lift riding on short arms riding at the steep angle I described above, the softest shocks in the world won't help. Re-read what I was saying on how steep control arm angles cause the stiff ride and then you'll see why soft-riding shocks don't help improve the ride.
With a tall lift riding on short arms riding at the steep angle I described above, the softest shocks in the world won't help. Re-read what I was saying on how steep control arm angles cause the stiff ride and then you'll see why soft-riding shocks don't help improve the ride.
Jerry got it right. Even with a modest lift the increased angle of the stock control arms will give you a harsher ride. Get above 3.5" on stock arms and it is really rough!
Consider what is going on. On a totally stock ZJ for instance the control arms are almost parallel to the ground. Small budget booster lift of 2" and there is a slight angle. When you hit a bump some of the force is transfered through the control arm into the frame instead of just pushing the axle up. Consider a 4" lift. A bump will absolutely NAIL the control arm and the ride quality is GONE.
So, in taller lifts (4in. or more) long arms do create a better, softer ride. But, for those who don't have LAs yet, high quality shocks (not necessarily coilovers) will also create a softer ride.
I always thought your ride quality came from how stiff your springs are. So, BigJeepJay, you are saying the soft ride quality comes from the quality of shocks not springs right?
Shocks will only do some much, your Control Arm angles are most important first. A tall SA lift will be rough no matter what you do as the angle of the control arms will transmit a rougher feeling to the driver. However if you take that same height and lengthen the arms, the ride quality will get better as the angles are less severe. Will this make the smooth ride you dream of...maybe and maybe not. If you pick out stiff shocks you may not get the comfortable ride you desire versus a more forgiving shock.
Also check out Jerry's post above as he hits it right on the head.
Yes I will probably do LA's some day but I don't think my ride is that bad.4in springs with 1in BL, 8 Currie SA's, & Rancho 9000's.Maybe I'm just used to it but it is a Jeep afterall.Rough ride describes the 77 GMC 1/2 ton truck I had with Monster Mudders & a 4in Rough Country lift way back-the TJ rides great compared to that.
There is an alternative to both. I am running the Currie J arms and feel like I get the best of both worlds. In terms of price it isn't any cheaper than a LA kit if you include installation by a shop.
There is an alternative to both. I am running the Currie J arms and feel like I get the best of both worlds. In terms of price it isn't any cheaper than a LA kit if you include installation by a shop.
The geometry of Currie's J-Arm's design is really amazing, I wanted to go with them but the extra work they require in welding new control arm brackets in place was more than I wanted to tackle at the time. Should have, the RE long-arm kit I ended up with was more cutting and welding than I would have needed with Currie's J-Arms. Best of both worlds as battallion14 says.
can you post a link to something explaining them a little more.... i have only seen pictures of it and i dont know anything about them. are they a long arm??
Also, I feel that Blaine's shock outboarding is a necessary part of the J arm install but you might opt for shorter shocks in the rear if you don't want to do both at the same time.
Those j-arms are sweet. Did you every figure out a way to prevent the bracket on the axle from busting on rocks? And are they the length of a short arm or a long arm?
Those j-arms are sweet. Did you every figure out a way to prevent the bracket on the axle from busting on rocks? And are they the length of a short arm or a long arm?
I have never hit the brackets on any rocks or are you talking about the factory ones on the frame? They are longer than a short arm but shorter than a long arm. I could measure it if you want.
Oh, I misread what you said in one of the links. For some reason I thought you were talking about your j-arm brackets bottoming out but after re-reading it I see you were talking about your shocks bottoming out.
Don't worry about measuring. I just wanted to know if they were longer than short arm. It looks like a great setup, your jeep looks great. I'll have to keep your j-arms in mind when I decide what to do.
So if I wanted to go with a RE 4.5 the Long arm would be better then the SF? I heard that you loose some ground clearance with the long arms. What would be the point if you lose your ground clearance.
So if I wanted to go with a RE 4.5 the Long arm would be better then the SF? I heard that you loose some ground clearance with the long arms. What would be the point if you lose your ground clearance.
A long-arm doesn't reduce ground clearance enough to worry about IMHO, barely more than short arms and if you are following the right line offroad, they will normally rarely contact obstacles. The last offroad trip I went on last month was a double-locker required run that was predominantly rock crawling and I don't recall my RE longarms ever even touching the rocks.
If you were really concerned with ground clearance issues with long arms you could go with J-arms like battallion 14 did. From what I hear, you get the same performance as long arms but they aren't quite as long as long arms.
I forgot to ask this earlier but do currie J-arms have upper J-arms as well as lower J-arms? and do they offer the triangulated upper control arms in the rear?
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