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Unread 11-21-2013, 06:42 PM   #16
Joe Dillard
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matteo92065 View Post
I would happily drive anywhere in SD to get it fixed. Is this something that I need to make an appointment for? How long do you need the vehicle?
Not necessarily an "appointment". A quick phone conversation between us to help nail down a time to check it out is all. I doubt if it would take more than a few minutes to narrow down the issue(s) that are causing it.

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Unread 11-22-2013, 08:08 PM   #17
sdmoose429
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Seriously, Matteo, take it to Joe's and let us all know. There won't be any places to park!! These guys all love to help.
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Unread 11-29-2013, 09:49 AM   #18
matteo92065
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Fixed?

I found myself with a day off this week.
Drove the jeep down to M.I.T. As usual the jeep would shake violently once I hit ~47mph. Then as the tires warm up, I can safely get a little more speed out of it. On slight left or right turns at ~50mph it would want to start up again.
The people at M.I.T. were really nice. Jeff took my car for a drive and said it did not go into full shake on him. By now the tires are warm after driving ~20 miles. After a brief inspection he said that the Savvy track bar in single shear is not the best way to go, and that there may be some flex there. Recommends a Rubicon Express track bar with new mount welded onto the frame. Also said that they recommend going with a new Monroe Steering Stabilizer, as opposed to my new Rancho unit. He said that the Monroe unit has heavy damping, and didnít know about the Rancho. He also recommended that I get my tires Ďtruedí then balanced by a local shop. He explained that they have seen some problems with the MTR tires.
I started driving to the tire truer shop, and on the way I passed by ORW. I decided that as long as Iím here Iíll stop in for their free suspension inspection. They were too busy to give a full inspection, but a couple of the guys there came out and took a quick look at it in the parking lot. They asked a few questions about suspension parts then one guy took a look at the wheel balancing weights. This was a red flag for him. He noticed that there are an awful lot of weights on the inside of the rim, and that there were two piles of them 180 degrees from each other. He explained that weights should never be opposite each other, and that they really should be on the rim edges. He went on to say that the Kevlar MTR tires do not balance well and that he has seen a lot of problems caused by them. I told them that the tires were balanced 3 times by Discount since that is where I bought them. The ORW guy (donít remember his name) said that since I have free balancing from them I go back, but to ONLY the one in Santee, and only talk to John.
I get over to Discount Tire and talk to John. He understands the whole situation. They balance my tires again. The wheel weights are now clipped to the rim edges. I leave to drive home and the Jeep is like a new vehicle.
The next morning I take it for another drive, in the morning. Cold. It seems to be fixed. I canít get it to wobble.

Was it the tires? and the tires alone? I donít know. Iíve been trying to fix this problem for so long, and replacing so many parts. For example, months ago I did the dry steering test and a ball joint moved up and down about an ⅛Ē. I wanted to put on the V8 Grand Cherokee steering anyway. So I did but the DW continued.
It could have been marginal steering part(s) combined with poor tire balance?

Things I now know for sure:
1) Not one mechanic or tech likes the MTRís w/kevlar
2)
3)
mmmmÖ That was a short list.

Now that the Jeep is driving better, I can spend more time
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Unread 11-29-2013, 10:54 AM   #19
jbolty
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Glad that it seems to have worked out. Personally I have heard nothing but good things about the Kevlars, and I have them too. Mine balanced easy with a tiny amount of weights.
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Unread 11-29-2013, 12:10 PM   #20
brokenyoujoint
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Interesting but not surprising about the weights. You might of taken it to the same place 3 times but it probably was the same 17 yr old kid balancing your tires 3 times pissed off that he has to throw around your 80 lb wheels to do so. A wheel that is weighted 180 out from another weight is zero weighted. It nulls it out. That was a good catch by that dude.
MTR/k's are nothing but FANTASTIC for me so far. I go 80+ mph and not an iota of vibration. I have the Discount tire here in Mission Valley balance mine.
Like I said many posts ago, its probably a large rotating mass because of the speed symptoms.
VERY glad you found your culprit. Sometimes things that end up simple drive you INSANE. Not simple until after you've found it right?
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Unread 11-29-2013, 12:55 PM   #21
premo
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Glad to hear you got it sorted out. double sheer track bar bracket is a def must btw.
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Unread 11-29-2013, 01:51 PM   #22
brokenyoujoint
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oh forgot to mention. If possible stay away from those types of track bars that have a mount that welds or bolts to the frame side like the RE. Do youself a favor and get a currie trackbar and a non-drop pitman. I had the RE extreme duty trackbar and a drop pitman. When I went with my hp 44 I had to do something else due to clearance issues. Didnt realize how much difference the stock pitman and currie TB makes.
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Unread 12-04-2013, 04:14 PM   #23
matteo92065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokenyoujoint View Post
oh forgot to mention. If possible stay away from those types of track bars that have a mount that welds or bolts to the frame side like the RE. Do youself a favor and get a currie trackbar and a non-drop pitman. I had the RE extreme duty trackbar and a drop pitman. When I went with my hp 44 I had to do something else due to clearance issues. Didnt realize how much difference the stock pitman and currie TB makes.
Your TB recommendations are 180 degrees away from MIT's. They said get RE TB and Drop pitman.

I do have exactly what you are suggesting. A Currie/Savvy Trackbar & stock pitman arm.

As I drive my Jeep a little more, I can still feel something a little loose. But it is so much better than it was before the latest tire balance that I can let my wife drive it now.
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Unread 12-04-2013, 04:24 PM   #24
brokenyoujoint
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I can only say from my personal experience. Ask around and read around and you'll see that opinions are like turds. At least one a day from every one. I personally bet that if you had an RE and drop arm that they'd try to sell you a currie with stock pitman... just say'n. I don't remember how big your lift is but it its 4 or less you dont want a drop pitman.
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Unread 12-04-2013, 05:05 PM   #25
premo
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unless you have to use a drop pitman to get your angles correct, i would advice against them as they put more stress on the already stressed out sector shaft in your steering gear box. the ONLY reason you would ever need to use a drop pitman was if your drag link and track bar angles weren't matching up. please keep that in mind when commiting to purchase. I have a slight drop on mine on acount of my TB bracket, but i also have hydro assist which takes a lot of the force off the box (and the track bar for that matter).

Here's what i found for the RE


I currently am sporting an IRO adjustable jobber with double sheer just like that above, johnny on frame and bushing on axle side. works fantastic. currie and RE look to be the same from what i can tell in regards to the bar itself and not the bracket, but i have no first hand experience with either. i'm sure someone else can chime in there. i certainly hope what i think isn't correct in that it (currie) bolts up to the existing bracketry and puts the bolt at a Y axis, because that would limit articulation compared to being at a Z axis.

am i correct in saying that this is the currie unit?
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Unread 12-04-2013, 05:07 PM   #26
premo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokenyoujoint View Post
I don't remember how big your lift is but it its 4 or less you dont want a drop pitman.
you have no way of knowing if he does/doesnt need a drop pitman without looking at his steering angles
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Unread 12-04-2013, 05:26 PM   #27
brokenyoujoint
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True but if he gets the RE trackbar with the drop bracket he will need a drop pitman arm. If he goes with a currie trackbar he will need a non-drop. The reason I dont like the drop and RE is because there are more things to fail for one. Instead of one bolt going to the frame you have essentially 3. I never really thought about it much because it pretty much worked on my TJ until I got the hp44 frontend. The RE TB hit so I had to go the currie route. Once I did I was pretty shocked at how little bump steer I had afterwards.
As long as the angles are correct (parallel) with your track bar and your draglink you should be ok.
Currie on my jeep
RE setup on my jeep:
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Unread 12-05-2013, 09:55 AM   #28
matteo92065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by premo View Post
unless you have to use a drop pitman to get your angles correct, i would advice against them as they put more stress on the already stressed out sector shaft in your steering gear box. the ONLY reason you would ever need to use a drop pitman was if your drag link and track bar angles weren't matching up. please keep that in mind when commiting to purchase. I have a slight drop on mine on acount of my TB bracket, but i also have hydro assist which takes a lot of the force off the box (and the track bar for that matter).

Here's what i found for the RE
(image removed)

I currently am sporting an IRO adjustable jobber with double sheer just like that above, johnny on frame and bushing on axle side. works fantastic. currie and RE look to be the same from what i can tell in regards to the bar itself and not the bracket, but i have no first hand experience with either. i'm sure someone else can chime in there. i certainly hope what i think isn't correct in that it (currie) bolts up to the existing bracketry and puts the bolt at a Y axis, because that would limit articulation compared to being at a Z axis.

am i correct in saying that this is the currie unit?
(image removed)
You are so right about the Johnny Joint limiting the articulation because of mounting in the Y axis. I am right at the limit of the joint with a 2" Bump stop extension and 33" tires. I lucked out on that. I have a 3" SA lift with a 1.25" body lift. For any less than this the consensus is to keep the stock track bar anyway.

General info:
I have the stock pitman arm, and have the Currie track bar. I don't plan on changing any of this unless.
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Unread 12-05-2013, 09:58 AM   #29
matteo92065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokenyoujoint View Post
True but if he gets the RE trackbar with the drop bracket he will need a drop pitman arm. If he goes with a currie trackbar he will need a non-drop. The reason I dont like the drop and RE is because there are more things to fail for one. Instead of one bolt going to the frame you have essentially 3. I never really thought about it much because it pretty much worked on my TJ until I got the hp44 frontend. The RE TB hit so I had to go the currie route. Once I did I was pretty shocked at how little bump steer I had afterwards.
As long as the angles are correct (parallel) with your track bar and your draglink you should be ok.
Currie on my jeep
I don't want to get the RE stuff. I don't think it will improve anything, only complicate it.

I really like this picture. The lighting and angle is perfect. I have to get one like that!
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Unread 12-05-2013, 11:04 AM   #30
brokenyoujoint
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the currie trackbar has more flex than your draglink end at the pitman arm does. Dont be fooled by the "more flex is best " on a tj either. It's only as good as long as your springs are seated. Once your springs unseat flex is worthless.
Why was MIT even suggesting that you needed this stuff anyways? I thought your DW was in your tire balance?
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