[freeskier93]

How do you change the title of a thread? I'm no longer using POR on the exterior body but am going to use an epoxy primer. I'm also turning this into sort of a "build" thread. Though I do plan to use POR when I start work on my bumpers because they have rust "freckles", not really sure what to call it but it basically looks like there are freckles on my bumpers.

PLAN:

This weekend either, Saturday or Sunday, whenever I'm not working, I am going to start scraping off the old body filler and then grind down all the rust to get an assessment of how bad it is. Hopefully I don't have to cut anything out because I don't have a mig welder, only an arc welder.

Then next paycheck, if I don't have to deal with patches, I will order some epoxy primer and start removing all other rust from the body, bang out some dents in the hood, and prime the bare metal. From there I will have to wait for some more money before I buy some body filler then some paint.

[Chawietjes]

When I was in autos class in high school I was working on my teachers 1954 ford pickup , we used it in the bed of it. It was riddled with rust and gunk. Prepped it, painted it on, looked AMAZING, everything was smooth! I am pretty shure you could paint over it too! That would be the way I would go. P.S. wear a long sleeve shirt I had a small stain on my arm that took a week to go away!

[Coiz]

Originally Posted by freeskier93

Has anyone tired this type of thing?

I did exactly what you described. Check out pages nine and ten of my build starting with this post.

[freeskier93]

Originally Posted by Coiz

I did exactly what you described. Check out pages nine and ten of my build starting with this post.

Sweet thanks! The only thing is I'm don't plan on stripping the whole body down to metal, only the bad rust spots, so I'm not sure how well the POR will tie into the surrounding paint. Maybe I'll just strip whole panels? I don't really know yet until I start chipping off the old body filler.

[gtome]

I have never tried it myself, but I have read a few that did. All had problems. Why not just cut out the bad rust, strip where there is surface rust, and picklex those areas. Then just finish with epoxy primer followed by 2k primer, block it out, and paint it. Those are proven methods done by thousands with proven results. No need to re-invent the wheel here. Save the POR for the underside, and floor. If you can get to the inner panels, rust bullet is amazing product.

[freeskier93]

Originally Posted by gtome

I have never tried it myself, but I have read a few that did. All had problems. Why not just cut out the bad rust, strip where there is surface rust, and picklex those areas. Then just finish with epoxy primer followed by 2k primer, block it out, and paint it. Those are proven methods done by thousands with proven results. No need to re-invent the wheel here. Save the POR for the underside, and floor. If you can get to the inner panels, rust bullet is amazing product.

I've looked at epoxy primers and they it seems like that would be a good option as well. Price is another factor, the epoxy primers seem really expensive and that picklex is nearly 40 bucks for a single spray bottle whereas the POR Metal Ready and Marine clean are nearly 1/4 the price and a pint of POR is under 20 bucks. It seems like the epoxy primer would be a lot easier to apply and tie into the old paint and that is a plus. I still don't know just how bad that worst of the rust is so I might HAVE to weld in some patches or just replace some panels, so that could cost me even more.

I could use some more feedback on the epoxy primers because if there is a brand that is not as expensive or comes in very small quantities that would be helpful.

I could also use some general feedback on brands for all paint. I still need to go stop by a local paint shop to get an estimate on primers and paints but need some suggestions of brands that are cheap but still semi good. I don't need top quality paint, just something that will not peel off. Also what brand body filler is good?

[gtome]

I would just see who is local to you. I doubt there is much difference in price. I just started useing Sherwin Williams, and there prices are very low. I would never do anything over bare metal other than epoxy. You only need 1-2 coats, and on a Jeep, a half gallon would be plenty. You will have to check when you get yours because some epoxy's can also be used as a sealer depending on what you mix it with. So you could use what you have left for that as well.

I know it seems scary, but if there is a ton of filler in yours already, then it has been done wrong already. I would strip it bare, fix it right, and fix it once. It super sucks to do all that work, only to have it come back and end up ****ty in 6 months. You will be so close already. And man its a Jeep!! Every panel on that thing is flat. Go buy yourself a sheet of steel, and cut out the crud, weld in some new pieces, and have fun while you are learning.

Yes Picklex is expensive, but you could use Ospho and get similar results, and its much cheaper. I prefer Picklex because Ospho says to rinse with water, and I just dont like the idea of hosing down the metal im trying not to get rusty. When I use Ospho now, I just scrub it in with a scotchbrite, let it sit overnight at least. When im ready to work on the panel, I just take a new red scotchbrite and clean all the scale off, wipe with wax and grease remover, then do the work. So far so good with that application.

PPG has an Omni line of paint that is cheap and good. Dupont has Nason (but I dont like it). Sherwin Williams has Dimention line, and I like it the best for the cheap stuff.

The best body filler I have ever used is the Rage Gold by Evercoat.

[freeskier93]

Originally Posted by gtome

I would just see who is local to you. I doubt there is much difference in price. I just started useing Sherwin Williams, and there prices are very low. I would never do anything over bare metal other than epoxy. You only need 1-2 coats, and on a Jeep, a half gallon would be plenty. You will have to check when you get yours because some epoxy's can also be used as a sealer depending on what you mix it with. So you could use what you have left for that as well.

I know it seems scary, but if there is a ton of filler in yours already, then it has been done wrong already. I would strip it bare, fix it right, and fix it once. It super sucks to do all that work, only to have it come back and end up ****ty in 6 months. You will be so close already. And man its a Jeep!! Every panel on that thing is flat. Go buy yourself a sheet of steel, and cut out the crud, weld in some new pieces, and have fun while you are learning.

Yes Picklex is expensive, but you could use Ospho and get similar results, and its much cheaper. I prefer Picklex because Ospho says to rinse with water, and I just dont like the idea of hosing down the metal im trying not to get rusty. When I use Ospho now, I just scrub it in with a scotchbrite, let it sit overnight at least. When im ready to work on the panel, I just take a new red scotchbrite and clean all the scale off, wipe with wax and grease remover, then do the work. So far so good with that application.

PPG has an Omni line of paint that is cheap and good. Dupont has Nason (but I dont like it). Sherwin Williams has Dimention line, and I like it the best for the cheap stuff.

The best body filler I have ever used is the Rage Gold by Evercoat.

Thank you so much! This is very helpful. I think you have convinced my to use epoxy primer. Hopefully next paycheck I can start buying some materials. I'm going to keep this thread updated with my progress and start a build thread on this. I'll probably have so more question but I think I'm all set for know!

Thanks!

[gtome]

No problem! Post up when you need more help.

Keep in mind epoxy has a recoat window, so you may want to wait til you have $$ to get the epoxy and 2k primer. I usually shoot one or two coats of epoxy, clean my gun up and stuff, then shoot the 2k primer (3 coats to start).

If your low on cash, there is plenty of work you can do before getting the epoxy. I would go to Home Depot or something and get a jug of Ospho (or whatever phosphoric acid they have) should be green in color.
Pick your method for stripping, and do one panel at a time. Get it bare, cut, weld, bang out dents, whatever, then spray the Ospho on a red scotchbrite and scrub it in, you dont need a lot. It will be good for a while if its inside. Just be sure to wipe it down good before spraying, again with a dry red scotchbright. I would try to get epoxy on within a month though. But try to epoxy as much as you can at once, it will save you from too much crummy clean up. Oh and epoxy sticks to 80 grit scratches really well, i would start there.

[freeskier93]

Ok, so I thought I was good on questions but the only thing I'm not sure about is replacing panels or patching them. I have a welder, but it's an arc "stick" welder and not a wire fed welder, is it even possible to weld such thin sheet metal with this type of welder? I'm guessing not and def. can't afford to buy another welder. Maybe you can direct be to a good thread.

I promise this is my last question.

[gtome]

Ask as many questions as you want. You need to be comfortable before you start. And no, i wouldnt use an arc welder for sheet metal. Maybe a friend has a wire feed welder??? Even a cheapy 110v flux core wire would work.

There is another way, but its pretty pricey too. Epoxy panel bond.

Maybe your local community college would weld it for you on the cheap??

[freeskier93]

Originally Posted by gtome

Ask as many questions as you want. You need to be comfortable before you start. And no, i wouldnt use an arc welder for sheet metal. Maybe a friend has a wire feed welder??? Even a cheapy 110v flux core wire would work.

There is another way, but its pretty pricey too. Epoxy panel bond.

Maybe your local community college would weld it for you on the cheap??

Ok, thats what I thought. I do know someone who takes automotive classes at a local "development center" college...thing, I might be able to get it done for free. I still don't even know how bad the rust is so if I can I might not have to to patches, I'll find out when I get the grinder out.

Again, thanks for your help.

[freeskier93]

Ok, since I'm going to turn this into a progress thread, Its picture time!



This first picture is of the worse of the two rust spots and it's located right under the passenger side taillight, one of the worst spots because there is a body mount right behind it so it is nearly impossible to get behind it. You can also see there is close to 2/16 of an inch thick layer of body filler in there.



Here is the "better" of the two rust spots. This is located on the passenger side on the rear quarter panel closer to the door. You can see the fender flair as well. When I removed my fenders to paint them, I accidently chipped off more paint/body filler.



Finally here is a rust bubble on the passenger side rocker panel. Can you see the pattern here? Everything is located on the passenger side, because the first owner laid the Jeep on its side, guess which side! There is also some minor rust on the hood because it's all dented up and where rocks have chipped the paint.

I'll also take more pictures not so close up.

[gtome]

Yeah, what I would do is get it to bare metal on that side and try to figure out why there is so much filler. When you have it bare, you can work on pulling whatever out, so not so much filler has to go in. The biggest problem I see so far is that the rusty metal you show is pretty far gone. You have to be able to grind it to good clean steel to work it, and I dont think you can with most of it. And there may be much more under all that body filler. UGH!! Its pretty bad!

Anyway, knock all that filler off (a stiff scraper may chip that crap right off) and take a grinder to it and see if you can get any clean steel. Grab a screwdriver and see if you can stab through it, hopefully its still strong enough to work on. Then you will have to see where to go from there. You will either have to cut it all out and replace it, or treat it, and refinish it, and cross your fingers it wont come back.

[Chawietjes]

Thats an ungodly amount.......