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Unread 08-05-2013, 07:24 AM   #1
silvanus
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Frame & Underbody Teament/Prevention

I'll be reconditioning my frame and under the tub soon.

The frame has some superficial rust in some areas ( welded areas for the spring buckets, etc. ) I spray the inside & outside of the frame twice a month ( more in winter ) it's seven years old and it's time for treatment/prevention!

Under the tub ( which the factory left it unpainted ) has some rusting on the seams & button welds, not bad for seven winters!

I've searched the web and forum threads and have gotten very good info.

What I need is info on which treatment/prevention system is best for New England winter chemical environment??

Anyone here on the JF that has user knowledge would most helpful!

I'm trying to keep this TJ-L around for a while and any help would be most appreciated!

Thanks,
Carlo

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Unread 08-05-2013, 07:30 PM   #2
ToledoDave
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Unless your going to do a frame off restoration I think I would be very hesitant of doing any of that. If you were going to seal it somehow I would not recommend it now. Maybe when you first got it but its too late unless restoring. Problem your going to have is once rust...always rust. Rust is like cancer its always there and dont take much to make it come back. Also you more then likely already have moisture and foreign materials trapped, therefore sealing it now will only seal the rust. Would look good on the outside but on the inside its still rusting. Only good way to stop it is to do a frame off resto and have it all acid dipped and or sand blasted and resealed. So now you have a temporary fix untill next time your problems have escalated because everything is sealed and you will have even harder time tracing the beginning of your rust problem next time. I think since you want to keep it I would just keep doing what your doing. Its worked this long. If anything, lightly clean up your bad spots and prime and paint them. But sealing your undercarriage I think will bite you in the arse later.
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Unread 08-06-2013, 06:34 AM   #3
silvanus
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I plan on brushing and spraying the affected areas then topcoat the whole frame by brush and roller.

The under body will be sprayed with a treatment then rubberized coating, maybe POR 15's undercoating?

I can't do an frame off right now, so I'm addressing the corrosion issues in this manner.

I won't do an inside frame sealer, power washing the frame by spraying inside & out works very well for me, I'm doing an touchup for now.
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Unread 08-06-2013, 01:40 PM   #4
Ironworker709
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Whether you power wash the inside frame rails or not,they will still rust to the point the frame will litteraly start falling apart from the inside out..
Dirt,sand,road grime,road salts and other chemicals they use on snow roads will just sit in there and hold moisture..
The original factory coating inside the frame are poor to protect against this..

Look into to these 2 products....
http://www.masterseriescoatings.com/index/primer/
http://www.corroseal.com/

I lean more towards the Mastercoat for the fact it can top coated too,and he has some pretty darn good tests to prove how good it is..

Here is the best gun to shoot any coating inside the frame rails..lil pricy but no other gimmicks work good at all with different coatings...well worth the peace of mind i'm not going to replacing a whole frame sooner than later.

http://www.kbs-coatings.com/underseal-gun.html

If go these routes and keep up your cleaning as you already do, would not see a problem in the near future with frame rot
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Unread 08-06-2013, 11:58 PM   #5
swirve
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Ok, newb here. This is what i do for a living, paint and body and fab. The best thing for rust hands down is POR 15. Gonna be kinda tough to get that inside of the frame rails. Im not sure of your climate, but if you can take an air blower to the rails and and spray some OSPHO in every little crack and cranny, let dry then use the eastwood internal frame coating system it should prolong any issues for quite sometime.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 12:19 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swirve View Post
Ok, newb here. This is what i do for a living, paint and body and fab. The best thing for rust hands down is POR 15. Gonna be kinda tough to get that inside of the frame rails. Im not sure of your climate, but if you can take an air blower to the rails and and spray some OSPHO in every little crack and cranny, let dry then use the eastwood internal frame coating system it should prolong any issues for quite sometime.
Por-15 would be a bad choice inside a frame where you can't get to it to prep it right..Por-15 pretty much only sticks to a little rust and bare metal,nothing else..thats why so many people have had so many problems with it in the past...that pretty much puts it out of the picture inside a box frame where you can not get to it...

OSPHO has to be nuetralized before top coating...and that involves wetting immediatly and scrubbing and wiping behind it,just like Naval jelly.

The high content of acids in OSPHO wreaks serious havoc with top coats if not properly nuetralised..and just putting it in there itself is out of the picture too for the fact it won;t fair to any weather and moisture..it's just a temporary fix until someone can get to the body work...

The 2 i posted would be ideal,for the fact it can be top coated without prep and both of them are also a primer in one coat....
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Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

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The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
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Unread 08-07-2013, 02:20 AM   #7
swirve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709

Por-15 would be a bad choice inside a frame where you can't get to it to prep it right..Por-15 pretty much only sticks to a little rust and bare metal,nothing else..thats why so many people have had so many problems with it in the past...that pretty much puts it out of the picture inside a box frame where you can not get to it...

OSPHO has to be nuetralized before top coating...and that involves wetting immediatly and scrubbing and wiping behind it,just like Naval jelly.

The high content of acids in OSPHO wreaks serious havoc with top coats if not properly nuetralised..and just putting it in there itself is out of the picture too for the fact it won;t fair to any weather and moisture..it's just a temporary fix until someone can get to the body work...

The 2 i posted would be ideal,for the fact it can be top coated without prep and both of them are also a primer in one coat....
Really, so how do you prep for this master coat ??? Does it just stick to stuff with no prep??? Like magic???
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Unread 08-07-2013, 02:23 AM   #8
swirve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709

Por-15 would be a bad choice inside a frame where you can't get to it to prep it right..Por-15 pretty much only sticks to a little rust and bare metal,nothing else..thats why so many people have had so many problems with it in the past...that pretty much puts it out of the picture inside a box frame where you can not get to it...

OSPHO has to be nuetralized before top coating...and that involves wetting immediatly and scrubbing and wiping behind it,just like Naval jelly.

The high content of acids in OSPHO wreaks serious havoc with top coats if not properly nuetralised..and just putting it in there itself is out of the picture too for the fact it won;t fair to any weather and moisture..it's just a temporary fix until someone can get to the body work...

The 2 i posted would be ideal,for the fact it can be top coated without prep and both of them are also a primer in one coat....
And you dont need to topcoat por 15.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 06:37 AM   #9
festerw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swirve View Post
And you dont need to topcoat por 15.
Por15 is sensitive to UV and will break down if not topcoated.

Inside the frame rails I use Fluid Film, it works plain and simple. Outside scrape the rust and spray with some paint.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 08:58 PM   #10
Ironworker709
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swirve View Post
Really, so how do you prep for this master coat ??? Does it just stick to stuff with no prep??? Like magic???
Go to the Mastercoat website and look around at the products he has for several different purposes.including a good specific "Inner Frame coating"....
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Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
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Unread 08-07-2013, 08:59 PM   #11
Ironworker709
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swirve View Post
And you dont need to topcoat por 15.
never seen where i said to top coat it........
__________________
Don't DREAM your life, LIVE your dreams

Never forget 9/11

"Welding is like a woman,Get 'er HOT and Penetrate"

Gotta LOVE a person who knows everything about NOTHING

The only Thing necessary for the Evil to win is a good man to do nothing....

"How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,compassionate with the aged,sympathetic with the striving,and tolerant with the weak and strong--because someday YOU will have been all of these"....George Washington Carver

Want to know what an Ironworker is and the job scope of a Journeyman?..click here...http://www.ironworkers.org/becoming/careers.aspx
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Unread 08-08-2013, 04:35 AM   #12
silvanus
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Posts: 220
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironworker709 View Post
Whether you power wash the inside frame rails or not,they will still rust to the point the frame will litteraly start falling apart from the inside out..
Dirt,sand,road grime,road salts and other chemicals they use on snow roads will just sit in there and hold moisture..
The original factory coating inside the frame are poor to protect against this..

Look into to these 2 products....
http://www.masterseriescoatings.com/index/primer/
http://www.corroseal.com/

I lean more towards the Mastercoat for the fact it can top coated too,and he has some pretty darn good tests to prove how good it is..

Here is the best gun to shoot any coating inside the frame rails..lil pricy but no other gimmicks work good at all with different coatings...well worth the peace of mind i'm not going to replacing a whole frame sooner than later.

http://www.kbs-coatings.com/underseal-gun.html

If go these routes and keep up your cleaning as you already do, would not see a problem in the near future with frame rot
Thanks for your advice Ironworker!

Will the Mastercoat inner-frame coating ( 1qt ) and chassis kit be enough for the frame?
Thanks for the spray gun recommendation, well within my budget!

Also, what should I use to treat the bottom of the tub?

Thanks,
Carlo
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Unread 08-11-2013, 07:07 AM   #13
silvanus
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I'll be ordering the Mastercoat inner frame & chassis kit with the deluxe spray gun within the next few weeks and start the project in mid-September!

Thanks Ironworker for helping this Yank out!
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Unread 08-11-2013, 12:22 PM   #14
trailboss
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Just got my silver 02 "X" a few months ago, and the frame is in *very* good shape. The inside of the frame appears to have the usual surface rust and appears to be untreated from the factory. I bought a 10$ garden sprayer from Home Depot and filled it with about 3 quarts of used motor oil. I sprayed the inside of the frame as completely as possible, using every hole available. This is an old, old trick used on farms (Plows, tractors, tools)and whatnot for decades. The drippage was actually minimal and poses no threat to the environment, in case there are any tree-huggers here. The oil will do a good job of arresting any current rusting and prevent future rust for a long time. I will repeat once a year, just to be sure. Actually used less then a quart, as there is quite a bit left in the sprayer. I will POR-15 the outside shortly.
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