The Wasteland Survival Guide: Engineering Greta - Page 21 -

LinkBack Thread Tools
post #301 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 04:27 PM
Registered User
2005 LJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Lowell
Posts: 1,045
More I need some comedic relief after the long day I just endured. On a side note, I don't recommend doing a front locker after working all night as the brain ceases to function w/o sleep.

Free stickers and picture hosting at
dongalonga is offline  
Sponsored Links
post #302 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 06:42 PM
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 3,508
This build thread re-defines JeepForum.

That's about all I can think to say now, but I assure you I will be back in full force to add to the shenanigans (and extreme technical nature) of this thread. By the way, what's your name? If you're going to humor us all like this we at least deserve to know who's brainwashing us.
djflyy is offline  
post #303 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 06:52 PM
Registered User
1997 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Sparta
Posts: 66
Deffinatly the most entertaining build threads, crawled.

You've got to add some kind of VATS system.
Kep5258 is offline  
post #304 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 07:03 PM
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 6,336
Great opportunity to change those u joints! Fwiw with the 35's your running I would put the new ball joints in too. Seen more than a few pull out.

Originally Posted by Motorcharge View Post
So do you actually hear your thoughts in your head or is it just sort of a dull roar before you smash your face into your keyboard and just submit whatever dumb **** ended up on the page?
justanotherjpr is offline  
post #305 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 08:02 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The Republic of Dave
Posts: 6,408
The Savvy/Vanco Brake Install: Making Room for The New Hotness

Let's start this out with a quick recap: after getting rid of the stock front brakes we're ready to start getting the Vanco system bolted on. Well, maybe not entirely ready...but almost. First, we have to bolt in the new knuckles and replace the axle shafts, and then we need to make some room for the not-quite-bolt-on rotors.

It's easy to tell from the photos of the knuckle in the first installment that there's a LOT of machining and fitting that's already taken place...but the machining and fitting isn't quite over with, yet: Vanco and Savvy have done a lot but we've still got a bit to do on our end with our specific Jeep. This is where the confusing picture that I showed at the end of the last installment comes into play. However, some of you might not have realized that it could be a confusing picture, and the slower members of the class are probably wondering if there's a chicken hidden in it somewhere (there isn't). Let's show it again and then explain what's easily missed by telling you The Question That You Should Be Asking.

The Question That You Should Be Asking: "Why - if you're only doing a front brake job - do you have the Jeep on four jack stands?"

Answer: "Because we're going to reduce the diameter of the unit bearings while they're rotating. Duh."

Translation: "We're going to have Greta suspended on jack stands, running, in-gear, and spinning her front axles in four-wheel drive while we're blithely taking a grinder to them...and we're probably going to get seriously injured while doing it. Duh."

Read that last sentence again, because I'm not kidding about it: most of what follows is exceptionally dangerous even after taking the proper precautions, so if you try this and accidentally die it's totally your own stupid fault. However, if you want to do some metal surgery and get it exact without access to a full-bore machine shop, this is a good way to go about it. More on that in a minute, though...first, the new knuckles. They seat easily but it's a good idea to use a deadblow hammer to settle them before you torque down their castle nuts.

After the new knuckle gets installed the stock axle shafts and still-attached unit bearings can slide back into place over the factory debris shields. The shields themselves looked horrid when they came off but they cleaned up pretty well. We shot them with some black paint anyway, just to make them a bit prettier. A lot of people ditch their debris shields when they do these conversions, but you have to be careful when doing something like this due to tolerance stacking.

Valuable Information: Rotor, caliper and saddle castings may vary slightly in thickness even after final machining. Additionally, the Vanco kit only has about 1/8" of clearance on either side between the saddle and the rotor faces, but this 1/8" is normally more than enough to prevent any interference. If the rotor and saddle are slightly thick, however, the elimination of the debris shield may shift your caliper saddle too close to the outside edge of the rotor and cause one to drag against the other. Either leave the debris shield in place or add spacers of the proper thickness in place of the shield.

It's good to be careful when re-installing the shafts: we gave the splines a once over and then Annabelle directed the shaft itself back into place. Andrew provided the motive power while safely off-camera because he thankfully had the foresight to not intercede into what has to be The Best Picture of Axle-Shaft Installation in The Entire History of The World, and because of this each and every one of you needs to send him a thank-you card. I bought mine earlier at Hallmark.

Once the shafts were in place we torqued in the 12-point flange bolts...and right about that time is when life got downright dangerous. Before we started seriously trying to injure ourselves, though, we had to have some manner of reference line scribed into place to help us know when we'd reduced the unit bearing diameter by the correct amount . To do that, I borrowed a trick from the painter's studio:

Notice the blurred wheel studs: the unit bearing is in in, "rotating." It's moving because we started the engine, slipped the t-case into four-high and let the clutch out slowly to see how we were looking. When there were no problems, I braced a torque wrench across my knee and the front arm of the knuckle and touched a Sharpie to the rotating surface in order to make a reference line. If you ever do this, here's a tip: it doesn't matter where the line is, exactly, because you're just using it as a visual guide to determine how much material has been removed. Speaking of material removal, let's address another concern, quickly:

Why We're Grinding The Unit Bearings: The hats of the new rotors do not allow a direct fitment onto the stock unit bearings because the interior of the rotor hat is just incrementally smaller than the exterior of the unit bearing diameter. In scientific jargon this condition is called "so d*** close that we shouldn't have to f*** around with it." However, "close" still didn't fit so the unit bearings would have to go under the knife. In the end we had to reduce the diameter of the unit bearings by close to 1/16". Now, several of you have probably already deduced that this particular cat can be skinned in more than one fashion. Thus, it's worth asking ourselves another question...

Question: Why are we doing such an incredibly f****** stupid thing? Can't this be done in a safe manner?!?!

Answer: Yes, it can be done in a much safer manner, but I'm overly obsessed with perfection at all the wrong times. You can perform the entirety of the surgery on the unit bearings without the axles turning under the engine's power: from either side, all you need to do is have someone manually turn the opposite hub, which thereby allows an equal and reasonably-accurate scribe/grind around the length of the unit-bearing's perimeter. Basically, you're creating a slow, manual lathe. However: I wanted mine as close to perfect as possible so we used Greta's axles like a built-in powered lathe and applied the marker to the rotating metal exactly as you would in a machine shop. Later, we applied the grinder in the same manner. Here's a close-up view of the scribing process...

And here's the completed reference line.

Remember that quip I threw in about people becoming the reason for warning labels? Right about this time the warning label on tractor driveshafts that says "Danger - Rotating Driveline - Avoid Entanglement" was going through my head. But the rotors weren't going to fit themselves, so...time to f*** up some metal.

Valuable Information: I've found that when I'm working with rotating stock it's often easier to look away from the area in which the tool is working because my eyes can get distracted by all the movement. Thus, I kept the grinder lower than the apparent horizon of the unit bearing edge, which consequently let me keep everything flat and perpendicular to the faces...and that can be a serious challenge when working with a flexible flap wheel. However, using a softer surface slows down the metal removal process - you're basically sanding it off rather than grinding it - and this helps you to not remove too much. Again, Savvy's suggestions prove to be exactingly accurate.

Here's a good view of the tool placement.

You'll also have to grind a bevel on the edge of the unit bearing face in order to clear a chamfer on the interior of the rotor hat. The grinder can get VERY close to the rotating wheel studs at this point.

We kind of overdid it here, but it's better take a bit more off at the bevel than risk an out-of-alignment rotor when we're working so hard to prevent one by grinding the unit bearings in such manner in the first place. This next view shows rotation and the proper angle of the grinder against the edge. 45 degrees is optimal...anything close will work. Also, shiny metal...

Removing the metal with a flap wheel - even a 40-grit one - is about a ten minute process...and the entirety of it is done in an uncomfortable position. You can tire rapidly, and working in this kind of situation is NOT something you do when you're tired. Annabelle took over when I stepped back for a quick break, and the result is about sixteen different kinds of sexiness all wrapped up in one picture...

I think she deserves a thank-you card, too.

That's all for tonight...but stay tuned. There's a lot more shiny metal where this came from.

If it's worth doing, then it's worth overdoing.

The Republic of Dave: Bringing you the finest in simian testing supplies.

The build, the gear, and the mileage: The Wasteland Survival Guide
Sundowner is offline  
post #306 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 09:02 PM
Registered User
2000 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Arlington
Posts: 2,726
Dear Annabelle,

I would just like to say that you are going a great job. If Sundowner didn't have you to help him he would probably never get anything done.

You are a great motivator. If you weren't there he would probably be sitting around playing video games and eating Chick-Fil-A spicy chicken sandwiches all day,instead of creating the shiny metal to post in his awesome thread.


You should consider teaching a training class for other Jeeper's wifes.
Attached Thumbnails
thank you.jpg  
Cuder is offline  
post #307 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 09:10 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The Republic of Dave
Posts: 6,408
Originally Posted by Cuder View Post
Dear Annabelle...

Also, to all the other un-addressed positive commentary thus far: my sincerest thanks.

If it's worth doing, then it's worth overdoing.

The Republic of Dave: Bringing you the finest in simian testing supplies.

The build, the gear, and the mileage: The Wasteland Survival Guide
Sundowner is offline  
post #308 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 09:47 PM
Registered User
1997 ZJ 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Florence/Clemson
Posts: 69
willman611 is offline  
post #309 of 8099 Old 04-15-2012, 11:40 PM
Registered User
1993 YJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 707
This thread redefines JF
hahaha so true.

Where do we send the cards? lol
I say we start a Greta/chicken sandwich support fund.

good **** man!!

The Toy:93 YJ
The DD:00 F250 7.3

Last edited by ThomasYJ; 04-15-2012 at 11:45 PM. Reason: PII redacted
ThomasYJ is offline  
post #310 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 12:49 AM
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Visalia
Posts: 40
Just read the entire thread twice! The second time was just as funny, enlightening and sexy as the first time... And I am refering to Greta.
Or am I?...

Can't wait for the weapons, I mean survival equipment, section...

Two things to remember gentlemen... Happy Wife, Happy Life and Build it, don't buy it!
CaptA-Stud99Tj is offline  
post #311 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 02:05 AM
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Anchorage, AK
Posts: 50
She's wearing an Hk hat while working on a jeep?

mother of god.

Loving the build man, really looking forward to the toolkit/gear writeup!
GoodasDead is offline  
post #312 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 04:24 AM
Registered User
1985 CJ7 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: White Springs
Posts: 9,494
I have to assign myself to the Remedial-LD group of viewers, unfortunately, but once I overcame the denial it wasn't hard to make this post! I could not find why you are turning the unit bearings. Is this due to the extraordinarily large calipers? sorry... sorry...

And I must add that watching a build conducted by someone who is knowledgeable and skilled, and has a plan, is one of the highlights of this forum.

Finally, Jeff Scherb (if you have not seen it), has a very good thread on building a trailer. In that thread he covers, in detail, creating negative molds, including the release agents he purchased to make his skins. Lots of pics. It could be relevant to your half-door idea.

Go Fish! <*////><

But the right word at the right time... "Hey, give me a little hug!" That's the difference between lightning and a harmless lightning bug!
Skerr is offline  
post #313 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 05:36 AM
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Cumming
Posts: 35
This is some good stuff!!!!

Thanks for all the good info and entertainment!

Oclvframe is offline  
post #314 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 07:48 AM
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Rosamond
Posts: 557
Great information thus far! As you mentioned there are many ways to do this install. My only suggestion is removing the rear driveshaft at the transfercase reduces the edge factor of sitting close to a freight train.
jermeyg is offline  
post #315 of 8099 Old 04-16-2012, 09:02 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The Republic of Dave
Posts: 6,408
Originally Posted by ThomasYJ View Post
I say we start a Greta/chicken sandwich support fund.
I don't think this is a crazy idea...I think this is a good idea, and as such I will support it.

Originally Posted by CaptA-Stud99Tj View Post
Can't wait for the weapons, I mean survival equipment, section...

Originally Posted by GoodasDead View Post
She's wearing an Hk hat while working on a jeep?
I've thought over situations like this for years, now, and there's really only one possible explanation: I must have been very, very good in a previous life.

Originally Posted by Oclvframe View Post
Thanks for all the good info and entertainment!
You're quite welcome!

If it's worth doing, then it's worth overdoing.

The Republic of Dave: Bringing you the finest in simian testing supplies.

The build, the gear, and the mileage: The Wasteland Survival Guide
Sundowner is offline  

annabelle , bewbs , chic-fil-a , custom , d&d , fallout , firefly , girly things , guns , half cab , hard tonneau , needs to go wheeling , overbuilt , photography , pin-up , sammiches , starwars , survival , wasteland

Quick Reply

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.

Email Address:


Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.

  LinkBacks (?)
LinkBack to this Thread:
Posted By For Type Date
glockforum | BoardReader This thread Refback 08-15-2012 09:17 AM
sears diehard batteries - forum communication | BoardReader This thread Refback 07-31-2012 07:50 AM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Jeep Forums Replies Last Post
go there engineering bumpers austonreeves Jeep Picture Requests 4 07-29-2012 09:54 PM
What makes yours a Survival or Wilderness Jeep? fishinjeeper Jeep Picture Requests 39 07-23-2012 12:02 PM
BOV/Survival Jeeps ttony Jeep Picture Requests 2 09-30-2010 04:47 PM
33 engineering bigj1974 Jeep Picture Requests 2 02-03-2008 08:28 PM
GRETA .... then and now GRETA97 Jeep Builds 6 05-05-2004 08:41 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome