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Savvy Aluminum Gas Tank SkidFOX IFP Shocks for 4" Lift TJ/LJ - Special!Jeep Gear & Install Packages!

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Unread 11-04-2013, 05:08 PM   #976
Sundowner
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Not to totally derail anything, here, but what do you guys think about the flat skid from Barnes? Apologies in advance if that's already been covered...

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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:01 PM   #977
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MO2500
The biggest killer is pointy or uneven rock ledges that point load the skid in the unsupported area, you can't prevent the perfect situation that will dent and bend pretty much any skid but if you can get more support across the middle and leading edge it will be much stronger.
That's the huge problem with going flat & maintaining the stock cat location. There's only about 1/2" of extra space in there. So there's really no room for a continuous stiffener. Especially if running the huge 42rle tranny & pan. I literally took that angle across as far as it would go. The end is literally less than 1/8" from the cat. Bending the short lip in front of the cat, I hope, will turn that pretty much into a continuous stiffener although slightly offset.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:08 PM   #978
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Lose or move the cat....it takes up too much darn space. No cat, no problem.

My old skid isn't very rigid but it held up surprisingly well....I could feel it 'spring' at times when on rocks but it always wound up straight. If I hadn't sold it to you, it would've received more rigidity.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:19 PM   #979
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imped
Lose or move the cat....it takes up too much darn space. No cat, no problem. My old skid isn't very rigid but it held up surprisingly well....I could feel it 'spring' at times when on rocks but it always wound up straight. If I hadn't sold it to you, it would've received more rigidity.
Yea, I can do that because we don't have inspections here, but need it to work with the stock cat location for people in other states that do & have to retain the cat.

I've got some plans for a crossmember/aluminum skid that will need to have the cat moved or removed. Might be on the winter project list.

We'll see how it does. I'm going to try to purposefully set it up for some big hits.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:21 PM   #980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundowner View Post
Not to totally derail anything, here, but what do you guys think about the flat skid from Barnes? Apologies in advance if that's already been covered...
A good start to a flat skid but lacking any serious bracing. I can't see it holding up to any hardcore wheeling without the addition of a full width center brace. It really offers nothing special except it's laser cut so you don't have to do the cutting and drilling part of building your own from a flat sheet of 1/4".

What adds a ton of strength to skids with 1"+ drops is the 4 edges folded up and welded in the corners. The biggest issues I see with making a perfectly flat skid plate that does not have separate cross members attached to the frame instead of just the skid plate is that there is nothing preventing bending right along the inside edge of the frame if there is no way to attach the center cross support and leading and trailing edge supports to the frame. It's just flat steel from the point at which the cross supports terminate to where they are bolted to the frame. You can solve this with separate crossmembers that attach to the frame rails and run full width but it's extremely difficult to do with a flat skid and only attaching the support to the skid itself.

I'm going to use this as an example to show you what I mean about all 4 sides being folded up and welded. Brand doesn't matter and I'm not stating my preference for one currently available brand over another, just the easiest picture I could find. However, dropping the skid an inch allows a full width crossmember that also welds on the ends of the channel, not just the front and back of the channel, helping to prevent the material from stretching and failing where there is no support.



My current flat skid has a full width crossmember supporting it on the trailing edge made from 3"x2" 3/16" thick that is also the mounts for my triangulated lowers. The middle and front of the skid is only supported by several pieces of angle. Well, you guessed it, the rear of the skid plate is as straight as can be and every where else is bowed and bent. I'm going to do my best to squeeze a rect. tube on the front edge this winter and re-do the angle in the middle to be mounted like "L" instead of like "^" after I straighten my bent to heck skid. I will even drop the skid plate an inch if I need to because I'd rather have the skid plate support the Jeep than having an extra inch of clearance and the trans or t-case getting damaged on a hard hit.



This is keeping my skid flat on the trailing edge.



After trip 1 before adding the UHMW



You can kind of see how bad the leading edge of the skid is bent here in the most recent pic I have. This is after I completely removed the cat, originally it was almost touching the skid and soon was dented itself from the skid bashing up into it where I didn't have support.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:49 PM   #981
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I've never been a fan of mounting angle like that for strength. My skid row engine skid is like that & is bowed pretty good.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 06:59 PM   #982
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Mounting angle in an "L" is a whole lot stronger. Just ask Eddie, or Besrk. They weld angle in an L on ships.

I did the "L" angle on my engine skid and it has taken a beating, and the skid is 3/16.

If I did what Mike was saying on the front of my skid all the way across, I wouldn't have had any issues with it bowing.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 07:04 PM   #983
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How is the bent lip running the length of the skid like the Barnes any different than a piece of angle running across the skid? The cat will have to move if you want flat and a full length runner in the skid. We will see how mine holds up to some hammers wheeling in two weeks. I still plan to add supports to my barnes, just seems to be a waste if you cant go from frame rail to frame rail.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 07:11 PM   #984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno6102
I've never been a fan of mounting angle like that for strength. My skid row engine skid is like that & is bowed pretty good.
I know, I was warned about it when I first built it and admit I was wrong to do it that way. However, that is not why the skid bent where it did. It actually has stayed pretty straight where I have the angle welded to it, it's really just everywhere else that is left unsupported that is bent
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Unread 11-04-2013, 08:01 PM   #985
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MO2500 View Post
A good start to a flat skid but lacking any serious bracing...
Excellent response; thank you. I was wondering about whether or not that bent lip would be enough, and if it would be compromised by not having a central support. I thought about running one of these with a separate crossmember; still considering it.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 08:58 PM   #986
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I have the UCF skid with bracing all way across and even it has suffered some minimal twisting that can be noticed (barely). I purchased this skid because of what mike is saying...even though its not completely flat it offers the most protection, also why I went with steel. To me, the trade off is worth it.

Honestly I don't expect my skid now to last the life of the jeep. It probably will but it takes the biggest beating every time I wheel.

Dan I think your skid will do just fine after a little more bracing and I like where your going with it. I think the completely flat belly is awesome, just not for me.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 10:31 PM   #987
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And that explains why I moved to the Savvy crossmember/skid setup.....that skid is fully supported. Lightweight to boot. I lost a little clearance but the gain in rigidity is worth it.
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Unread 11-04-2013, 10:34 PM   #988
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Ok I'm now motivated enough by this exhange to spend some more time bracing my skid. I've got tomorrow off and only a few errands to run. I've got some 3/16's channel I'm going to use and I'm going to get a full length brace running across the front of the skid ... I had an idea about reversing the cat hanger that I think is going to be the key. I do notice on your skid Mike that it extends about 5 inches in front of the first bolt hole. The Barnes and it looks like Danno's skid terminate much closer to the bolt. I only mention that because with less surface area the skid becomes more rigid. With the bent lip of the barnes, and a c channel brace front / rear / and down each side if that's not strong enough, I'll live with a bent up flat skid.
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Unread 11-05-2013, 04:10 AM   #989
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I'm just happy to have some good tech discussions in my build thread again.

Interested to see what you come up with for your reinforcement.

If I recall correctly the Modular Under Armor has no support along the front edge of the skid does it? They seems to be holding up well & they're 1/4" 6061.
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Unread 11-05-2013, 05:15 AM   #990
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno6102 View Post
If I recall correctly the Modular Under Armor has no support along the front edge of the skid does it? They seems to be holding up well & they're 1/4" 6061.
I thought it did have a support/brace in that position because that was part of how the engine skid attached; as Imped said, I thought it was fully braced...but that may only be the standard Under Armor and not the modular version.

Edit: Just looked at the photos again on Savvy's site and there are only two braces, so I stand corrected.
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