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Unread 03-02-2005, 02:15 PM   #1
Dctjwrangler01
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Complete new sound system and 8" Sub

I have a 2001 Jeep wrangler sahara that I want to upgrade all of the stuff in. Currently it has 5.25 adapter plates and xplodes along with 6.5" Xplodes in the soundbar. This is a Okay setup but everything can be better. It also has a pioneer head unit

1. What is a good 5.25 Speaker and 6.5" Speaker to go into my jeep Wrangler
2.What is a good 8" sub to go into the console
3.Can anyone make me a Custom box to fit in the console if I pay you money??
4.What wire color do I need 2 cut 2 make the stock sub in the console quit working. Its blown bad and sounds horrible
5.What is a good small amp that can power the 8" sub and where so I need to put it.

Thanks for all the help

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Unread 03-03-2005, 12:36 PM   #2
DanoTheGuru
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I've always liked all things infinty speakers. Rockford fosgate is my favorite amp and sub company. Alpine H/U's have always treated me nicely. Thats all just what I like, costs a bit though.
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Unread 03-03-2005, 12:56 PM   #3
SirGCal
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  1. Any brand that you like the sound of is a good brand for you. If you plan on running them with an external amp, the higher-end infinity, polk, boston acoustics, focal, etc are excelent. Otherwise, I'd stick with the lower power hungry (25-35W RMS needs) Pioneer or Kenwood type speakers.
  2. The JL 8W0 can fit, but so can any number of other 8" subs that work well in a .25 ft^3 sealed box and have as small mounting depth as possible.
  3. I could... but you don't want to pay me for it. (i'm pricy...) plus shipping would kill ya on top of that as MDF is really heavy... Plus, I won't have time for quite a while...
  4. Just take out the stock sub enclosure. Since you plan on replacing it anyhow, that will solve your problem for now.
  5. Xtant 1.1i is a sweet tiny little bugger... but pricy as heck too... Otherwise any 2-channel amp would bridge to a mono load. Look for a small one. (a mono amp will likely just be too powerful but if you can fine one, excelent.) Maybe the Clarion APA250 (100Wx1 @ 4-ohms). The catch really is going to be finding one small enough. Both of these amps for example really are overpowering for a JL 8W0.
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Originally Posted by SirGCal
If you can't take a nano-second to press shift/period/etc. and make proper sentences and paragraphs, I don't know if I can take a few minutes to respond to your topics... It doesn't have to be perfect by any means, but a little effort goes a long way.
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Unread 03-03-2005, 02:20 PM   #4
DanoTheGuru
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what are your thoughts on running a bigger than needed amp and turning it down a little? Cause I am thinking of getting a rockford 300x1 monoblock (m301) for that audiobahn and have heard that it could easily fry the sub if I didnt par it down, but since I just blew an amp and all, I kinda would prefer to have excess, subs seem to be cheeper than amps.... but I would prefer the advice of a proffessional so I dont spend too much without need
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Unread 03-03-2005, 02:32 PM   #5
SirGCal
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Well, if you overpower a sub, you run the risk of blowing it up. You can't really de-tune the amp with the gain controls. The amp will always amplify the input signal by X-factor (what ever it was designed for). The gain changes what it expects the input voltage to be. (this is why you hear professionals always yelling 'gain is not a volume control' and what not, and they are right...)

From my professional aspect, I have to say I do not recommend running any speaker above their rated power. Damage to both the amp and sub could result. (though damage to the amps now-a-days is getting more rare). However, professionals do it all the time and often people claim they work for years without trouble. The difference is how much overpowered, how loud they are really plaied (to how much continous power they physically recieve), and how they are controlled (how much distortion is let in.).

As for running an audiobahn overpowered, I wouldn't recommend it. They rate those things pretty close to their limit anyhow (as I've blown a few myself) and they aren't the highest-quality build around. But they are diecent and should last if you stay within their ratings. Also always remember to match up RMS values, not max. Max doesn't mean pookie unless your doing SPL comp and plan to have stuff last for seconds instead of years; And then you ignore the ratings anyhow...

For a perfect match, always try to match up the RMS ratings (don't forget to also matchup the resistances those ratings are used at.... VERY important if bridging multiple subs or using DVC subs for example...)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SirGCal
If you can't take a nano-second to press shift/period/etc. and make proper sentences and paragraphs, I don't know if I can take a few minutes to respond to your topics... It doesn't have to be perfect by any means, but a little effort goes a long way.
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Unread 03-05-2005, 11:50 AM   #6
TXST8tj
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yeah what sircal said is right on about overpowering a sub. i have blown three subs cause i was too lazy to buy a decent sub that was better power matched for my amp. the amp will run all day, but if the sub isn't properly power matched, it's gonna die.
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Unread 03-05-2005, 05:01 PM   #7
DanoTheGuru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SirGCal
The difference is how much overpowered, how loud they are really plaied (to how much continous power they physically recieve), and how they are controlled (how much distortion is let in.).

As for running an audiobahn overpowered, I wouldn't recommend it. They rate those things pretty close to their limit anyhow (as I've blown a few myself) and they aren't the highest-quality build around. But they are diecent and should last if you stay within their ratings. Also always remember to match up RMS values, not max.
For a perfect match, always try to match up the RMS ratings (don't forget to also matchup the resistances those ratings are used at.... VERY important if bridging multiple subs or using DVC subs for example...)

ok, well its an audiobahn natural sound D4ohmVC that says its rated at 550rms and I think 900 peak. My concern is that I have heard that rockford amps are more powerfull than they say they are because they run more amperage at the same wattage as other amps. I mean the 300rms is definatly not 550rms that the sub says it can handle, but I dont wanna fry it if it is 300rms with a 800rms amperage load. BTW these are things I have heard from my SPLisious roomate who has a boner for rockford (and from what I have heard his systems and the demos in stores sound its a valid boner). Hes also talking about the older stuff and says the newer stuff just doesnt have the same quality and oomph. I highly doubt that I will be listening the sub at more than 200watts rms EVER as my hears may just blow and I doubt my infinities running off the deck would not keep up. Would getting a 200watt monoblock be better and safer suited or is there another brand of amp that I should consider? I just fried that 2ch lanzar 400watt (ran a 2ohm load into a 4ohm stable bridge ) so I want to go monoblock and since my head unit and wiring is all rockford I figure it would be cool to keep with the theme and have the speakers be the exception. I got some time before my tax refund comes in (wont know how much I get till monday ) so I can take in suggestions and do some more research and stuff. I want to spend less than $200 if I can and I dont mind using ebay (which is how I can get a m301 for $150)
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Unread 03-05-2005, 06:13 PM   #8
SirGCal
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The M301 is an Alpine amp, (MRD-M301). Rockford might have made one but I don't remember one of that model number. The only 300W (depending on how they are wired) RF amps I can think of off the top of my head would be the P3001 (150x1 @ 4 ohms, 300x1 @ 2-ohms) or P6001 (300x1@4-ohms, 600wx1@2-ohms), They might have a few more but I don't have my catalog infront of me at the moment.

So your saying you have the AW1251SE subs? (Natural Sound 12") which hold 400W continously (RMS). Obviously, if you were going to choose between one of those amps for just one of those subs I'd get te P3001 (or the Alpine MRD-M301 would work nicely also at 350Wx1@2-ohms) and run it 300Wx1@2-ohms for that sub. It would be a nice setup.

Your friend wasn't lieing about older RF stuff. It was the shi#! Their newer stuff isn't bad either though, not by a long shot. (referring to their amps... Their subs are a little too SPL for my flavor...)

The amps won't feed more current to the speakers though; or that would be more power. For the basic part of Ohm's Law, power = voltage * current (or P = E * I). Voltage is what makes up the musical consruct. It's also what you adjust when you adjust the gain (hence, it's not a volume control). So what's left (on quality amplifiers) is current. A clean current source that can more than sustain the raised voltage levels of the amplified signal makes a clean amplifier. That doesn't mean it's going to force-feed your speakers more current though or they would be recieving more power. Alot of amps though do consume more power though to achieve this clarity and it is used in other circutry, or used up in the form of heat.

I would not worry about one amp force-feeding more current to your speakers than an equally rated amp. What I WOULD worry about is:
  1. the quality of the amp; is the amp going to provide my speakers with a CLEAN signal and power supply or a dirty one (cheaper tends to be dirtier... One of the things alot of people pay for are the cleaner amps which can be 2-4x the cost for the same amount of power)
  2. is the gain set correctly; it's not a volume control. You can't add/remove power the amp will supply. All it does is change the expected input voltage the amp recieves. Think of it as a line-input balancer. If correctly set, you shouldnt' hit amplifier clipping before 3/4" volume. (if not very near full volume, depending on the quality of the source unit)
  3. everything in between; The system is only as good as it's weakest link. If you have $100k in parts but use wal-mart wire 2-sizes too small to wire it all up. It will sound like pookie and will probably burn out before too long. NnF sais it alot and although I tend to think he overkills the overkill a little bit sometimes on extra extra large wires for small jobs, he does have one good point; going larger on wire NEVER hurts. (ok, accept maybe the wallet) If you want to be sure your amps are not going to be hungry for power and going to sputter on a high-current draw, you need to make sure your power wires are probably 1 size larger than they need to be; grounds also; upgrade the ground on the battery and the alternator to battery positive also. If it goes beyond that, a larger alternator is the next step. Caps are NOT power supplies. They are power filters. If you don't have the power needed from the alternator, they won't help. They only stabalize the power that you do have.

If those are all good and your components aren't junk, they should last quite a while, even with a fair share of weekend (or daily even) abuse.
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Sir G. Cal - 2k Sahara TJ

Living and loving on borrowed time. Life with Multiple Sclerosis. My MS/Life blog, Audio and Electronic write-ups, project how-tos, pictures, stories, and more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirGCal
If you can't take a nano-second to press shift/period/etc. and make proper sentences and paragraphs, I don't know if I can take a few minutes to respond to your topics... It doesn't have to be perfect by any means, but a little effort goes a long way.
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Unread 03-05-2005, 09:59 PM   #9
SurvCat
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i have an Alpine deck with 6 disc changer I am wanting to get rid of. It works fine but I want a factory CD deck. PM me if you are interested. $100+shipping
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Unread 03-07-2005, 07:49 PM   #10
DanoTheGuru
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thanks sirGcal, that put a lot of my fears to rest. I WAS also looking at the alpine amp, must have written down its number instead of the rockford, oops. I think I wanna go rockford though, I figure I will keep to a theme since I have the rockford HU and amp wiring(I got the second tier 8ga amp kit). All rockford source, cause, well, why not?
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'99 XJ
want to sell it! found I dont need 4wd and I'd rather something sportier and smaller, with at most half the engine.
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Unread 03-07-2005, 07:55 PM   #11
SirGCal
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Cool, let me know how it turns out. :-)
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Sir G. Cal - 2k Sahara TJ

Living and loving on borrowed time. Life with Multiple Sclerosis. My MS/Life blog, Audio and Electronic write-ups, project how-tos, pictures, stories, and more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirGCal
If you can't take a nano-second to press shift/period/etc. and make proper sentences and paragraphs, I don't know if I can take a few minutes to respond to your topics... It doesn't have to be perfect by any means, but a little effort goes a long way.
SirGCal is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
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