[OregonVette]

Originally Posted by czjeeper

....RE: the JK.... and I'm still waiting to see one off road around here (not saying you guys don't wheel), but if you want one I would probably get the 2 door. The 4 doors are monsters..

Correct, JK's don't wheel. None-of us know anything about Jeeps because we are all soccer moms. None of us owned Jeeps prior. We didn't upgrade because we all know that the 105 HP Yj is the best ever. A'men



Anyway... I would encourage you to take a stock JK rubi out for a hard wheeling and see just how capable they are. Or, listen to a few guys who have never actually seen a JK off road and just take their word
YouTube - Jeep JK Unlimted Rock Crawling Rausch Creek

YouTube - Jk @ The Badlands 8/11/07

YouTube - Jeep Rubicon JK

YouTube - Jeep JK Testing Snorkel

[-Zona-]

Originally Posted by czjeeper

Personally the JK doesn't do it for me, and I'm still waiting to see one off road around here (not saying you guys don't wheel)

Originally Posted by OregonVette

Correct, JK's don't wheel. None-of us know anything about Jeeps because we are all soccer moms. None of us owned Jeeps prior. We didn't upgrade because we all know that the 105 HP Yj is the best ever. A'men

Reading comprehension much?

[czjeeper]

Good grief fellow. Read my post completely before getting all butt hurt.
I said I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY WHERE I WHEEL (TSF in Oregon).
I know the JK Rubicon is very capable, but isn't my thing. Just too big and fancy for my taste.

[OregonVette]

Ha! I'm cool I'm cool. I love the "my jeep is better than your Jeep" threads. Guys get pretty opinionated and emotional about it.


Anyway... When it's time to upgrade from your Yj, I hope you give the JK a chance. You might agree like many of us former non-believers, the JK, stock out of the box is pretty friggin impressive. (aside from being underpowered)








In reality, I love the JKU because I now have a wife & 2 small kids. We're outdoor people. A LJ, Tj or Yj is out of the equation. But, if you're a young dude who still lives at home or single etc. The cheaper/used Wranglers will always make sense.

but for us, the JK is

[STW]

Originally Posted by SAMohawk

So say I had a stock TJ and a stock JK. Are you saying that it would take more work on the TJ (bigger lift, cutting, fabrication) to get to where the JK can get with a bolt on lift?

Originally Posted by OregonVette

yes

Just to be clear, it doesn't require cutting or fabrication to put a TJ on 35s. Just a good 4" lift kit will do that fine.
Not sure, but I understand that a JK can clear 35s with a spacer kit because of the way the body and wheel wells are designed, so OregonVette is right about it requiring a larger lift to clear 35s on a TJ.

That said, don't most JK drivers say running 35s on a spacer lift is a little inadequate, and a 4" lift is the best way to clear 35s on a JK too?

The other likely issues with clearing 35s--axle upgrades, drive-line issues, brake upgrades, steering upgrades--are pretty similar between TJs/LJs and JKs.

There are lots of good reasons to get a JK depending on what you like in a Jeep. The extra width inside is a plus for lots of people. I remember how tight side to side the TJ seemed the first time I drove one. I prefer it that way now, and wouldn't give up my TJ but I know it's an issue for some people. And the extra width on the outside makes the JK less tippy, and is an advantage on some trails (while being a hindrance for some people who want the narrower width--an advantage on some of my trails).

JKs are also finished inside more nicely. The extra room inside a JK is a useable difference even between the two short-wheelbase versions. Of course, having a four door makes all the difference for someone who needs a workable family car. My TJ worked fine for my children when small but required some patience, and is fine now they are big. But a four door makes it easy to put a kid in a child seat in back (not easy in a lifted TJ). One caution--unless they've fixed this, the way the pass. seat flips forward on the two door JK is limiting and makes it very diffcult to get into the back seat through the door. I tried twice and I'm 5'11, 180, agileand didn't manage it. By contrast, the TJ pass. seat goes forward well and makes it easy to get in the back. Jeep engineers overlooked this problem, assuming that people who actually needed to use the back seat would get the four door. My TJ's back seat's not there very often, but when it is, it's important for my passengers to climb in there easily.

We should all give thanks that the JK came out before the crisis of the last year, because it gave us a great continuation of the Wrangler. For me, it's too big and doesn't have what I like in the TJ, but wow am I glad the Wrangler is continuing (for now). If the JK hadn't been released, I bet the first thing to get dumped at Chrysler would have been the TJ. And if they were to try to re-vamp the TJ in the current auto climate, they'd have gutted it badly, whereas the JK is a totally competant, creditable, excellent Jeep that carries on most of the best things about the TJ and improves a few TJ things.

To me, (assuming new vs. used is not the main issue) the key difference in choosing between TJs/LJs and JKs is room and size.

A word on the Rubicon: If 35s and D44 axles are going to be enough for you, then the Rubicon (either TJ or JK) will save you a lot of trouble and money. Even if you found a non-Rubicon with a rear 44, you'd still need new gears and lockers whereas the Rubicon has great lockers, and the 4.10 gears will work with 35s well enough for you to take some time to decide if you want to regear. Some people like the 4.10s with 35s, but they are a minimum gear ratio for 35s, so with a non-Rubicon you'd definately be spending a lot of money changing gears. Then the t-case ratios on the Rubicon is a nice upgrade too. The Rubicon suspension parts you change out for a lift are the same as the regular TJ/JK suspension parts, so it's not wasting any special Rubicon stuff to lift it.

[Hussler]

Its sad the only SA jeep left is the wrangler. The era of the large off roading community is ending, cutting out many newcomers and people of a lower income. In 10 years a majority of the xj/zj/wj crowd will be gone limiting people to just buying wrangler which will raise the "used price" of wranglers to the point where "there wont be enough to go around."

[OregonVette]

^^ that's true. Hopefully (and by all accounts) the wrangler is still relatively affordable used (non JK). There is a sweet late 90's wrangler for 1599.00 near my house. It'd be fun to have a 100% dedicated off road jeep to mess around in.

[STW]

Originally Posted by hussler737

Its sad the only SA jeep left is the wrangler. The era of the large off roading community is ending, cutting out many newcomers and people of a lower income. In 10 years a majority of the xj/zj/wj crowd will be gone limiting people to just buying wrangler which will raise the "used price" of wranglers to the point where "there wont be enough to go around."

True. All the Suzikis Samis are gone. Those were the days when the TJ was the big vehical on the trail The FJ40s left around are so expensive they're mostly pimped out mall cruisers now (apologies to those still wheeling in FJs). To have a healthy off-road communitity, you need to have inexpensive trail-ready models that don't have many limits on being built large.

What else is there out there (available new) besides the JK?

[-Zona-]

That said, don't most JK drivers say running 35s on a spacer lift is a little inadequate, and a 4" lift is the best way to clear 35s on a JK too?

A 2.5" is the going height for 35s for a JK, I plan on going 3.25" however just for piece of mind.

[2006_Sport]

I don't get why people still question/hate on the JK. I love those damn things. I want me a lifted 4 door soft top on 35s....WIN, and i drive a TJ so what does that say?

[STW]

Originally Posted by 2006sport

I don't get why people still question/hate on the JK. I love those damn things. I want me a lifted 4 door soft top on 35s....WIN, and i drive a TJ so what does that say?

Didn't hear much hate on this thread--maybe I ignore it too easily now.
Prefering the TJ isn't hating the JK, though, if you're referring to me. The JK is a great Wrangler like I said above, with many advantages.

But if you're really asking, a couple reasons I prefer the TJ are the smaller size, and the flat sided body panels.

Guess that means I prefer small and flat over big and curvey. Ouch. That sounds like a mistake but works for Jeeps.

Neither has much to do with offroad performance, where TJs and JKs seem pretty even to me.

I could also give you reasons to prefer the CJ-7 over the TJ. Then reasons to prefer the Willys over the CJ-7. Every time they redesign the Jeep they make improvement, but good qualities are always left behind. Maybe the YJ is the only exception (apologies), but I'm sure glad we had the YJ too, because it continued and saved the Wrangler/basic Jeep, when consumer safety people and economic naysayers were calling for it to become extinct.

Willys, CJ, YJ, TJ, JK--like Goldilocks, you gotta pick the one that's just right for you.

[Axl Jack]

Originally Posted by czjeeper

Also, I read something about JK's going to IFS, so I would recommend you get a new one quick.

IFS? BLASPHEMY!

Originally Posted by OregonVette

We didn't upgrade because we all know that the 105 HP Yj is the best ever. A'men

Hey, hey now. 181 HP and 230 ft lbs torque. Quite powerful engine compared to other SUV's of the day. (Later on in the TJ it got bumped up to 190 HP and 235 ft lbs.)

[2006_Sport]

Originally Posted by STW

Didn't hear much hate on this thread--maybe I ignore it too easily now.
Prefering the TJ isn't hating the JK, though, if you're referring to me. The JK is a great Wrangler like I said above, with many advantages.

But if you're really asking, a couple reasons I prefer the TJ are the smaller size, and the flat sided body panels.

Guess that means I prefer small and flat over big and curvey. Ouch. That sounds like a mistake but works for Jeeps.

Neither has much to do with offroad performance, where TJs and JKs seem pretty even to me.

I could also give you reasons to prefer the CJ-7 over the TJ. Then reasons to prefer the Willys over the CJ-7. Every time they redesign the Jeep they make improvement, but good qualities are always left behind. Maybe the YJ is the only exception (apologies), but I'm sure glad we had the YJ too, because it continued and saved the Wrangler/basic Jeep, when consumer safety people and economic naysayers were calling for it to become extinct.

Willys, CJ, YJ, TJ, JK--like Goldilocks, you gotta pick the one that's just right for you.

Wasn't referring to you. In threads like this the JK gets TRASHED all the time.

[trw]

Originally Posted by 2006sport

Wasn't referring to you. In threads like this the JK gets TRASHED all the time.

thats because any Jeep that doesnt look like or resemble a CJ isn't a real Jeep square headlights, the modern departure of the JK.......

I love my CJ, but I also love the far better suspension on my YJ, EFI, better brakes, better frame, better LIGHTs (those old roundies will never match the light my squares lay on the road) hated the gokart tires and decreased ground clearance though, but it wasn't hard to fix that.....

The JK doesn't have those issues and the purists still slam it. It is totally beyond me. I know if I had a choice between a TJ and a JK, I'd get the JK in a heart beat, and if I could REALLY have any JK I would take a J8!

[BigOrange90YJ]

Originally Posted by trw

thats because any Jeep that doesnt look like or resemble a CJ isn't a real Jeep square headlights, the modern departure of the JK.......

I love my CJ, but I also love the far better suspension on my YJ, EFI, better brakes, better frame, better LIGHTs (those old roundies will never match the light my squares lay on the road) hated the gokart tires and decreased ground clearance though, but it wasn't hard to fix that.....

The JK doesn't have those issues and the purists still slam it. It is totally beyond me. I know if I had a choice between a TJ and a JK, I'd get the JK in a heart beat, and if I could REALLY have any JK I would take a J8!

amen